Bad argument, just a complaint about acronyms in names. I'm a little late to the game so I can't complain much. If a moderator reads this lock it up or something. Does not apply much.

But we have this>>>http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Tes4Mod:Acronyms

/thread

All I can say is... LOL


Acronyms are part of the modding vernacular..... they are not going anywhere.

Voted no and no because your post comes across as one big whine. If you rewrite and restructure it to make it more informative and easier to read (like you seem to want us to do!), it might help your case. ATM (=At The Moment) it looks like something just asking for "tl;dr".

EDIT: Oh, and this:


Nope, I'm pretty sure it is all about me. I don't mod for other people. The only thing I do explicitly for the advantage of others is help maintain the BOSS masterlist. Everything else I do is just because I enjoy doing it, and you just happen to reap benefits.


Chances are this is a partial reference to me (and HTF, Max Tael, Halo, Arthmoor and Brumbek). Thanks, but see the above.

EDIT: Hmm, today must be my grouchy day. Second such post... Oh, and my sig contains an acronym - but that's because gamesas's signature limits are ridiculous. I had to cut out half my links to my stuff to add that message about BOSS.

@camaro-69_327
Thanks for this site, but that is like make a dictionary for acronyms, dictionaries are for words.

@Pluto
I realize they're not going anywhere, and I never said stop using them (well I did sort of) I just want full names in titles, it's like a speed limit sign .

If you look at the first few pages here you can see this is already being Done.....?

Most give the Full name AND the Acronyms.

:rolleyes: A really good way to introduce yourself to the community.

I guess you should do some reading before taking the step into modding your game, or your going to be totally lost.

Yep, I didn't understand most of the ones you mentioned so cant help with the yellow triangles


This is so that users can install it the way they are used to - Quite a few mods come as zips which a user can either install manually (extract it first and follow instructions), OR install as a BAIN (Wrye Bash installer), OR import into OBMM which will automatically make an OMOD out of the archive if it contains OMOD conversion data ..

So you might want to read the readme for OBMM which tells you about this. :whistling:


Watch the comments on a single mod for a while, and how infuriating impatient users can be to the author who has already put many hours into creating the mod. And now feels a duty to help solve all users problems ... The description is more often than not a collection of best practices for that type of mod, and in its own way an attempt to reduce the amount of the same questions going around in circles because people cant be bothered to read all the good advice there.

So you wanting a short description will make the author have to attend the same old questions over and over for new users who have not read a couple of thousand pages of comments.


Good idea, we also have FAQs ( Sorry - Frequently Asked Questions ) http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/449239-oblivion-mods-faq/
That one is stickied at the top of the page you started this topic.

Or here http://tesivpositive.animolious.com/

A lot of work has been put in to helping people new to the subject.

In before the lock!


Welcome to the internet, zyther. People use acronyms because (*gasp*) they're easier to type. Who wants to write out the entire name of a mod when you can use a handy (and shorter!) acronym that everyone understands? Mods like Oscuro's Oblivion Overhaul and Mart's Monster Mod have been around for years, so 95% of mod users know what OOO and MMM mean. And for those who don't, we have the link Camaro posted. Which is a glossary, not a dictionary.


As far as OMODs, read the manual. An OMOD conversion data file is a text file with a set of instructions that tells OBMM (excuse me, Oblivion Mod Manager) where to put the files. Occasionally a mod will have several options, in which case it will tell OBMM to pop up a window for the user to choose one or more of said options. The way OMODs work, they must be organized the way they are - in separate Meshes, Textures, etc., folders, along with the OMOD Conversion Data. It's not all that hard, if you know what you're doing.

As the author of the PAVM and SMO, I voted no on both accounts. Furthermore I think wrinklyninja summed it up quite nicely.

Nope, I'm pretty sure it is all about me. I don't mod for other people. The only thing I do explicitly for the advantage of others is help maintain the BOSS masterlist. Everything else I do is just because I enjoy doing it, and you just happen to reap benefits.

Lol there are how many people out there? How many people okay Oblivion? It's not about you, sure you made the mod, and I like it, and you get all the credit, but without me there is no credit. What's the point if you get a million dollars if no one will sell you anything? Bad thing is there is always someone who will sell you something, and always someone to make a million dollars. But really if you made my mod, oodles to you !

Horse pucky. Complaints make people defensive and mad.


There's no money going around here. And there's not really any fame either. Some of us here are nice to each other. And some of us show up on the forums often enough to get recognized and have somewhat of a pleasant and friendly back-and-forth. Who gives a fig what you say or don't say?

With an attitude like this I'm sorry that there's no way I can't block you from obtaining some of the mods I'm involved in.
Let me make this quite clear. Modders don't make anyone download their work. That's a personal choice for the user. They do not get paid, and certainly don't expect abuse from a novice user.

I think this one's gone far enough. I'll ask a mod to lock it up.

Whining threads are BAD (Thread makers please read)

You seem to be entirely missing the point. I don't care about credit, or money, or fame, or kudos, or favours or anything that might give me an edge in society. I mod because I enjoy it. Nothing else matters. Your praise or condemnation mean nothing to me, besides a small ego boost or drop, and I'm perfectly capable of inflating and deflating my ego as required myself.

Of course, that's rarely a successfully-applied strategy for life in general, but I'm not here to argue philosophy, and I think it's probably the best mindset a person can have for approaching a hobby.

That's not to say outside influence does not exist - I frequently ask for opinions on my work, but that's more to do with skills development than hobbying, it's about market research and communication. Same for writing readmes - I think writing clear, concise documentation for products is a valuable skill, and modding in groups helps my teamworking skills. So modding is a combination of a hobby and some skills training, because I like efficiency.

@Shikishima and gothemasticator

Lol, I know there is no money or anything going about, it's an anology of the producer, and consumer. Mod to mod user and such. The point is there is always someone willing to make, and someone willing to take. The whole point is that it didn't revolve around him (wrinklyninja) because he let other people than just him use it. If he chose to, which he did. I honestly would play the game with or without fancy weather. I paid money for the game and I enjoy the game. The mods that you mod maker people make is all up to you, so is If you let the public use it. But just because you made it, does not mean there is not a hundred other people with the capacity and the will that would have made it if you wouldn't have. All of it is just criticizing the way he looks around at other people, he can either read it and take it to heart, reject it, or ignore it, for better or for worse. Not criticizing the work he has done of course.

If you had spent half the time it has taken to write whiny and "philosophical" posts about acronyms reading up a bit instead you would know half of them already.

There aren't a hundred other people who would have done it.

You should take your own advice and just play the game without mods if the way mods are "handled" (little CB humor there) bothers you.

I read this as rather rude, and quite frankly insulting. Like wrinklyninja mentioned, we mod because we enjoy doing it. It's something we do in our own time, at our own pace, when we feel like it. I took the time to make a mod, and I chose to upload it for others. I make the effort to maintain a decent readme, I list the requirements on my mod page, and I try to help people who are having difficulties; and so do most other modders out there. For new mod users, yeah, the learning curve is pretty steep. But there is SO much out there to help you get started, and there is so much out there to help build up your knowledge for more advanced mod installations. It is not our job to make sure we hold your hand through the process of installing our/other mods, we do this voluntarily. If I took the time to make a mod, the least you can do is take the time and effort to learn how to install and use it and other mods.

OK, I'm getting roped in here, but this is too much fun.

Your anology of the producer and consumer does not apply. A producer-consumer relationship is a symbiotic (or close to) relationship in which both parties benefit from the relationship in different but equally important (from each participant's point of view) ways. A producer trades goods of some sort for goods of another sort with the consumer. There are no true pure producers or pure consumers in that respect, because the consumer also has to produce something so that they may trade it. The trading is driven by greed - to trade you have to want something you don't have. Otherwise it's charity, and even that is rarely altruistic. The most common example to use is our modern economic transactions. A producer creates something. Potential consumers then individually value that product against their own produce, and offer a trade of what they believe is a value difference beneficial to them (ie. the product they receive is more valuable than the product they give). The producer does the same, and they meet at an equilibrium of value somewhere between the two offers. A trade is successful, with one party gaining net value and the other losing net value or both parties experiencing no net change in value. Generally the consumer's traded product is money which they have 'earned' as a result of a successful transaction between themselves and another party, trading their time and effort for some money, which holds value for them. Money is just a stand-in for actual wealth that requires people to believe it has value for it to have such. A billion pounds on a remote isolated desert island isn't worth anything, but the same in the city can be used to gain a great deal.

Since you seem to be talking about me, I'll use my specific case as the counter-example to your anology. I'm clearly the apparent 'producer', I make the mods, and you're the 'consumer', using them. I expend time and effort creating the mod. I then expend further time and effort documenting it, packaging it and uploading it to a site where consumers may download it. In my mind, the mod and the feelings it induces in me justifies the expense - the mod is already worth all the costs creating it had. I didn't go into creation costs in my last paragraph, so ignore that bit for fairness. Anyway, I have a mod, and you want it. I give you my mod, and you give me feedback, and more users by advertising it if you like it, or less users if you don't. So, you find my mod valuable enough to expend the time and effort to download it, at least. I, however, don't find your feedback worth anything. Even more basically, no trade takes place. You are not required to give anything. I don't expend any effort per user in giving them the mod - they in effect just take it from me. Furthermore, my mods require no users. There is no market force that requires trading to take place. Oh. Your anology fails.

tl;dr: I have what you want, and you have nothing I want. No trading can take place. My modding is an act of charity by definition, not a producer-consumer relationship.

(If the arguments I used are a bit patchy it's because I've never studied philosophy or economics and I do not pretend to be a practitioner of either field. If it helps, it made sense in my head. )

And in answer to the rest of your post, I never claim to be uniquely capable of making the mods I have made: to do so would be to induce supreme irony. After all, of the 10 or so projects I have been involved in, only 3 are of my own inception (Cava Obscura, Enhanced Seasons and the Environment Mod List), and of those only Enhanced Seasons contains what is original work, to the best of my knowledge.

I agree that acronyms in this community are a real pain. It makes it hard to get started, hard to understand what people are on about becuase they don't use the acronym as the title. If you are going to use a acronym at least make sure it is Googleable. Some example from Morrowind are escog and mlox that are both high if you google them and are used as the titles on Planet Elder Scrolls/Nexus.

As a user that doesn't have a clue what you authored or what it is about, or couldn't find it on Google, congratulations.

Now every small mod needs an acronym because I assume popular mods have them. So now when people refer to some 3 letter acronym they expect me to understand what it is.

Oh. And don't get me started on people using acronyms in topic titles.

Hint: they were all in his sig.

(I don't have signatures or avatars turned on)

Well without sounding horrible, that's your loss. Generally signatures are pretty useful areas for modders to advertise their mods.