Most of you are claiming that it was never a choice between one or the other. Well... it kind of is. Of course the specific trade off of Shouts to spellcrafting might have never occurred, but it essentially is one against the other when you look at the greater underlying trends, which many of you are seemingly overlooking. Here I am referring to the whole "streamlining" trend, which looks like an attempt to make all the more intricate, "spreadsheet-like" portions of the game play more game-like and continuous, even though the careful parameterizing of custom spells may very well be an aspect many of us enjoy. You can't deny they are taking out some old aspects, but my question is, are the new things they're implementing really going to be worth sacrificing those basics, like spears and spellcrafting?

But it's not a trade off. There are different reasons for taking things out, and different things for introducing new things. It's not like they were like "Hmmmm we could have spellcrafting, ooooor, you could get powers from killing dragons. But not both!" No, the design choices were in no way related. As has been pointed out, so far the reason for spellmaking most likely not being in the game has everything to do with the design philosophy they are trying to put into effect with magic. I'm sorry but hundreds of perks divided up into trees in every of the 18 skills says to me that this is not a 'simplified' game. You have to pull some weeds to make a garden, and some things will get cut because it's not worth taking time out of more important things.

I can appreciate that people like spell making, but as this thread's poll has shown, it's very likely the minority that considers it a must have. So I am glad they are using their resources toward other things.

I do feel like the Dragon Shout are pretty similar to the sigil stones from Oblivon gates. Obviously they function quite different, but just the idea of "defeat an enemy...get a power up" seems to have been done before, I guess it's a pretty common theme in all video games, but ES tends to be more than just what's common.

Dragon Shouts and Spell making have nothing to do with each other. TC shouldnt of really pitted these against each other. The thousandth topic about spell creation being in or out should be the place for the pros and cons of spell creation.

dragon shouts have effects that magic does not the ones i can recall have very interesting effects for instance one slows time and the other can throw your enemies

Oh yes I remember all the unique varied spells you can create in the spell system... all five of them.
And comparing dragon shouts to minor/major powers is not a good idea as powers were just more powerful spells, thus not unique at all, dragon shouts though will be one of a kind.

Also shouts have absolutely nothing to do with the removal of the precious spell creation system, it's the new spell system that's fault here. And even if they could make a spellmaker for this, it would be completely different from what we know. Not to mention if they do implement the combination of effects on the fly, it would make the spellmaker pretty pointless.

Also they didn't removed spears, they just never got fully implemented...

All unlimited number amount of them you mean?I agree with the first sentence of the second paragraph though.

WHO CARES ABOUT SPELLCRAFT! YOU GUYS ARE SO BORING GEEZZ, you dont want to see anything new, only old boring things!! my god! i hope this is a april fools or else i would have to get banned for trolling this stupid thread, you sir! insulted bethesda games studios... you insulted all of us...

unlimited copies of the same five spells, yes.

Thank you for pointing out this almost irrefutable parallel, which I missed myself. Remember that feeling? You go an hour out of your way to close an Oblivion gate in the middle of nowhere and you do it all to end up with... another sigil stone, which you toss onto your already huge pile. That reward system didn't work to well, and I'm hoping the same thing won't happen over again with the Dragon Shouts.

Hypocrite? What a rude topic.

I wanted spell crafting but I'm looking forward to the dragon shouts. Out of principle I'm voting for dragon shouts. This isn't an either or kind of thing at all.

i agree with this guy! the only spells worth doing were the offensive ones, ONLY FEW better saying, fire,ice,shock,drain,burden wow thats it! 5 USEFULL SPELLS! nah i dont care about spell making, take then out and add somenthing worth it... like BETTER ENCHANTING... OHHH DONE!!

Wow the support is overwhelming for shouts. Looks like people who want spellcrafting are the minority.

Is this an april fools joke?


Er, no. Have you ever used spell creation? Just because you cant think of anything novel to do with spell creation doesnt mean that other people cant.


I do believe that you are agreeing with the wrong person.



No, it looks like some people that were on the forum at the time preferred Dragon Shouts (main quest mechanics) over spell creation in an unbalanced topic.

surprised? would you trade somenthing new and lore friendly, for somenthing old that was pretty limited, and that everyone in the world used already... seriously? without even trying the shouts like that?

IT BETTER BE!

Well, not exactly. By killing the dragon, you gain the ability to gain the ability. The dragon's soul enables you to see the key words for the shout at points where they are on the wall, but yes, its generally a- defeat an enemy, get a reward thing. Though in this case, defeat an enemy, take the first step towards a reward.
Sigil stones were kind of a disappointment for me... all I did was shove them in a box until i got a bunch of worthless items, then I enchanted them to boost their value (if it would go above the sigil stones value)

what you mean? im agreeing with bukee

I'm surprised in a good way. I thought this thread would be full of people whining about no spellcrafting. I'm happy it seems the majority don't care.

I guess they'd be alright if TES was a linear action game as well.


Then why did you quote me?

Thats the problem.
Too many people clamouring to remove what makes elder scrolls a unique RPG, and petitioning to make it a thirteen a dozen hack n slash.

Spellmaking is a core element of elder scrolls games. It allows for so much customisation, the sheer number of possible spells is literally millions upon millions. The smaller collection of useful spells is not as huge, but still in the thousands.
People that say it wasnt that useful have obviously never used spellmaking.
Im not going to rehash any of the thousands of fun and useful spells it allows, because that has been done to death.

I just wish there was a way for this broken record to finally stop.

There can be no question that a fable 3 like dynamic spellsystem cannot possibly allow for as many customisations as spellmaking.
So its removal of content wich equals removal of replayability.
How a spell looks is utterly unimportant. What matters is what it does.

Sorry for your loss.

Are you people serious? This is an incredibly rude and biased topic. Dragon Shouts have NOTHING to do with spell creation. The poll is ridiculous.

I want spell creation very badly, but this topic has zero logic.

This. No wonder the OP went missing long ago.

This, yet again.


Its the communities loss as much as its mine.