Thank you all for coming. I've set out some lovely mint tea and watercress sandwiches for everybody. Just be sure to use a napkin.

Bathroom is down the hall, third door on the left.

*Ahem*

So, Ald Cyrod is Weird Cyrod, no? Gone but not long forgotten - still alive, Out There in the wide womb of uncreated night, fluttering daintily like finger poems in mirrorfog, like dandelion whim-whispers on the pulsing clockconstant wing-ticks of zeroth witchmoths. Facial-inked, cosmopolitan Nibenay; Laconic, housed-in-hauberk Colovia. Where Cyrod'lcity encloses the Rumare, and most the land is endless jungle.

Dare I say then that Nu Cyrod is Bleh Cyrod, the themepark Gondor with none of the above, just sluice-watered, decaying Nibenay and posh, idyllic Colovia, all in exalting orbit of a common center of vaguely-Freudian whitewash, yes?

Nice to see you, thanks for invitation.
Have you heard about Nuke Cyrod? And somewhere were amazing country of Cow-low-via.

Yea, Ald Cyrod! Where the fringes of the Market District wore a gilded sabre-cat pelt as light penetrated the luscious lips of the jungle canopy and scuttled across the stone streets like love-sick Kwama, or was it moth larva? I never can remember!

Well I say chap, righ' proper spread you've got there, wot, I don't mind if I do nibble a sandwich or three. Terribly welcomin' of yeh, just horribly hospitable.

I musff say, though, that I can' think you'ff told us much we haffn't known for righ' nigh on haff a decade. Nu-Cyrod's been an unworthy Eyesore from its very inception. So state your objective, wot! Is it some new scintilla-sculpture yer seekin', by chance? Got a good start on that 'un yer own self.

Bleh Cyrod? If you're referring to late (very late, this is) Third Era Cyrodiil, that is done with. Gone, or at the very least going way. Hopefully forever. Already some Cyrodiils use war paint, or tattoos, that are very similar to what Nibenese used to use. Colovia has been ruined, you see.

While a tragic event, this may bring back it's old spirit. So long as the moral isn't completely destroyed by the elves. And as always, the east absorbed the Dunmer of Cheydinhal into their culture, taking much from them.

We try to deny it in Colovia, but we often absorb foreign cultures too. To a lesser extent than the Niben, of course.

I found a painting of Cyrod-ut-Ruma, looking like space age Angkor Wat. I sent it to Merry Eyesore and asked if it was "hot or cold."

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/15980491/images/1313685156029.jpg

I always imagined the buildings looking close to what Oblivion had, but much more colorful: mostly reds, oranges, blues, and purples* (much of my view on Cyrodiilic style comes from Redguard, from the banners and armor of the Legion), built atop white Ayleid ruins. And more islands and canols. But maybe that is because I played Oblivion first.

* For the rich. Most people get small, wooden (or perhaps brick) houses that are obscured, from a distance, but the mansions of the rich merchants and nobles.

I like Nu Cyrod. I thought it was a much more subtle and realistic culture than the depiction in the PGE.

Not to mention, Nu Cyrod has been the norm since Arena, as far as the games are concerned. Just look at the imperial architecture and clothing in Morrowind.

Could someone give me the quick rundown on what Nu-Cyrod was like?

Good painting, but it's no Cyrod.

I believe Saint_Juib is referring to the Cyrodiil we saw in Oblivion.

Though NPCs in those towns compare the architecture to High Rock as opposed to Cyrodiil.

But yes, aside from a few mentions of a jungle and merchants, Morrowind did partially reject "Ald" Cyrod. People forget this, and I will not be surprised if it's one of the reasons Bethesda made Cyrodiil the way we saw it in Oblivion. Most were not Pocket Guide readers: all Cyrodiil represented was Rome and England. It would still shock a lot of Morrowind veterans.

I don't personally agree with the decision, but I can't hate Oblivion. It brought me into the series.

That's my gist, too.

Nucyrod says http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1327271-return-false/page__st__30__p__19989308#entry19989308 to me. I just call what we saw in Oblivion "Cyrodiil."

Sorry, yes I am talking about Cyrodiil as it was presented in Oblivion. I was under the impression from the OP that that's what we were talking about. If I'm mistaken, then don't mind me

*slinks off into the shadows*

Yer on the right page then.

I can't respect the opinion of someone who enetered the series with Oblivion, but insists people who first played Morrowind would be shocked by a jungled Cyrodiil. I mean, maybe shocked was the point. Regardless, you're talking out your ass.

Based on the in-game depiction, I think he means. Aside from a couple references buried in dialogue or in books to a jungled Cyrodiil, there's very little in-game to support that conception. Arena depicted it as forested and medieval, and Morrowind showed their clothing (though not armor, I'll admit) as being more reminiscent of 15th-century Italy than ancient Rome. To say nothing of the medieval European aesthetic of the Legion Forts and thatched-roof cottages. Unless the entire Imperial population of Vvardenfell, Mournhold, and Solstheim was from the Colovian west (Ok, the last one, I grant, is likely), it seems to me that the weirdness of Nibenay was only ever the fanciful artistry of the author of the PGE. Given that the average player doesn't hang around on these forums and has never read the PGE, it would have seemed to be something entirely from out of left field.

I always thougth that "jungles" mean not only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungle, but also simply "dense forests", "thickets". Difference between Valenwood jungle and Cyrodiilic jungles is huge. It was demonstrated in the "A Dance in Fire".
For example:
You see the contrast between Valenwood and Colovia?

Be nice. Oblivion was my first, too.

Ald Cyrod is at stake!

Ald Cyrod is dead.

But it lives on in our hearts

/cornball

No one's truly inspired by that abortion, except out of horror of it. The Eternal Fires rest with Ald Cyrod.

There's definitely some merit to this point; judging from Morrowind's surface portrayal of Imperials, you wouldn't think that they resembled much of anything in the PGE1. But, it's odd: I came in with Morrowind, reading the books in game but not too seriously, forming all of my impressions on in-game material - but I was still somewhat disgusted with Oblivion, once the initial glamour of the thing wore off. I hadn't read either of the Pocket Guides until last year, but the portrayal of Cyrodiil in Oblivion was still dissatisfactory. I don't know - perhaps its not so much what angle Beth chose to portray as how they chose to accomplish it. In other words, it simply lacked enough depth to make it enduringly captivating. Or perhaps it was just that there wasn't really any give and take between otherworldliness and more stock fantasy the way there was in Morrowind.

As for Nibenay: Colovia is described as the backbone of Cyrodiil. I'd assume that much of the Legion is Colovian, in culture if not blood. And aside from the Cult and the E.E. Company, all you see in Morrowind is the Legion.


That book took place after the "I do this for you, Red Legions, for I love you,", though, yes?
But still, I take your point.

Never mind.

Oh, it's undoubtedly an unfinished game. We can thank enforced release dates for that. Scrapped political questline resulted in a nonexistent elder council and an entire city being stricken from the map, abandoned Radiant AI led to lobotomized NPCs, terrible file compression meant pretty sparse spoken dialogue. Even the inaccuracies in Camoran's speech were from Bethesda using a rough draft of his speech, supposedly. It's unfortunate, but Sutch is life (ba-dum psh!) in the business world sometimes.