Ifs: Boston, the Institute, Androids and you.

Why did the Institute build a bunch of human looking androids in the first place? Why make them into a slave caste? Why not robots? They don't go all Replicant and run away. If they wanted disposable slave labor why not go the way of the Pitt did and just get slaves, as it would probably be easier and less resource taxing than building state of the art androids.

- Any thoughts?

Your right on all counts, so many androids escape apparently that they have a security department that's entire function is too track both run-away androids down and their own when it happens to them; it's almost like the Commonwealth and androids are a terrible idea, ripped off from Blade Runner, and should never be referenced again.

It saddens me that Bethesda, who actually added some decent robot designs to Fallout (Eyebots, Protectrons and Sentry Bot redesign), went for this most un-Fallout, high-tech robotics just for the sake of it.

Obviously, it's for SCIENCE!

Just because nukes irradiated the Biosphere to near-inhospitible conditions, it doesn't mean that people have to scale back the PROGRESS OF SCIENCE! No, that's what THEY want us to do! Who are THEY to tell us we CAN'T make human-like androids that have some degree of free will? Who are THEY to tell us about outdated concepts of "morality" and "ethics"? Who do THEY think they are to try and stop the PROGRESS OF SCIENCE!

The Fallout series is historically tongue-in-cheek, and holds wacky reasons for concepts, usually boiling down to "because we can!" or "becase it's cool!" Why else stick nuclear generators int vehicles that explode into mini-mushroom clouds? Or giant nuke-hurtling robots? Or sticking a radioactive element into soda that makes your pee glow for a month, just so it can pop out on store shelves?

Those things all have one thing in common... Fallout 3; the Commonwealth was just the zenith of Bethesda missing the point or going too far.

So what was FO2? All those pop-cultural references to the point where it couldn't take itself seriously? And let's not forget the Big Empty DLC, something created by Obsidian/Remnants of Black Isle Studios.

Superb, I actually have the power of clairvoyance; no sooner had I posted my last comment did I think "I wonder whether I'm going to get something about previous Fallout games faults too even though that wasn't the context of either the thread or my response".

Also, it didn't take itself seriously, there's no actual talking stone-head or crashed Starship Enterprise landing craft; however there now is radioactive soda and nuclear cars which burst into legitimately impossible mushroom clouds.

Basically, that's the point of what I was trying to say. The OP is looking a bit too hard into FO's universe for justification, when in reality the whole thing takes a tongue-in-cheek look at the ideals of the 1950's, bot good and bad. FO3 takes a more serious look at the universe, but there's still plenty of crazy in it to let us know not to take it too seriously. I mean... c'mon. Giant ants? Optimus Liberty Prime? The "Superheroes"?

Yes, I am looking at the the whole android thing a bit much since, if FO4 is in Boston and The Institute is a key faction and if the androids play a big part of the institutes identity then I would like a rationale for the narrative . Sure, I found Old World Blues entertaining but as an aside, not the main quest.

Some ways I'd like the Android thing to go.

1. Many places in the Boston Wasteland ( or even part of MIT itself ) are cooked like The Glow, or worse, and the only way to scav said areas are with robots that have the same maneuverability as humans.

2. The original, old pre-war Androids are all Chinese and were slated to be sent over to China as sleeper agents/saboteurs and the Institute scientists can't reprogram said subservience/dual personality out of the creation process.

3. The Institute knows about the NCR and are trying to infiltrate and then replace key government figures with Android clones.

4. Ugh: They've been contracted to make human androids for some fiendish plot by none other than The Enclave.

Outside of those scenarios I can't see a plausible reason to have a bunch of Androids running around. Any other theories?

The only one of those with a shred of plausibility is the second one... which I must admit I think is rather a good idea; still doesn't detract from the fact that Android robotics is not something I believe belongs in a Fallout game though.

I'll just agree with this.

There has to be a justification for this, I can appreciate implausibility as-much as anyone; if you want to put a gun to my head, yeah I know where they were coming from with the Nuka-Cola Quantum, they put radium in all kinds of [censored] once-ago, but this is the leap from goofy Fallout robotics (which I accept as part of the setting) to legitimately synthetic humans... so much so that Harkness has spent years thinking he was one.

Does he need to use the restroom? Does he synthetic junk? He mentions bleeding whilst shaving so he legitimately grows synthetic hair on his body and has some kind of fake blood-system; I understand that he's probably used to infiltrate the bases of the Institutes enemies but it's just too-much from a technology stand-point and doesn't belong.

Androids are human...like. they don't have emotions. Or the physical limits of a human. It may seem like they have emotions. But if you don't program them to be happy, they wont be happy. If you don't program them to complain and want something more than slavery, they wont complain or want more. They also don't die. They don't get afraid of dieing. They are the perfect worker.

Except that they did feel emotions... and did complain about more than slavery... to the point that they set up their own branch of the police to track them down and so many were escaping that an entire underground resistance network was established to help them.

Listen, androids are cyborgs surrounded in living tissue! They have to exist in the FO universe! They look human! They sweat, have body odor, bad breath! Very tough to identify.

They can't be reasoned with! Can't be bargained with! They feel no pity, or remorse, or fear and they absolutely will not stop, EVER until you are dead!

Why am I talking to you fan boys! Who is in charge here? You just don't get it do ya, androids can't be stopped, they will wade through you, reach down your throat and pull your frigging heart out!!!

I've often wondered if a better turn-around for the Commonwealth/andorid schtick is if the androids turned out to be nothing more than mind-controlled humans, using similar technology to the Enclave, and the Institute simply uses the "android" term as a way to detract from the fact that they are indeed using human slaves.

When you gave the "force command" to Harkness, you simply gave the override code to boot up his mind-control device within his brain again.

Not a perfect solution, but better than [censored] Androids.

And when Pinkerton operated on Harkness, he specifically mentions that he only did it to marvel at the science of the machine.

Then its simple, we kill Pinkerton.

He's clearly loony. Talking about man-robot-people. Pfft. No such thing.

Maybe the free the androids people programed them to want more because they feel they should have more. I don't know. Not enough is known to complain, or defend the idea.

We can create new forms of humans in the shape of super mutants (never mind all the other abominations) but imitation is too far?

I'll clarify I can to an extent see your point but really technology is so advanced androids shouldn't be a completely crazy notion.

There is love hearts everywhere

Except that with regards to robotics, its not.

John Henry Eden is the Fallout's version of the ultimate super-computer, and he only fits inside a massive room. Yet androids with micro-processors are being built at the institute?

Protectrons and robo-brains are the standard clunky robots, and yet we have androids that bleed, shave, and [censored]?

It's implied that the Institute's research didn't suffer because of the war; even if they had 100 years of continual improvement, they'd probably have figured out microprocessing tech. Eden, meanwhile, is a supercomputer that was bleeding edge 200 years ago. Not a very fair comparison.

Except that the Enclave's research didn't suffer either because of the war, and continued making significant technological developments well into the post war world. Yet nothing they created resembles anything like an Android.

And thus lies my entire beef with the Institute. Its FAR too advanced for the Fallout world. The most technologically advanced faction descended from the pre-war government is light-years behind them if androids are actually canon.

They don't fit.

Androids are capable of performing more complex tasks, have more dexterity, and have a wider range of use than traditional robots.

As for if it's too advanced, I don't see a problem. Humanoid robots are a part of retro science fiction, and 200 years is more than enough time to make those advancements. It's not their fault that the Enclave was so slow at progressing technology.

First off: slow? They developed several new versions of Advanced Power Armor, finished an aircraft prototype, a plasma prototype, and continued various other government projects.

Second: Its not just the Enclave. House, founder of Robco, is using Securitron bots as his mainstay, and they aren't anywhere close to Androids that can freaking poop. Nor does Big Mountain or the Brotherhood have anything close to it.

My counter to that is that the Enclave, and other technologically advanced factions, are advancing their technology at a rate that makes sense within the context of the Fallout world and the post-apocalypse. Everyone is pretty much on the same level in terms of their own technology and how quickly they are progressing.

The Institute however, is lightyears, lightyears ahead of everyone, barring Mothership Zeta Aliens.

That's a problem.

Honestly, I don't really care whether or not its "possible" given 200 years that a single technology Institution could create androids of that caliber. It doesn't fit within the context of the Fallout world and doesn't match similar technological developments on a reasonable scale. Its out of place.

Even Big Mountain, the guys that created holograms that can godforsaken shoot beams do not have androids. All they have is floating robot with monitors and incapable of fixing the monitors on their own. Big Mountain is basically the very definition of "advanced", you can't get any more advanced than these guys. There is a high chance that their research had stopped some time after the Great War, but considering their advancement in science, there is hardly anyone that can match them. IIRC Shi was the most advanced faction short of Enclave, and they don't have androids either