or you know, since it′s a single player game, just don′t care that others use mods and command screen and just make sure you yourself don′t use either, like me.

That is what I've been doing so far, but it sure isn't too rewarding at all; it's a bit frustrating, even. Such an ironman mode would allow many people not only more reasons to play the game (compete with friends/strangers, legitimately) but also allow them to take more pleasure in playing the game, knowing that they really are 'achieving'

something.

Again, this would allow people more reasons to play the game, play it more often, and enjoy it as it should be enjoyed; without cheats and the sort, as well as compete with other people. The satisfaction from multiplayer games, for example, is quite hefty due to knowing that no one can easily cheat (if at all), so you can actually compare yourself to them, or at least know that what you have achieved in the game is regarded as being legitimate.

yeah I think this would be classed as a niche issue and well, a game dev can′t satisfy everyone.

I know more than a few people who would not consider this a 'niche' issue. Achievers are a good portion of players (have a look at the huge number of farming/grinding MMORPG players that simply want to be the best, or be amongst the best); I'm sure there are PLENTY 'achiever' players that play Fallout 4, or would be inclined to play it if this were implemented. You do not seem to have any real reason to be opposed to such a feature being implemented into the game, other than you thinking that 'not enough people would benefit from it'. I'm more than certain that it would give Fallout 4 a whole other dimension to it, simply improving the game as a whole. I only see positives, and no negatives to such a feature being put in game. Would you be so kind so as to outline how this would not go great with Fallout 4?

I don't bother with Iron Man runs. Some people dig that, not my bag. I just play the game, with mods or without, it really depends on which route grants me the enjoyment I'm looking for.

I'm not looking to achieve anything, or prove anything when I play games. I just wanna play the game.

But as St. Markiplier once said "You do you, I do me, and we don't do each other."

the time and effort beth could put towards other things? *shrug* games finish so it would have to be some post launch path, something I rather see them use to fix bugs.

And that is the way you play games, and of course I respect that. And so does my suggestion. It would not take that away from you, would it? Besides, as you (pretty much) said, different strokes for different folks. Why not include more types of gamers into Fallout 4, as long as it does not clash with other types of players' gaming styles. I'm pretty sure the settlement managing and trading thing did not have to be implemented; but it was, in order to allow F4 to be more complex, and appeal to more people, while not forcing everyone to go through that part of the game if they did not so wish. Thus, this increased the appeal of the game to more people, while not decreasing it for anyone else.

And in fact, everytime I've played Bethesda games such as F3, FNV, Skyrim, etc, at first I played with complete disregard to the console, or modding or 'achieving'. I merely played for the storyline and gameplay. But afterwards I returned, aiming to achieve as much as possible with no cheats or mods that offer unfair advantages. Including such a feature would give more replayability to F4, simply put.

I doubt Beth cares about that at all. I'd hope they wouldn't waste unnecessary resources for something like that. Is it an exclusivity thing? Like you want a pat on the back for not using any "cheats"? And when do you think you'd get this achievement? After the main quest or after you 100% the game? I'm not even sure if that's possible

Fair point; however, Bethesda has shown they are in possesion of plenty of resources, including so many various game features (trading/base building/extremely in depth crafting system/salvage system). Such a feature is simply not all too difficult to implement. I, of course, do not understand the complexities of making F4 from the ground up; I just know that in most cases, such a feature really wouldn't be too hard to implement, and should not have a reason to give rise to other bugs.

Eh I'm not against the idea if people want to do it. I'm not in the market of telling people what's the pure or right way to play. Some people wanna run around in these games as an anime magical girl wielding a Fat Man. Some people wanna be rough and tumble gunslingers. It's all good.

For this idea, if it's just a toggle option, as the old saying goes "It's good to have options". I may not choose to toggle that, but it's the same as you said with settlements. If people don't want to build a settlement, they don't have to.

Freedom of choice is always something I'm for.

I think you've missed the point of the Fallout games. Achievements are for the real world, this is just a game. Have fun.

I wouldn't want achievements to be completely disabled (such as steam achievements). If you talk about the leaderboards, your 'designated' savegame would appear on the leaderboards whenever you want it to, as long as the game has not been modified, and the save game is in ironman mode, encrypted, and not tampered with not even once.

I do think it quite simply adds another layer to the already complex game that F4 is, without a huge amount of effort (not really that much effort would have to be put into such a feature) on the developers' part. I know for a fact that I, and plenty of friends, feel like their 'grinding' and 'farming' of fallout would be ever more enjoyable if we could somehow prove the save game actually was 'legitimate'. Not necessarily that it brings 'exclusivity' or a self-pat on the back; just an extra, nice feeling as you cruise the wastelands, excelling at the game, enjoying the story and the gameplay, WHILE HAVING SOMETHING TO SHOW FOR IT. To be that would be quite amazing; Crusader Kings 2 and Europa Universalis IV keeps me coming back because I know that I am, in a way, achieving something, even though I have no one to show my save file, or brag about to.

*snickers* yeah, number one rule when talking about game development, never claim anything to be easy or not too hard to implement.

Also because you feel like it′s not a niche thing (and frankly, there is isk ya bias on the subject) doesnt mean it factually isn′t niche, so maybe when ya can show us a petition with a few 1000 names on it as a fact, it kinda easty to just say it′s not niche.

Indeed; why not allow the game to appeal to more people without infringing on anyone else's ability to enjoy the game? There are many people, such as MMORPG players, who enjoy having something to 'show' for after dozens of hours of playing the game.

This statement brought up something to me that I've been pondering about for a few years now.

Back in my day...yes I'm an old man...Back before youtube and whatnot, Video Game magazines ran spots in the back where gamers could submit their high scores, with photo evidence granted, of certain games. We now live in an age of Youtube, and Let's Plays where people can post up their runs and epic moments and share...almost everything with the rest of the gaming populace.

There is indeed a growing desire, it seems, to want, and desire, something to show for what we do in games now, something they can show and go "Look what I did, look what I have, I earned this". And I'm not sure if I agree with it. Then again, I just play the games. They make it, I play it, I go on with my day.

Well, guess I'll have to get started on these forums with that, then. I know I've talked to many people, and they certainly would give such a feature a go, and to some, such as myself, it would make a world of a difference, and to everyone, it would add in another entire layer of gameplay and 'objectives' for the sandbox F4 is (achieveing), without forcing anyone to go with it, without taking away from the fun of people who play exactly opposed to the way such a feature would allow someone to play.

And again, it still would be a nice thing to go with the actual game; knowing that the dozens of hours you sunk in the game mean something more than just the pure exhilarating fun you've had with the story and gameplay, but that it also amounts to some kind of achievement. And yes, I cannot possibly assume 100% it would be easy to implement (as I had already stated); but objectively thinking, it shouldn't be hard to implement (at least, having followed EUIV and CK2 development; even though they are, indeed, very different games).

I suppose it's because many people do sink in a huge amount of hours in games. Even though they do tend to have plenty of fun by doing it, having something to 'show for it' and to go with it in the background really is just a nice idea for everyone. Don't like it, don't use it, either; like it, and be even more in love with F4, adding to the large pool of die-hard fans of the Fallout franchise.

Likewise, not everyone has high end i7 processors (or even desktops, really, or the internet connection) to record, and upload on youtube immense walkthroughs, etc. It would take an immense amount of effort to render the videos in the first place; besides, it would still not offer any real legitimacy as it would not 'protect' against cheating, modding, etc.

Leaderboards? What? Have you played a fallout game?

Please, keep the replies constructive and helpful for the debate

So you want a mode in the game where modding/console commands are disabled and there is some sort of online leaderboard for you to tout your "skills"?

No offense, but this is a pretty ridiculous thread. For one, BGS games are about the single player experience. You make the game what you want. This isn't an competitive online multiplayer with e-sports. This isn't an MMO. It's just a sandbox where you can do what you want when you want in it.

I find it odd you need to have some sort of way of showing to the world how much of an "achiever" you are. That's why "achievements" exist, plus I was under the impression a sense of achievement was a personal feeling and not one you have to shove down other gamer's throats.

Also, BGS games, even on the highest difficulty, are incredibly easy. Not to mention there is always a build or way of playing that is game breaking. I guess I just don't really understand the point of where you are coming from. You don't have to mod or use console commands. BGS games are a private experience. Why do you care what others do? Why do you care that others know what you have done? It's just a game in the end.

Well, also another bit of nostalgia, back in the way, Atari (And Colecovision, I think) would award players with patches, like for jackets, for submitting a ranked score. I believe this was historically the first Video Game Achievement.

Show me the raw proof Bethesda had when they including trading posts, settlement building, and the sort. None. They just wanted to appeal to more sorts of gamers. And they did. This would too.

You have not read plenty of my replies, it seems.

There would be no shoving down anyone's throats one's skills necessarily; this would be mostly to accompany one having fun with the game, but having some sort of achievement out of it in the way that they know the dozens of hours they invested in the game were not just for fun, but also for something additional. Again, it would appeal to the 'achiever' sort of person, and appealing to a wider range of players is clearly what Bethesda wanted to do with F4. And the current achievements can be unlocked with actual mods that unlock them in less than a second. Or if not, you can easily cheat your way to achieve all achievements.

Either way, steam achievements are barely any achievements at all; they are very superficial. Again, such a feature would 1) add another layer of complexity to the game in that people could play in order to battle on the leaderboards 2) would not take away from anyone's fun 3) would appeal to more people 4) allow for more replayability in the way of, say, grinding and 5) objectively does not seem a feature that would take any serious amount of effort on Bethesda's part.

This would ENCHANCE one's ability to enjoy their own achievements, and be willing to sink ever more hours into the game.

Again, it's not so much about 'beating someone else at grinding' or on the leaderboards or whatever; that should be more of a side thing for those that would enjoy it, or if you get bored and want that to be your game objective. It would be a way to legitimize the hard work and dozens of hours you sunk into the game.

Um...Leaderboards in a Fallout game?

I'm with Redguard King on this one.

Agreed, if I had fun in a game session that's enough for me. I don't care about having something to show for it. I play games for fun, not to stroke my ego. Mind you this might be me never giving a damn about what anyone thinks.