Are the Dawnguard evil?

Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:05 pm

He may be the king of [censored], but molag bal probably does not need to [censored] or have six to make someone a vampire, his shrine had blood coming out of it maybe drinking that could do the trick. Valerica and Serana did do the deed though since they were offered to Molag Bal.
Nope, it's funnier the other way.
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Isaac Saetern
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:12 pm

But they DON'T have to... as others have said, they can be cured.

Even if they only want vampirism for immortality or a power trip, they can't be trusted with that power. As I've said, if a vampire could prove that they were not a threat to innocent people, let 'em be (but they CAN'T prove something like that). Otherwise, that power that you've chosen or been bestowed is too great. Cure or die.

EDIT: If you're looking at this from a completely relativistic stance, then you can say pretty much anything about anything. That renders discussions boring. If you want to cut that fat, and be a bit more utilitarian, we can evaluate this from the perspective of the greatest good for the greatest number of people.

Being killed/preyed upon is bad. There are more non vamps than vamps. Not all vamps chose to become, but that's irrelevant since they can be cured. They can't prove they aren't a threat to innocent folk. That power puts them at a great advantage over most mortals. They must prove they aren't a threat (again, don't know how), be cured, or die. These are the only three routes to removing that threat. Pick one.

Despite that the protagonist in nearly all TES games can find cures and get cured, a cure for vampirism is kind of rare and sometime the deed to get cured can be dark and evil.
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Michael Korkia
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:17 am

The closest thing is the Imperials, they have the purest intentions though they do have some bad ones but not as many as the other factions and have the future of Skyrim on their backs even if it makes some of the Nords angry (Stormcloaks) and they (Stormcloaks) believe they don't need help to fend off the dominion which is making it hard for the Imperials to keep Skyrim safe.

This. Silly rebels do not understand.
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WYatt REed
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:35 am

Walk around castle Volkihar and ask yourself why wouldn't humans want to erradicate them.
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Manuel rivera
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:14 am

Can you imagine how horrifying that would be? I mean, Molag Bal is a big dude, and probably one of the arguably darker Daedric Lords... Lets put it this way, I would think twice before making a character that worships him.

Yes, he is one of the more malevolent of daedric princes and he enjoys what he does. While a deadric prince itself has no concept of evil or good, most are indeed evil from our point of view; the less evil ones would be Azura and Meridia. Sanguine is half and half, he believes in hedonistic lifestyles which could be harmless fun or include death. Sheogorath is also half and half, he can be jolly and benevolent ( he genuinely cares about his realm and the inhabitants) or he can be homicidal just on a whim.

Anyway back to the point, Dawnguard have some people in it who lost someone they cared about to vampires, so they are partially motivated by revenge.
Fact is, vampires were attacking cities and so the dawnguard got reformed to stop them. Vampires were the aggressors there but like some of us have said, not all vampires are evil, some can live near enough a normal life but to the dawnguard, one bad apple ruins the bunch.
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Miss Hayley
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:49 pm

You know, I am glad somebody brought up the point of how difficult a cure for vampirism is to gain. I mean, in Morrowind you had to go to Molag Bal himself to be cured. I don't see him being exceptionally neighborly and eager to cure all of his creation...
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Cheville Thompson
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:43 pm

Not saying all vampires are evil. But you must be out of your mind if you think Harkon isn't the bad guy here. His own daughter even considers his actions abomindable... he sacrifices everything to power.

The dawnguard on the other hand maybe a-holes at times however if you actually listen to their talk they all seemed to have lost much of what they love because of vampires making them more evil in the sense of revenge in a exaggerated fashion. On top of that they didn't kill Serena on sight and actually end up trusting her, a vampire. That's better than "your mearly a mortal and mortals are prey". Delusion is powerful in that one... especially when you cut him down. Point being never call slayer of the world eating dragon a meal. Stoopid vampire :biggrin:
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leni
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:40 am

Well in my opinion, it's like the civil war you choose the lesser of two evils. Sure dawnguard want to kill people who have no choice but to feed on people but at the same time, the vampires want to block out the sun. So again it's the lesser of two evils

It would be valid if they had no choice but they do. It's like saying that a junky has no choice but to steal from you to support his habit. It's not true there are options they are just more difficult
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Antonio Gigliotta
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:29 pm

Animal blood is not poisonous, they can feed on animals just fine but prefer humans. Daggerfall is proof of that.

A book in one of the games (can't remember which one) is written by a vampire talking about being a vampire in general. He mentions that werewolves taste great, a mix between human and a 'gamey' taste so apparently werewolf blood isn't poisonous either.
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Lauren Dale
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:31 pm

Self preservation is not an evil act (at least not in most Western Cultures and religions, there are some that might consider any act of killing to be evil even if it is to preserve life). Morality is based on culture and intention.

The current view on morality is based on those things. I would imagine the idea of morality implies a deep underlying truth of an ultimate right and wrong. Whether or not a certain group gets that right or wrong does not mean that an ultimate truth is not existent.

I consider doing anything that harms someone else wrong. It's only more wrong when done for selfish gain.
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sunny lovett
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:39 am

The Dawnguard are not evil. Some may be fanatical, but definitely not evil. A threat has risen up and they want to knock it back down. As for vampires of TES, people keep saying that Molag Bal [censored] Harkon and his family, but do not forget that they enacted the ritual. They sacrificed souls to Molag Bal and he came down to seal the deal. They do not speak of it like they were wronged, and even with Serana it is never a matter of "I wish I was never a vampire".

Vampires in general do not have to be evil, this is true. They can feed on wildlife and live with soceity in secret, as some NPC's in Skyrim do. The ones in caves and dungeons and Volkihar Keep choose to enthrall people and feed on others, nothing forces them to. On the whole, Vampires in Skyrim are evil, but Vampires don't have to be.
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Michael Russ
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:17 pm

The Dawnguard are not evil. Some may be fanatical, but definitely not evil. A threat has risen up and they want to knock it back down. As for vampires of TES, people keep saying that Molag Bal [censored] Harkon and his family, but do not forget that they enacted the ritual. They sacrificed souls to Molag Bal and he came down to seal the deal. They do not speak of it like they were wronged, and even with Serana it is never a matter of "I wish I was never a vampire".

Vampires in general do not have to be evil, this is true. They can feed on wildlife and live with soceity in secret, as some NPC's in Skyrim do. The ones in caves and dungeons and Volkihar Keep choose to enthrall people and feed on others, nothing forces them to. On the whole, Vampires in Skyrim are evil, but Vampires don't have to be.

Still all of them must be destroyed.
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Ash
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:10 pm

The Dawnguard are not evil, they founded the DG again so they could put an end to the vampire attacks recently occuring. In my opinion Vampires are evil one way or another, they know there is a cure and that vampirism is a disease yet they still don't cure themselves. Even if they think its a gift that doesn't justify them for accepting it. I'm not saying all vampires are evil but they do have a choice, and if they dont know of the cure then that is a sad life to live.
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ladyflames
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:22 pm

The Dawnguard are not evil, they founded the DG again so they could put an end to the vampire attacks recently occuring. In my opinion Vampires are evil one way or another, they know there is a cure and that vampirism is a disease yet they still don't cure themselves. Even if they think its a gift that doesn't justify them for accepting it. I'm not saying all vampires are evil but they do have a choice, and if they dont know of the cure then that is a sad life to live.
To be fair the cure for vampirism at least the one locally available requires a black soul gem. And honestly just because that information falls into the dragonborns lap as a game mechanic doesn't mean its actually easy to come by.
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Undisclosed Desires
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 1:40 pm

The vampire cure need a full Black Soul Gem in skyrim, which mean getting cured can be seen as more evil than being a vampire. I mean as a vampire you don't need to kill anyone in the game for blood but getting cured mean a human soul is damned to soul cairn.
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Rhiannon Jones
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:57 pm

So in essence if a wolf kills another wolf its an evil abomination? What makes killing humans any different than that? It makes me wonder...

O_o .... So you are saying that if I go and kill you, I would not be evil?
And clearly there is difference between wolf and sentient being :bunny:
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Michelle davies
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:44 pm

The vampire cure need a full Black Soul Gem in skyrim, which mean getting cured can be seen as more evil than being a vampire. I mean as a vampire you don't need to kill anyone in the game for blood but getting cured mean a human soul is damned to soul cairn.
If you dont feed as a vampire you will eventually become feral so yes all the Vampires you see walking around all normal have fed off humans, also you could fill the black soul gem with an evil persons soul if you see fit. One soul for many others seems more noble of a thing to do.
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Manuel rivera
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:12 pm

So this is how I look at it.

Vampires (small group, lets say 100 people) want to block out the sun, and then take over, meaning that the humans (much larger group, lets say 100,000 in proportion to vampires, idk the real numbers) would either be killed or become slaves.

So you either exterminate a very small group of people, or have a much, much larger group of people enslaved, as well as killed.

To me, the vampires are much worse, although Isran be a little crazy, he wants the best for the human race, which is the larger group and thus the better choice.
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Chase McAbee
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:51 pm

I don't think they are evil. As I see it the Dawnguard is a response to an increasing threat posed by creatures whos survival is based on feeding on mortals lifeblood.
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Karen anwyn Green
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:16 pm

I don't think they are evil. As I see it the Dawnguard is a response to an increasing threat posed by creatures whos survival is based on feeding on mortals lifeblood.
Predators will be predators. Molag Bal is evil by mortal standards, but he represents what he is. And he can't change either, because it is impossible.
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Yung Prince
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:39 pm

I don't think they're evil. Stupid? Maybe. But evil? No.
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ijohnnny
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:47 pm

Predators will be predators. Molag Bal is evil by mortal standards, but he represents what he is. And he can't change either, because it is impossible.
And so the Dawnguard are not evil by trying to protect people from those predators. Vampires are malevolouent as a rule(there are of course exceptions) to mortalkind and when they start to become a major threat they have to b dealt with.
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Naomi Lastname
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:53 pm

And so the Dawnguard are not evil by trying to protect people from those predators. Vampires are malevolouent as a rule(there are of course exceptions) to mortalkind and when they start to become a major threat they have to b dealt with.
Mortals are food for vampires. Dawnguard torture their victims and not by nescessity for survival.
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carley moss
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:53 pm

Mortals are food for vampires. Dawnguard torture their victims and not by nescessity for survival.
It may just be that I missed it, but I can't remember the Dawnguard torturing people. Care to enlighten me as to where you learned it?
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Francesca
 
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Post » Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:10 pm

It may just be that I missed it, but I can't remember the Dawnguard torturing people. Care to enlighten me as to where you learned it?
The torture tools and devices in one of their rooms is not for decoration, considering it was full of blood. It is obvious they kill vampires and collect their skulls.
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STEVI INQUE
 
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