Phht, that's why you download the "Extra Hotkeys and Spell Delete" mod.

You have two hands with two different spells and you can put a couple of effects on the enemy.

There's your experimentation.

I completely agree, which is why my argument is (and always has been) enchanting may allow you to do this in some manner. Don't count your chickens before they hatch; as they say.

From what I've seen, the new spell system does have a lot of options and has the potential for customization via perks, enchanting, magic pool, guardian stones. I think if done right these can add a lot to the magic system. In addition, I forsee there being some method of creating a custom spell, just not in the traditional sense.

What about Console only players, you have to think about them aswell, in (nearly) every comment i make i take them into consideration, heck, when describing controls i use Consoles for that, even though i only play on the PC.

I'm sure it depends on mana pool

and the pure fact that spells now can be combined, get 2 equipped at the same time, and have alternate uses just makes the lose of spell making acceptable

I'd guess you're right, my Labanon based friend - your English is definitely better than my Lebanese!

Oblivion had fire damage, as touch or range.

Skyrim has fire damage as a flamethrower spell, fireball and fire traps, and those are just the fire spells confirmed in the demo, 150 spells will be in the game, not all different, but many more then oblivion ever had.

Think of it this way, instead of buying a low level version of every spell, and just making more powerful versions that look the same and do the same thing, you now have to search for spells from tomes and trainers. Also there are more unique spells like clairvoyant, and perks added on to spells to improve them in some ways (like making lighting bounce off walls, confirmed in the 30 Audio).

Overall skyrim is shaping up to have better magic then oblivion. I'd also say morrowind but then some nostalgia-tard would whine about recall and levitation.

I agree with what seems to be both sides of the discussion. I won't miss making stronger fireball spells or heal spells if we can control this through holding down the fire buttons. Same outcone right? But I will miss buying a touch spell and being able to make a range spell, unless they are all usable at all ranges. And i will miss adding a little paralysis to a lot of poison over time effect for instance. That sounds hard to do with trigger controlled combinations.

In your opinion, maybe. But for a lot of people it is not acceptable, to replace the ability to make custom spells with a dual wield option. Its nothing more than a gimmick when you have to remove good features to make it work. A gimmick to attract people like you, who care not about the rpg elements that require any level of focused thought because you would rather play an action game to supplement your ADD. Then go play an action game. Dont come in here and speak for us all. Leave if you dont care about spell making, there is nothing valuable you can add to this discussion.

Interesting and varied spells, spell effects, and spell combos, with no customization, certainly seems more interesting than...


Fire, touch, 10dmg x 3 sec
Fire, touch, 20dmg x 5 sec
Fire, target, 30dmg x 5ft
Fire, target, 50dmg x 0ft

(And the really, really in-depth and interesting heal spells I always ended up with..... Heal Self: 10x3sec, 15x3sec, 20x3sec, 20x5sec, 20x8sec, blah, blah, blah)

:snoring:

While i don't mind if spell-making isn't in game, it is an incorrect assumption that people like me have nothing to add to the discussion.

1. Spell-making in the game with the varied levels of effects they have for each spell would be too much work to program in

2. Perks allow you specialize within tree's making the spells that are in game feel even more unique (that's MY modified fireball designed to get as big of an area as possible)

3. Your Opinion doesn't bother me, what bothers me is that you call out one individual and tell him to GTFO, based on his opinion.

Players shouldnt have to waste a perk to make a more powerful spell, with only 50 perk cap. At this point they should just call the game elder age skyrim effect. Screw this.

Spells Scale with level now aswell, or did you miss that in my earlier posts? Perks are there to MODIFY what it can do (making lightning bounce around a room for example) increasing the size of a fireball is equal to the 2 handed perk for swords that allow you to hit more than 1 enemy with wide swings.

Then, once you have put points into a tree how YOU want to, those types of spells are now YOUR OWN SPELLS.

:rofl:
my fav so far is Elder Scrolls of Duty but I liked that one too

If that is the best you can come up with for spell making I am not surprised it isn't important to you.

Because

Weakness to Fire 100% for 1 second
Fire Damage 50 points for 1 second

is sooo much more unique >.>

you couldn't mix and match Conjuration skills, Illusion most people only used Invisibility, Chameleon or Night eye, Resto spells most people combined as much as they could but they all seemed the same anyway. so you were saying?

if u dont like it dont play it no one is forcing u to buy skyrim.

on topic...i like the new spell system being able to instantly go from fireball to flamthrower to rune trap thingy without changing spells sounds like itll be fun to play.

Please do not say 'people' when you mean 'I'.

Yes.
Yes, that is more unique.
When I make a spell myself and name it myself then that spell is mine, something of my wizard, something I devised.
When I use a pre-made spell I have no freedom, I am bound by what other people think I should use.
That is the difference.
A huge chunk of freedom and customisation is removed, and now this unique and amazing thing TES offered is gone, to be replaced by generics. Which is not fine.

Meanwhile, a long time ago someone with some math insight made a post regarding the possible spell combinations of 85 spells, dual wielded and 3 ways of casting, to 85 spell effects with Oblivion style spellmaking.
The difference is so great its not even funny anymore, spellmaking has by its very nature orders of magnitute more distinct and unique spells.
We are talking the difference between a grain of sand and a star here, the numerical shortfall of pre-set spells is that great.

As someone on another thread said, I paraphrase:
There already was an Elder Scrolls series for action games. Elder Scrolls Legends. A new Battlespire or Redguard would have been a lot more desirable than this trend of moving The Elder Scrolls from a freeform sandbox into a restrictive action/ adventure series.

I'm going to wait for more information, but I can't imagine it can be more boring than the spells we had in Oblivion.

*I* never used those spells i mentioned, but i know heaps of people who did.

Also, Was the person who did the math on those spells also taking into account total mana cost per spell? for it to be fair, someone just making a mathematical equation explainging 85^85^100^50^60 (taking into account Magnitude of spells, Radius of spell and time of spells) is more than 85^2^3 is just [censored]. Yes, IF you had UNLIMITED MAGICKA then Oblivion Style sepll-making would be comparing a grain of salt to a star, but thats not the case.

If use my previous example

Weakness to Fire 100% for 1 second
Fire Damage 50 points for 1 second

this would use about 150 Magicka, Most people couldn't use it unless they had chosen Breton/Certain birth-signs/Altmer/CHEATED

Adding in more time/radius/damage or whatever is impractical when comparing the 2.

There are no cheats in Oblivion to increase magicka.
There are however intended game mechanics.

And of course the most powerful spells are only available to a magic oriented character, there is nothing wrong with that.
The mana count is immaterial, as long one stays in the range of what is possible to cast, i.e. no spells that require 10k mana.
And yes, we are talking possible spells here.

So again since you have no creativity, no no else does as well. Outside of looks what are you gaining in this new spell system? 90% of the spells will be the same as the oblivion spells but with no options to customize. The few that are different, i could mimic most of them with spell customization. Oh frost slows, yeah it is so hard to tie a drain speed to my frost spells, fire burs oh I just add an additional fire dot to my fire spells etc. Flamethrower looks cool, but it really isn't much different than a basic Dot Spell, traps I admit are new, but so there is no reason why traps couldn't just be another type like touch, and target.

Are you sure? Did the Mathematician also take into account X number of Perks and spells scaling with level?

And yes, you could cheat to increase Magicka by just cheating to increase your intelligence.

Edit

Replying to Ahglock: There is a certain degree of customization with your character that most people seem to completely ignore and thats PERKS (Making lightning bounce off walls)

Yes I am sure.
It was a complicated little thing all about phase spaces and technical jargon.
And I never found a cheat that increased my intelligence on Oblivion. Mind you I am not the kind of person who looks for those kinds of things and until 2 weeks ago I did not know one could raise alteration by casting an open spell at an open door.

Yes we can customize our character with perks. The spell customizing perks don't compensate for the loss of spell making. A perk that lets me bounce lighting is kind of cool, but I don't always want to bounce lighting but unlike spell making I can't turn it off and on by picking a new spell. Powering up the spell is all well and good, but will it give me a 1-100 scale or is it 25,50,75,100 only? What if I don't want to improve the base damage of my fire spell but want to focus on the light the person on fire part, or increase the duration but not weight limit of feather or the reverse, or both does charging the spell cover that? What if I want to combine more than 2 effects how does dual wielding cover that, and no a scroll is not the same?