Hi all,
With a newly redesigned engine, we should be expecting Bethesda's animators to be ahead of the game, developing open-world RPGs for as long as they all have. Instead, I've noticed very similar flaws in the Skyrim footage we've seen. Have a look at IGN's Rewind Theater when they ran through the official Skyrim trailer a little while back - almost all the qualms I have with the current state of Skyrim's animations are there. Or, if you want to skip all the pvssyr, just have a closer look at the official trailer, and really pay attention to the animations. http://www.ign.com/videos/2011/02/24/skyrim-rewind-theater?objectid=14267318
You'll notice several awkward motions in 3rd person combat when they actually pick the framerate apart, rewind it, or slow it down in general. One example I find always bothering me is when the character is seen from his side, slashing an enemy with his sword whilst doing a spin move. @7:50 minutes into the Rewind Theater video I have linked, they slow it down quite nicely so you are able to see each phase of the animation. In almost every frame that it is paused during this spin move, the main character's limbs are bent far beyond natural possibility, his shoulders remain stiff, and his lower neck to the point of his shoulder blades is somehow pushed forward as though it's a separate joint. This is not the way humans move. It appears as though the animators are still creating strange Oblivion-style movements within this new engine.
Actually, he is well within the realm of that a human can bend, I'm not sure how that could even be close to unrealistic human flexibility. The only thing in that entire video that looked truly off was the fact that the swords weren't contacting the enemy.
Fighting the frost troll @6:34-ish, the idle left hand with the flame spell is very lifeless, stiff and awkwardly configured. This very same thing is shown in the newly-leaked 5 second clip of the demo that was shown to the press. The fire itself inside the hand is dynamic, and yet your hands are displayed at the most unusual angles and in the most uncomfortable of positions while a ball of fire is wreathed inside your palm. If they are going for that Bioshock-esque feel for spells like it was done with plasmids, they should at least create more variation in terms of idle animations. No one runs around with both their hands and arms folded up near their chest, facing each other, in such a sterile way. People are not made of clay. For a great test of this to see what I mean, place both your hands near your chest in the way you see in the screenshots, and experience how truly uncomfortable and bizarre it feels to behave in such a way. It sounds funny, but to really critique what we're seeing, we need to let go of all our hype for a moment to really understand what's on screen. The game may look gorgeous, and we're overwhelmingly anxious to play it, but I think a lot of us aren't criticizing it or comparing it apples to apples like we should be. Bethesda is boasting about their new Creating Engine.. but to me, it still looks eerily close to Oblivion in terms of mechanics.
The hand isn't idle at all. As seen in the gameplay video show, the fire is quite alive in the hand and the hand moves, far from lifeless. Raise your hand to a similar angle like you have a spell at the ready, it looks the same (at least my hand makes the exact same shape as the hand with the spell in it). Also, the hands aren't up to his chest and hands face each other when your holding things in them, that's how hands work. Also, it's nowhere near close to Oblivion in any way.
Another great example, @6:40 or so, the scene where your character slices an unsuspecting person's throat from behind. Pay close attention to the stale movements the character demonstrates very quickly while standing up. It's too rigid of a movement, and doesn't flow properly like a human being would demonstrate. When they slow it down, you can see the individual phases once again, which make it appear smoother, but at full speed it looks incredibly awkward and unnatural. Not to mention the completely oblivious and dumbfounded bystanders that are in the room with you when you do this, which the narrators joke about. (Oblivious Oblivion AI, anyone?)
His movement is smooth and fluid. He had just come up from sneaking and went in for a throat slit. It was a smooth motion and the target even was leaned as he it was grabbed and pulled over so that the player could get a good cutting angle. The bystanders will certainly react after his throat is slit but there is no reason for them to react when nothing had happened yet and we don't see beyond the throat slit (in fact we don't even see the throat slit)
@7:38, you see a staff shooting a ball of light down a corridor in a cave. While we're all meant to look at the lighting effects displayed on the walls, we're being distracted from the incredibly awkward manner you are holding the staff itself. Try holding an object like that, a broom for instance, and realize how strange it is to hold and thrust things the way it is shown in 1st person during the video. It's as though several animations have been crafted anxiously without the aid or assistance with motion capture or real life reference.
What was wrong with the way your holding the staff? Staves aren't large as a broom anymore, they are more like the size of a scepter and that's how you would hold a hand staff. Also, he thrust it like he was stabbing, obviously to fire the light spell out of it. All these animations so far have been realistic and can be replicated in life without discomfort.
@8:03, your character draws his sword. Pay attention to how robotic the animation looks, and where he holds his sword as if he was hip-firing an AK47 in Counter-Strike. Watch his left arm move into position in a defense stance as if it were made of cement. This is simply poor animation, and quite honestly, I know people who after a year or so in school learning animation techniques that were able to develop more fluid, natural movements in a digital environment.
He took up a defensive stance. This is a typical sword stance. If you don't believe me, there are plenty of movies where this stance is used by people. It is meant to have your right had out front ready for a counter attack and the sword in the back, preparing for a strike when needed.
@8:25, the finishing move is shown when you grab onto a bandit's shoulder and thrust your sword into his stomach. Again, incredibly awkward. Position your own arms into the last frame when the sword is thrusted and the narrators pause to talk about the scene. It is one of the most uncomfortable arm positions I've seen.
How is that an uncomfortable arm position? That's the natural armor position in every way, I think you need to go over these again.
But, the absolute worst animation I've seen so far from the trailer, is of the dragon taking flight after he jumps off the temple @10:13. It's as though the dragon is comprised of 2 halves, one front half, one rear half, and the animator simply squeezed the 2 sections of his body together while moving his wings up and down in one of the most unnatural, painful, and abnormal attempts to animate an animal I've ever seen on screen. Now obviously dragons don't exist, so it'd be incredibly challenging to properly animate one without reference, but this is just unacceptable in my eyes. It is things like this, that now after all their latest releases displaying poor game mechanics, I will no longer be able to ignore.
I'll give you that one at the end, it looked awkward but the dragon in the rest of the trailer was exceptional.
These are just some of the things I've noticed, as I'm sure once you all take a closer look at things and really start to criticize what's happening on-screen instead of drooling, you'll appreciate what I'm saying.
What do you all think? Am I over-anolyzing this, or do I make a valid point? Do you think (or hope) that Bethesda will clean up these issues before the release date, or are we just going to have to accept the fact that their animators are going to continue to plague us with mediocrity for how the game feels and operates, in hopes that the story will somehow make up for it again?
Your definitely over-anolyzing it. I think your subconsciously looking for something wrong with the animations when there is nothing wrong. I watched the IGN rewind theatre and then I continued to replay the version I have on my computer as well. I even switched to my actual PC monitor instead of the TV to look closer. All the animations and the model body part positioning are what they should be in real life. The only thing that was off was the gap between where the guy that did the spin was a little wide but that is mostly a very rare occurrence and it happens in every game sometimes and then the dragon at the very end looked awkward.
In the end, even if the animations were bad or awkward (which all of them are realistic and fluid but the dragon at the end), it doesn't matter because even if they had been awkward in slow motion, that doesn't matter because real time is what matters. So if they look great in real time, what does it matter if you put it in slow mo (which nothing was wrong with them in slow motion either). I think it just comes down to wanting to find something wrong with them when there isn't. Not that I'm saying your doing it on purpose, it's just subconsciously.
» Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:50 am 
