Anyone else think this "Radiant Story" feature is go

Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 2:20 pm

This, like so much else in the world, will become a self-fullfilling prophecy for most peeps. Those of us that accuse BGS of "lying" and failing to deliver on their promises, will surely feel the same way again regardless of how good the AI is done. Any AI short of a true self-aware system like the HAL-9000 will fail to meet some expectations, so in my view BGS can never please all of the people all the time. On the other hand, those of us that go into it with a positive attitude, who enjoy the technology for what it is and get the most out of the game, will think that BGS succeeded brilliantly with the new AI and will very much enjoy the game.

In summary if you go into this Expecting them to fail your expectations, they will. If you go into Skyrim with realistic expectations of a game that is better than Oblivion in AI terms and are Not expecting HAL in every NPC, the game will succeed brilliantly. Personally, I think that people demanding HAL-level AI from a $60 dollar game are ridiculously un-realistic. I'm glad I am not one of them.

Miax


Completely agree. I have high expectations for the game, without being unrealistic, and so I'm sure I will have a great gaming experience. And as for HAL, we all know how that turned out. :unsure2:
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Amy Masters
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:41 pm

Completely agree. I have high expectations for the game, without being unrealistic, and so I'm sure I will have a great gaming experience. And as for HAL, we all know how that turned out. :unsure2:


Oh ain't that a great example, HAL = Radiant AI (in it's full glory.).
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Ashley Tamen
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 2:54 pm

Completely agree. I have high expectations for the game, without being unrealistic, and so I'm sure I will have a great gaming experience. And as for HAL, we all know how that turned out. :unsure2:


Dittoed
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Crystal Clarke
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:39 am

While I think it could be an interesting part of the game, the worst thing any of us can do is get our hopes up too high. Of course it's not going to be as good as they (or your wandering mind) are making it out to be. They are obligated to create high selling points and exaggerate things in order to gain public interest and increase profits.

That's just business.
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Britta Gronkowski
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 11:15 pm

They better not have friendly NPCs jumping into the fray and getting in the way when they're not supposed to like we had with Oblivion.

Case in point: Farwil. (Whoever put him in the game should be strung up.)
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des lynam
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 12:47 am

I'm not so worried about this, because the description given of Radiant Story in the GI Technology of Skyrim update doesn't make it sound like a fairytale.

For instance:
Traditionally in an assassination quest, we would pick someone of interest and have you assassinate them,” Howard says. “Now there is a template for an assassination mission and the game can conditionalize all the roles – where it happens, under what conditions does it take place, who wants someone assassinated, and who they want assassinated. All this can be generated based on where the character is, who he's met. They can conditionalize that someone who you've done a quest for before wants someone assassinated, and the target could be someone with whom you've spent a lot of time before.


This doesn't seem too hard to do. For the template assassination mission, just let there be a list of possible NPCs who can (i) give you that quest, (ii) be target of that quest, (iii) a list of locations where the assassination should occur, (iv) a list of conditions on how the assassination should occur. Now, the game is already keeping track of (x) who you've met, (y) where you've been, and (z) what skills you have. So, the game can just look at (x), and then use that to select the appropriate NPC from (i) and (ii); it can also look at (y), and select an appropriate location from (iii); it can look at (z), and then tell you the appropriate skills you should use from (iv).

I guess the thing to be wary of is having too high expectations. I doubt that the game will be extremely subtle in discriminating between which NPCs you've met and have high/low disposition with, where you've been, and what sort of skills/attributes you have. For instance, you probably shouldn't expect there to be much difference, if any, between a character with high one-handed weapon skill, and a character with a high two-handed weapon skill (all else being equal). What I hope we get is at least some fairly tangible differences between quite different characters - a melee oriented character who has done a lot of work for the Fighters Guild should be presented with tangibly different in-game content from a magic oriented character who has done a lot of work for the Mages Guild (or whatever Skyrim's equivalent will be).

The trickiest thing is the redundancy involved with killing an NPC and having another take its place to offer you the quest. But so long as this is not an especially common occurrence, then this is fairly easily achievable.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 6:18 pm

Completely agree. I have high expectations for the game, without being unrealistic, and so I'm sure I will have a great gaming experience. And as for HAL, we all know how that turned out. :unsure2:

Hehehe my bad - I should have chosen a better example. :facepalm: HAL is the best AI I've seen 'dreamed-up' for a computer, so it came to mind. :)
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Myles
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 5:53 pm

Just mention Gothic's AI, which is far less bug-ridden. That blight upon the name of this series shouldn't be mentioned, let alone what came after. *shudders*

In the Shrillest voice to ever cause the gods to commit suicide: "Hi There!" *Waves arms oddly.*
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Tamara Dost
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:17 am

Anyone else think this "Radiant Story" feature is going to turn out how "Radiant AI" did in Oblivion? As in a huge stack of lies?
I'm really not concerned :shrug:
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marina
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:34 pm

I'm not so worried about this, because the description given of Radiant Story in the GI Technology of Skyrim update doesn't make it sound like a fairytale.
[cut]

I'm pretty much in the same boat.

The kind of AI depicted so far seems quite feasible.
Probably, most of the "background actors" NPCs will have a few rumors and just a few tasks: wake up, eat, go to work, have a break, have some leisure time, go home, eat, go to sleep. Rinse and repeat. On holidays, go to temple.
...which is just fine, because that's what that kind of NPCs are for: fill the game world and make it feel alive to us.

The more important NPCs will be more fleshed out and hopefully the AI will not be (too heavily) bugged.

Of course, I do expect glitches and bugs: I just hope the AI, as a system, will work decently.

In my opinion there's a fair chance that it will: because I'm getting the idea, from what I read and hear in the interviews, that devs realized that what matters it's not having a perfect system that emulates life; what matters is having a system that gives us players the plausibile illusion that we are in a real, living world, with people doing plausible things.
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Janette Segura
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 6:49 pm

O.K. Oblivion has some of the best A.I. that exist at the game industry and now people whine about it not being good ?
Well it seems people expected Oblivion have A.I. like the one depicted at the A.I. movie Stephen Spilberg made. :facepalm:
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqS83f-NUww[/media]

When I played Oblivion I was amazed by it's A.I.
Tell me a game that npcs have a better one.

Anyway the concept of "Radiant story" already exists in Oblivion.
There are some quests that only appear to you under special circumstances.
It just going to be more dominant and spread out in Skyrim.

Agree. I was amazed by the AI in OB, I still love the fact the ramdom battles occur between groups and I am not even involved. When ever I see this in play, I think its so cool.
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Marcia Renton
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:43 pm

I don't. This will be epic...trust in bethesda.
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Pants
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:01 pm

I have no doubt that like most things we believe will be awesome in any game turn out to be less than the perfect idea we get in our head before a game comes out lol
a wise man once said: "Not all that glitters is gold." so though I expect it will be interesting I dont believe it will be so overly awesome my brain melts so I have to be content with hoping it will be more like how the demo vids for oblivion seemed than how it turned out.
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tiffany Royal
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:47 am

I'm more worried that it will turn out like level scaling to be honest. ie the possibility they'll overdo it and it will become too obvious and intrusive. That's my only concern really. I don't believe it's as difficult for them to implement as the AI was. The game already has your statistics.
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louise fortin
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:45 pm

Radiant AI in fallout 3 had a huge improvement over oblivion, so I am optimistic for radiant ai and radiant story in skyrim.
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Kellymarie Heppell
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:19 pm

I don't bash Oblivion with an unrelenting flail, but what exactly was good about Oblivions A.I? Gothic 3's AI did the exact same thing in Oblivion, they had work schedules, they talked in fact they did more, they gathered around Campfires during the evening, in midday they are buys working cutting wood, smithing etc etc.

I enjoy my Oblivion, but undue praise? come now. and Comparing Oblivions AI vs Morrowinds makes no sense.


I played Gothic 3 and the level of AI was not at OB's level. They would sleep at night and during the day do there job. They did not wander around town, did not go to get food(though they did have eating idle animations), pick up stuff, walk roads for miles, get into fights and kill things when you were not around, steal from people, do other odd things.

But I must say Gothic 3 did have a great atmosphere, and I was really hoping Skyrim would some bring some of that into there game, and it looks like they have, with random jobs and more passive creatures.
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Sakura Haruno
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:50 pm

did not go to get food(though they did have eating idle animations), pick up stuff, walk roads for miles, get into fights and kill things when you were not around, steal from people, do other odd things.


But OB NPCs steal whatever they like, eat whatever they like, sleep wherever they like.
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SamanthaLove
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 5:25 pm

Radiant AI, though totally over-hyped/misrepresented and thus something of a letdown, was and is still great - NPCs in Oblivion and FO3 are the best in any RPG ever IMO. With Skyrim, I expect the will simply give the NPCs more "world context" within which to play... ie. if there is a rudimentary economy, and a flexible job/schedule system, then NPCs can end up doing things they were not initially set to do (eg. run someone else's store).

As for radiant story, yeah it doesn't sound all that difficult to implement, but it is a great idea to keep replays fresh and every game unique. It is simple enough that I expect it to do exactly as advertised so far.
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e.Double
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 4:45 am

I'm not so worried about this, because the description given of Radiant Story in the GI Technology of Skyrim update doesn't make it sound like a fairytale.

For instance:

This doesn't seem too hard to do. For the template assassination mission, just let there be a list of possible NPCs who can (i) give you that quest, (ii) be target of that quest, (iii) a list of locations where the assassination should occur, (iv) a list of conditions on how the assassination should occur. Now, the game is already keeping track of (x) who you've met, (y) where you've been, and (z) what skills you have. So, the game can just look at (x), and then use that to select the appropriate NPC from (i) and (ii); it can also look at (y), and select an appropriate location from (iii); it can look at (z), and then tell you the appropriate skills you should use from (iv).

I guess the thing to be wary of is having too high expectations. I doubt that the game will be extremely subtle in discriminating between which NPCs you've met and have high/low disposition with, where you've been, and what sort of skills/attributes you have. For instance, you probably shouldn't expect there to be much difference, if any, between a character with high one-handed weapon skill, and a character with a high two-handed weapon skill (all else being equal). What I hope we get is at least some fairly tangible differences between quite different characters - a melee oriented character who has done a lot of work for the Fighters Guild should be presented with tangibly different in-game content from a magic oriented character who has done a lot of work for the Mages Guild (or whatever Skyrim's equivalent will be).

The trickiest thing is the redundancy involved with killing an NPC and having another take its place to offer you the quest. But so long as this is not an especially common occurrence, then this is fairly easily achievable.


This is why I am worried about disc size. We can be fairly certain that while there will be more distinct voices in the game they will still be resused by multiple less important NPCs. If they have the space they could record a basic dialog set (locations, name parts, common quests, quest parts, etc) with each voice making it easy to swap quest givers, shoppkeepers, and so on when needed. It would also allow for the most variety with the Radiant story generated quests. How much space they have for voices will limit how effective Radiant Story is. Less space and the quest variety will diminish, as will the possibility of replacing semi-important quest givers.

The other question I would like to see an answer to regarding Radient Story is how well will it mix with mods?
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Kelvin
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:37 am

If they have said and gave specific examples on how the AI is improved I don't think it will like Oblivion's AI.
Examples include: -Family members inheriting shops after a family member is murdered
-Woman running up to you in a city asking to save her child from kidnappers
-Dropping your weapon on the ground and having some kid run up to you saying you dropped your weapon and maybe two men fight over it
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JLG
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:43 am

Actually, i'm more concerned that the Radient AI is going to turn out how Radient AI did in Oblivion.
Radient story seems simple enough.
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OnlyDumazzapplyhere
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 2:25 am

Reponses in the spoiler quote...
Not really, I am still worried. It might flop again (hopefully not). Let us not forget these posts:

Spoiler
[Kathode] "All screenshots we've released are 100% in game showing stuff we've already got implemented. We haven't done any special poses or anything like that, with the exception of magazine covers."
Without knowing when this was said or what was released by then, I can't say.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I'm sorry, but what part of "without losing our hardcoe rpg fans" don't you understand?"
There isn't much context here, but I doubt they intended to "lose" anyone.

[Slateman] "Each of the faction lines in this game have plots and quests to much greater depth over MW. Quality, not quantity."
Pretty much true. The guild faction quests I did in Morrowind were pretty random, only tangentally related to the actual guild. In Oblivion, the guild factions have full stories.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I know you don't want to hear it, but you're just going to have to trust us that the dialogue is better than Morrowind's."
Subjective, as it's hard to define "better". In many ways it was improved. It doesn't feel like I was reading dictionaries anymore, at least. So, true.

[Todd] "As you play, you start to figure out what you can do with these NPCs, and how you can influence their behavior, and when doing a quest, it really comes into play. A simple 'get the diamond from that guy...' quest can be done in hundreds of ways now."
A bit of an exageration here, sure. But Oblivion still offered more because of its AI (you could steal it when it was left unguarded, you could kill the owner for it when they were alone, you could bargain or threaten them to give it over, etc).

[VSXX] "We have everything from mice to moles to crickets. The most fearsome you have ever seen even! You thought sleeping at night with a singing cricket outside your window was bad. You wait till you meet the one that plays a 14 piece drum set outside your window."
Sounds like a bit of a joke to me...

[Pete] "Honestly, and this is just my opinion, I think the hardcoe RPG guys are going to love what we have in store for them in Oblivion. The depth, the level of polish...it crushes Morrowind. That doesn't mean that other people won't want to buy it and play it because it's a beautiful game that has fun combat and cool quests. We'll make enough copies for everyone."
He did say "just my opinion", and I doubt they were aiming to turn away hardcoe RPG players (if they even did). In many ways, the depth and polish is improved over Morrowind. So, true.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You'll be reading LOTS of stuff. All of the quest lines are much more in depth, challenging and interesting. And there's a heck of a lot more to the game than just the guilds and the main quest. Lots and lots of other things to do that haven't been mentioned. Stats play a huge, huge role. Class actually has meaning this time. The game is better balanced. You have more rewards for advancement besides just getting better at things. The dungeons are better designed, the NPCs are more interesting, the dialogue is better written.

If you think this is a simple, dumbed down hack & slash, you couldn't be more wrong."
The dialog and NPCs, I would agree with him, same as there being stuff to do outside of the guilds and MQ. Stats also did play a huge role in how you played, and technically the Class stuff is true, too. Some dungeons are well designed. I would call him on the balance, though, due to the abhorent level scaling.

[BlueDev] "For Oblivion, there's a very concious effort to avoid too much random information spewing by NPCs. Fear not--there's still the same amount of info to be found in the game. In fact, the NPCs probably have more than ever to say; it just makes more sense for them to say it."
NPCs don't say as much in Oblivion than in Morrowind, so that's not really true. But they did do rather well about "random information spewing".

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Oblivion is infinitely superior to Morrowind in every conceivable way."
In some ways it was vastly better, in others, not so much. Hind-sight's a [NUMMIT].

[MattRyan] "So for all of you thinking that it would be neat to steal something, and then take off on your horse....guess what? An NPC can do the same dirty trick to you as well. "
IIRC, there were NPCs in Oblivion that would steal from you...

[Todd] "The clothing you wear does affect certain NPC's, but not in a big way, ita€?s subtle."
There was at least one quest that played this up.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Broken shields and weapons are automatically dropped and they clatter to the ground using Havok physics. Broken armor stays on, but is ineffective and you'll know if you're wearing broken armor or not."
They don't automatically drop when broken in the finished game, though I could definitely see them intending that then deciding against it later. Weapons and shields can be disarmed and act that way, though.

[Slateman] "While I cannot go into detail, rest assured that even players who max out a bunch of skills will discover challenges in this game. We didn't leave you guys out "
Unfortunately true..

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Just because you can attempt to bribe someone does not mean they'll automatically accept it."
Unfortunately false..

[MattRyan] "We are gamers. We have given tons of time toward the balance of gameplay. Asside from the designers, artists, programmers, and producers.... our staff of QA testers are extremely good at exploiting our game systems and looking for loopholes in gameplay, or shortfalls in fun vs. realism.

In conclusion, to completely cut out any adjustment to difficulty in enemies would not be fun, just as making all creatures off-set to your level would not be fun."
The whole "balance" with Oblivion's level scaling was screwed up. In a way, it was rather balanced, but also totally out of whack. Funny though how it seems to better describe FO3's level scaling..

[Slateman] "Yep. To second MSFD, we don't auto-level exactly to your level. We have all sorts of adjustments available. If we didn't the game would be boring "
Technically this is true. NPCs, creatures, and levelled lists do have caps which prevent them from always scaling to your level. The problem was that it still had a very large range, particularly the items and gear, so it didn't seem like it.

[MattRyan] "If everything was leveled then you'd have no fear of anything in the game ('I can beat everything!') We plan on scaring the heck out of the player by higher level creatures."
Yeah, this is a bit of a fib. When you can beat the main and guild quest lines all at level 1...

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You're walking through a seedy part of a town in Western Cyrodiil. People mill about, some engaged in conversation, others minding their own business, out on their own errands. Suddenly, an ugly man decides he doesn't like you. Maybe he's drunk, maybe he's just a bully, maybe he's just showing off in front of his friends -- but for whatever reason, he has taken your measure and decided he can best you.

He comes charging at you, with a nasty looking mace in his hand and a look of hatred on his face. Onlookers move back to make room for what should be an entertaining fight.

Quickly drawing your sword and shield, you wheel around to face him. He's upon you pretty quickly though, and you barely have time to raise your shield (hold right mouse button) before his first blow thunders down upon you.

But you block well, and as he recoils from the collision, you quickly perform left & right slashes with your sword (left click, pause, left click). The bully realizes this isn't going to be easy.

He backs off a bit, and starts dodging around you. First to the left, then to the right. You maneuver to keep him in view, looking for an opening. Suddenly he steps back, raises his mace in both hands, and steps forward, bringing the mace towards your head in a crushing blow!

But you're quick -- you step to the side as he attacks. As he passes by, you execute a spinning maneuver and slash him in the side (hold left mouse button and left maneuver key). The hit is solid, and your foe staggers from the blow.

But it's not over yet. The bully swings his mace wildly -- his first swing misses, but the next one connects for a blow that sends you staggering. Pressing his advantage, the bully bears down on you with a power attack of his own. OUCH. This isn't going well. You take a glance at your health meter, it's getting a bit low. You quickly back up out of the bully's reach and raise your shield (hold right mouse button).

He's hurting, too. You circle each other for a time, looking for an opening, trying to recover some fatigue. Finally the bully charges forward with a devastating overhead blow, perhaps hoping to break your shield. But the shield holds and the recoil send him staggering back. This is your chance! You perform a mighty forward power attack (hold the left mouse button, press forward) and connect solidly. The blow staggers your foe once again, and you perform 3 slashing attacks in rapid succession (left mouse button, pause, left mouse button, pause, left mouse button), and finally the bully collapses to the ground, defeated.

The crowd disperses, going back to their own business."
I could totally see this happening in Oblivion. There was a distinct lack of agressive townspeople, though.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We happen to think that console gamers are smarter than that, and the success of Morrowind on Xbox proves that console gamers actually ARE interested in games with MORE depth and complexity than some people seem to think they are."
Don't see anything wrong there. It's not talking about Oblivion.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "I absolutely guarantee that they'll be able to make mods that will completely blow away anything we saw for Morrowind, using the new Construction Set."
Again, nothing wrong. In general, Oblivion modders are quite able to make mods that work much better than Morrowind's.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "You can only use the map-based fast travel to go to places you've already been. So you'll HAVE to walk to each possible location AT LEAST once."
Another fib. Or maybe something they decided to change later on. Either way, they should've stuck with it, and luckilly went with it for FO3.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We could make traditional creatures that looked like every other depiction of those creatures you've seen in books, movies, or other games, but then where's the originality in that?"
A toughy. I'm not sure the creatures didn't look unique, like he said. That's different from actually being unique. ie, it isn't unique by virtue of being a goblin or ogre or troll, but they did have unique depictions.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "NPCs would have to be told to go into your house via Radiant AI. And even if they WERE, you could always lock your door..."
No door locking. Makes me wonder if they did intend to have it, though.

[Slateman] "Trust me, you're going to get lost if you wander in these forests and don't use the compass or map."
True. If you didn't know what you were doing, you could. Though it's easy to avoid that if you know how, eg, go in a straight line until you reach something recognizable.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "you can enter every interior."
Don't see anything wrong with that statement.

[Pete] "There isn't a magazine on the planet that hasn't gotten information if they've asked for it."
Don't see anything wrong with that, either.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Resurrected NPCs are not themselves. They're basically mindless automata who will follow you around and fight for you."
That's true. Ressurecting bandits and marauders and having them fight for me is fun.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "Oblivion is an extremely rich, complex game with a tremendous amount of depth, compelling quest lines, interesting NPC characters, a huge variety of player character types and intricate character progression set in a huge, varied game world. Combat, magic, and AI have all been dramatically improved to enhance gameplay while still providing a balance between player skill and character skill, because after all, Oblivion is a role playing game. Yes, some things that were present in Morrowind are not in Oblivion -- but a lot more has been added than removed, and the goal has always been to make a game that is both more accessible to first-time RPG players, and is also challenging and rewarding for more experienced players."
Can't say that's a lie. Some of it's subjective and you may not agree with it, but that doesn't make it false.

[Pete] "We will continue to support the mod community as best we can and let them do the great things they do, just as we did with Morrowind."
Again, true.

[Sentinel] "The sad fact is that many development studios can't afford to bankroll their own game development. So they rely on publishers to give them the money to create these games. The problem with this is that the publisher then feels they should have input into the game since they are spending the money. Hence Atari and EA have such a big influence on a game they publish.

Just glad here at Bethesda we are our own publisher and developer and have free reign to make what we want."
Also true. Even id Software, when ZeniMax bought them, noted how hands-off they were.

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "We're NOT going to slap in features that don't work well just to say we have them."
Can't say that's false. Slapping something in that doesn't work just to have it, is different than slapping it in, trying to make it work, and not fully succeeding.

[Pete] "Holidays this year"
No context. Doesn't even sound like he's talking about the game.

[Pete] "You know if you have a 360 it will look as good as it can possibly look. If you have the latest, greatest PC with the best video card, etc., it will probably look the same as the Xbox 360 version."
As far as I can tell, true. And unfortunately, true with Skyrim as well..

[MrSmileyFaceDude] "The compass, the quest marker and compass icons, are NOT the hand-holding, dumbing down babysitter some folks paint them out to be."
That's a fib.

[Hayt] "We're around on a daily basis, and we're reading. When we're ready to comment on things, you'll all know."
Can't say that's not true. Back then, they probably were. Though in one of Todd's recent interviews, he mentioned how overwhelming everything became when Oblivion was released and they couldn't keep up.


[WARNING: Long post]

Some of them were true, most of the others were laughable.

All in all, I would say most of them were true. And some of them that weren't, I have to wonder if they really did intend for them, but had to cut it out later on.
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Lucie H
 
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Post » Sun Nov 14, 2010 9:28 pm

I think that with the new engine that BGS has this time around they will be able to incorporate the new Radiant A.I. and the Radiant Story. Because the Gamebryo engine so buggy that they had to remove things that they really wanted like true Radiant A.I. I think this time around they will be to incorporate them the right way.

Indeed. They have had 5 years to get it right.
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Angus Poole
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:57 am

Reponses in the spoiler quote...

All in all, I would say most of them were true. And some of them that weren't, I have to wonder if they really did intend for them, but had to cut it out later on.


Interesting responses, they really tried the best, it's a shame they didn't succeed in some matters. I doubt they ever lied, things just turned out not to work like it should... still, Oblivion was an excellent game.

Fallout 3 really showed how Bethesda improved over Oblivion. And Skyrim will be the result of all this experimentation and learning. Keep up the good work Bethesda, trial and error, live and learn, I know that in 11/11 I'll have a great time with Skyrim.
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Amy Gibson
 
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Post » Mon Nov 15, 2010 3:15 am

as people said already--its the AI that I'm worried about. It was very limited in Oblivion (granted, they had a smaller team and less resources).

I like the idea. I have high hopes.
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Anthony Rand
 
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