To reply to myself, I took a look using Tes4Edit to see what Slof's BB and Roberts Male we're both doing. Roberts points to the "non-standard" location for the Argonian tail mesh (/meshes/characters/argonian/male/tail.nif), while Slof's BB "corrects" that and points to where it installs the spiked tail mesh (/meshes/characters/argonian/tail.nif).

All should be fine with Slof's loading after Robert's; however, my BASH patch was overriding the changes done by Slof's. This is using the default suggestions of BOSS (Graphics, NpcFaces, R.Teeth). It seems logical that Body-F and Body-M should be added to that list as Slof's does, in fact, make those changes. Sure enough, with those two tags added, Argonian males are beautified.

Would adding these tags to Slof's BB introduce any problems? It seems that those tags should have been recommended by BOSS given what Slof's changes, but I'm still very much in the learning phases so I can't be sure what seems logical to me might not cause massive problems elsewhere.

Hmm, the Body-M and Body-F tags aren't part of the BOSS suggestions for Slof's BB nor its description?
Then I have a different idea now. Why not just covering "both" locations in the V4 folders? Thus it would replace both files with the correct ones and it won't matter anymore which settings finally superrule. After all, users of Robert's V4 will already have this "male" subfolder anyways, so it's not even cluttering replacing both by AB.

Apart from that, basically you should be safe to add these tags to Slof's BB. It only changes Argonian and Khajiit settings, so the other races shouldn't be touched, and thus reverted, by this. However, more than one plugin having those tags it will again be decided by load order which one's "merged last" into the Bashed Patch and wins.

I have yet to look into the plugin of the V5 beta to see which folders that one uses. Without the CS and the other tools that's not an easy task.

13th March? Uh, that's a long time since.
Well, still without a new pc I'm still unable to go on modding full-scale as I'd like to. This is getting ridiculous.

Nevertheless, I'm just posting here to announce I uploaded an updated readme, the latest state of body meshes (up-to-date with AB Robert Male and AB TFF v3.0) and the missing adapted items I already created but was holding back on my drive for a long time now, as UFF_RobertV4-ScriptedArgonianFeet v0_5b on the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=15469.

It's been quite a while... again it seems.

Just wanted to inform you I created a seperate download section for Scripted Argonian Feet on the Nexus yesterday:
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=33396

This will be the new place for SAF releases from now on. The file included in the AB section will vanish soon.
I made this decision because there will be a lot of seperate SAF package releases in the future, which would only clutter AB's page. Plus now people can ask questions about SAF in the SAF section, questions about AB in the AB section, and I won't always have to ask which mod they're having trouble with first anymore.

To explain further, the new mod system consists of a download for the plugin "only" (no dependencies on any body mods) and seperate downloads of Base Body Meshes for all particular bodies covered by AB.
So now SAF officially supports Robert's Male V4, Robert's Male V5, Breeze's Defined Male Body, Team Fantasy Figures, Robert's Female Body V12 already, the others are following, namely Exnem, HGEC, Bab, Vanilla Male and Vanilla Female.

The already adapted items for Robert's Male V4 and TFF will be released in 2 seperate packages. The many adapted items (almost all Vanilla clothing) for Robert's V5, made for me by Nivea along with her Stock Clothing Replacer for Robert's V5 (sadly never seen released yet, those included in the V5 beta were made for V3 actually), will also be released in their own package soon, just let me add some adapted files for the shoes, for completeness' sake.
Then we will see which other mesh packs for which other bodies will follow and when.
The main idea of my scripts is to detect the presence of these files and use them automatically, thus such packages can always be added later at any time and everything will work fine. So that's the way to go now.

I hope I will soon be able to improve the scripting (unbelievably many things to do on my list already) and maybe even get away from beta state.
But... well, you guessed it... I need a new PC first bla-bla-bla. Guess you can't stand me always writing this here and there anymore already, amiright? :whistling:

Hmm, I could really use a little feedback here.
You know I can't test any of my stuff myself currently and I released a lot of SAF meshes for different bodies never-before tested by anyone. I hate to be providing downloads for stuff I don't even know is working at all. It's an uneasy feeling not to know.

I know only having body meshes for those bodies and not being able to wear any foot items due to this right now definitely is a show-stopper and a prevention of downloading for many... but still some must have tried it out. I could count not getting any "negative" feedback so far as a good sign, but still getting some "positive" feedback, like "yupp, no issues, everything's working so far", for a change would really help me sleep better.
You know me, I'm just like that. Just can't help it, sorry.

But if I'm going to release mesh packs with adapted items next, containing these body meshes, and then some of them weren't even working at all, I'll have to redo ALL those items containing the non-working body meshes again. So knowing if they are working or aren't "before" I do that would be a massive help.

As usual thanks in advance for any answers.

P.S.: The base meshes for Breeze's Defined Male Body were quite a rushed job. There's a noticeable gap around the ankles. I'm already aware of this and am going to fix it for the v3.0 release of AB Breeze plus a reupload of fixed Breeze base meshes for SAF. :blush:

I'd test them but I'm still building my mod list and my games a little unstable. Modding community seems to be lacking as of late.

*Trips falls and face plants in thread* ow..... oh lookie thar. bliviongate:

Oh well, this thread is so much buried beneath thick layers of dust from my long, ongoing, though unwillingly so, absence... be careful where you're stepping on! :dead:
Let me quickly clean up this mess here dragon-style... :flamethrower: ...oh, that's just great, silly dragon. Now there's not only dust everywhere, but everything which wasn't dusted before is now reduced down to ashes!
Cleaning up dragon-style... what a genius idea...

Ahem, welcome back, Nivea. I really hope this place won't stay so dusted for much longer... but I can't for the life of me tell when I'll finally get around to continue my projects at all. There's just way too much work and I have to take up university next now either. The final step is always the hardest... but a diploma in applied computer sciences, engineering and robotics... should be worth it me thinks. :angel: It's far overdue after all!

I shall keep the thread company then! *sits* so....has any of the meshes changed since I was last here or is it the same and my stuff is still current? XD
Figure I am gonna complete all the feet/pants work... once I get Oblivion installed x_x *stares at 100billion new mods that popped up while away*

Ohhh Robotics thats just sixy. :liplick:

Will you fail if you don't get a machine to do it all for you?

Side note, I am gonna finish the Clothing Robert v5 with SAF (for Rob and FF) stuff, and then I am working on my own Armor Robert V5 with SAF (again Rob and FF).
SI too eventually.

That means all will be done, woohoo. This means less work for you Drake XD

Question, does the script still for unequip things?

That's really great news!
Considering I'm not making any progress at all lately, the less work for me the better. :unsure:

But I was waiting in anticipation for the Robert V5 Clothing Replacer itself already (SAF support was just the cream). Just imagine there's still no clothing replacer actually "designed" for Robert's new V5. All I know of, including the ones shipping with the V5 beta package, were made for the V3 bodies or V4 actually. I'm glad it's going to be released in the future.

As for your questions, there weren't many changes or improvements actually. I hardly get time to go on right now. I started uploading SAF to a different download location at the Nexus, continuing (and hopefully finishing soon) the updates to v3.0 for the remaining AB packages, male and female SAF meshes and the actual plugin seperately for you to mix and match, SAF body mesh support for more of the other body mods supported by AB, and some rather minor fixes now and then. But it's not making much progress now... just as everything else.

Alterations to the scripts are far beyond my possibilities at the moment, without a pc to run the game or CS on... jadda jadda, it's getting repetitive always writing this again and again...
So, yes, the script's still the same and thus still does force-unequip unfitting foot-items. What is a scripter without any ability to script? Useless, right, that's what I am.

At least I can still create meshes and animations and such... "if" I get the time to create "anything" at all that is.

September 2010... alright... seems the delays between my posts just keep getting longer and longer. So as soon as I go silent again next time better not expect any news from me before 2012 or something then. :ermm:

Anyways, I'm just bumping this up to announce a little release of massively improved scripts for Scripted Argonian Feet, v0.6b now.
I finally managed to get things prepared so I can do scripting again and this is the outcome. Hopefully that's only the start!

It's just a new Main Plugin downloadable from the dedicated SAF download site at http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=33396.

This one is no longer dependant on Elys Pluggy as it uses OBSE's own arrays now.
There's an exception now to the forced unequipping for so-called combined-slot items, which was practically yelled for since time immemorial. Unless turned off those will be allowed to stay equipped now.
You can also turn off forced unequipping entirely at any time now and turn it on again whenever you want. The new readme in the download tells the variable you have to change for this.
The check for OBSE will continue checking but only warn once, so its missing will no longer be stored in your savegames and you can still enable OBSE later any time.
Thanks to the new "EquipItem2"-family of OBSE functions I could also finally undo the changes to the Arena Raiment script. Scripted equipping of a raiment should now properly toggle the flag telling you're wearing one.

I was able to test its basic functionality myself already, but I need your feedback if anything's wrong I might have missed.

Have fun now, and give me feedback!

Hmm, no feedback at all so far, neither in the comments at the Nexus nor here nor in any other forum I posted this update... perhaps this means the revised scripts don't make your game explode at least, but still...

One could at least let me know if it's still working at all.
I would be done with scripting this mod for now, until the completely overhauled new version of my scripting approach, currently used by my dragon race, gets finished and approved as a working substitute, and could go on adding more body/clothing/armor meshes to the existing collections, or even make up new collections that is, so more and more items would become wearable by Argonians without destroying their unique appearance. I have quite some packages on my drives which only need some tweaking to fit to the latest versions of body meshes and would love to prepare these for release, but I can only do that when I know I'm done with the scripting part for now. :ermm:

I mean, there were people literally yelling for a way to turn off forced unequipping of unfitting items or to have at least combined-slot items being allowed to stay equipped.
Now I finally got the time to give them what they demanded... one of them could at least tell me if it is doing what they were wishing for or not.

I remember trying this out a while back, and loving every bit of it. At the moment, I don't have it installed, but I can't resist much longer.
I miss the feet so badly.
I'll report back once I've returned home and installed this again!

Sadly the progress of this mod occurred during a time when I wasn't paying attention to Oblivion, so you're explanation of the update doesn't really make much sense in my mind. Is there any better way to explain it to those that have no prior experience with the project? If so, I might be able to try it out for you. Just let me know what I need to do.

Everything is up and running, and I can't really understand why I didn't do this earlier.
The scripts are letting me wear multi-slot items, and the forced unequip seems to be working fine. Just tried running around a little.
However, ConScribe logged alot of these:

Error in script 8a017897ar_Find must be called within an OBSE expression.

Really, alot of them.
And a couple of these:

An expression failed to evaluate to a valid result    File: ScriptedArgonianFeet.esp Offset: 0x2EBF Command: Let

I have no idea of what any of them means.

Anything specific you'd like feedbank on?

I'm really looking forward to any new clothing/armor!
You deserve a great thanks and some :icecream:

Well, I don't know when you left the scene, but for you, and all others who maybe even don't have an idea at all what it is about, Scripted Argonian Feet started as an add-on to Argonian Beautification.
In AB I included jdayT's original plugin which is giving the Argonian Feet together with some assorted underwear he did to all Vanilla Argonian NPCs, hand-selected by jdayT to give an NPC the attire most suiting him or her.
As this was only affecting NPCs from the original game and companions or even an Argonian player had to find an Ayleid Cask below the footbridge in front of the IC Prison Sewer Exit where you once entered Cyrodiil for the first time after the tutorial dungeon to retrieve some "wearable" feet and legs with or without underwear, I wanted a more universal solution, affecting "all" Argonians, no matter if from a mod or the original game, companion or player the same, a scripted approach. So I created Scripted Argonian Feet.

What it does is quite simple. It scans your surrounding for Argonians (recognized by certain factors like being of race "Argonian" or at least being affected by the Argonian racial ability Poison Immunity (for the sake of custom Argonian races at least sharing this trait) and checks their inventories to see if they have an invisible unplayable race control token already or add one where it's missing. Those tokens now are only used to have a script running on the Argonian which checks the items equipped on a regular basis and when they're of a non-fitting type (one incorporating human-shaped feet) will try to replace their visuals with ones fitting the race, when an adapted NIF file for the item is present in your folders, or forcefully unequip them and equip nvde Argonian feet instead. Likewise the feet get equipped when the Argonian is not wearing any item on the feet (but that's only a bonus feature compared to the main purpose).
It achieves this by creating a CloneForm-copy of the offending item and only switching its appearance (biped model) to the adapted NIF file. To not do this over and over again for one and the same base item it stores the offending item and the copy in OBSE arrays and reuses the copies when the same offending base item comes up again. Then it removes the original and adds and equips the copy.

This solution, however, made it necessary that an adapted NIF file is present for an item to be allowed to be worn (forced unequipping of non-fitting items without alternatives present). As I haven't yet adapted all items, although some other modders did the hard work already and adapted almost every Vanilla clothing or armor item, they only need an update to the current state of body meshes by me prior to release, and only very few are included in the released SAF package as proof-of-concept so far, it basically renders Argonians unable to wear most items. The first exceptions to this I was asked for were for what I call "combined-slot items" (items occupying more than 1 slot at once, rendering the Argonian almost naked when not allowed to be worn), e.g. the Arena Raiments (already adapted and available) or the DB Armors (not yet adapted => not allowed to be worn) to be allowed to be worn even though they will make the Argonian look human again (but at least there will be no clipping as the whole thing is human then) or for the forced unequipping to be deactivateable altogether. This is what I now added in the v0.6b update, plus I also removed SAF's dependency on Elys Pluggy for the array datatype, because back when I created those scripts OBSE did not have arrays on its own, yet, and so Pluggy was required for this.

And what I'm asking for here is just downloading the mod and using it, or for those already using it to upgrade to v0.6b and giving me feedback if they encounter anything out of order or not working as intended. Just telling me if it works at all would be far more feedback already than I got since the release of the update.

edit: Thank you so much, hyperinsomnia! That's exactly the kind of feedback I was waiting for. Now I have something to look into and fix. And I'm glad it's working as intended for you so far.

Thanks to the FormID of the script and the offset in the other message I was already able to find the offending lines of code, anolyze what was the issue and fix it right away, there and at the other lines it should have occured at, too.
Could you tell me again if they're all gone now?

For reference, the error in script 017897 (ABRaceReverterTokenScript) was 1 single line I missed partially while converting all lines with array commands in them from Pluggy arrays to OBSE arrays. It was an OBSE command already, but still in a "set ... to ..." expression. Bad idea.
The one at offset 0x2EBF was harder to track down, because there was no mentioning of the script it's in, but luckily there's only 1 script with that many lines of code so an offset of this size is even possible, ABRaceTokenScript. The offending line, and others like it, were easily found. It was my fault for being too much used to PHP now I guess, 'cause I actually inserted the return value of ar_Size, which is an integer or short, by all means a numeric value, into a string_var! I hope me adding "$(...)" around this expression now gets us rid of this annoyance.

For some mysterious cause my console doesn't pop out any such messages right now. I'm also using ConScribe now, which I initially missed to install. Thanks for reminding me!
I guess I just missed turning on debug output from OBSE or something likewise simple along these lines... I'll try out a few things and see.

Good thing you could make anything of it!
I'll give it a try once I've fetched my laundry.

I guess it's a handy tool when dealing with these kinds of things. :tongue:


Update:
Just ran around for a while in Bravil and Cheydinhal, with no messages appearing. That hopefully did it!
I'll try to see if ConScribe logs anything else tomorrow. I'm heading towards destination bed.

Good to know. Then I can concentrate on getting those meshes done now. Thanks for the feedback, it's very much appreciated.
Hope you sleep well now!

Hello Drake,

I just wanted to provide some feedback for you regarding your current 0.6 beta release for your excellent Scripted Argonian Feet mod. While checking my console during play, I found this:

Error in script eb017897
Operator := failed to evaluate to a valid result
File: ScriptedArgonianFeet.esp Offset: 0x05BB Command: Let
Error in script eb017897
An expression failed to evaluate to a valid result
File: ScriptedArgonianFeet.esp Offset: 0x05BB Command: Let
Error in script eb017897
Operator := failed to evaluate to a valid result
File: ScriptedArgonianFeet.esp Offset: 0x067A Command: Let
Error in script eb017897
An expression failed to evaluate to a valid result

I apologize for this being unorganized, but I just copied it from the ConScribe file and am also too uninitiated to make it more cohesive. I am currently running OBSE v20, if that also helps you. I will try to provide more input, should you need it. Thank you.

Sealwarrior

Thanks for the feedback. It's weird OBSE reacts with a runtime error when you try to find an item in an empty but initialized array, but it's something I can easily take precautions for, of course.
Will do that ASAP and return back after uploading the fixed ESP.

Hmm, well, that took a while this time.
"ASAP"... guess it wasn't "P" as "S" as I was hoping for. :sweat:

Nevertheless, I fixed every single occurence of an "ar_Find" call on a possibly empty array with a precautionary condition around it making sure the array isn't empty now.
Get the latest version of the plugin and try again. Hopefully those runtime errors are now all a thing of the past.

I still wonder why I don't get any debug output from OBSE at all in my console. Might have to check the docs again if there's a switch or something I have to turn on first.

On another topic, now that Robert's Male, Robert's Female, TFF and also Exnem/HGEC finally reached v3.0, BAIN-ready and also OMOD-ready again, I was going to add base body meshes support for Exnem and HGEC to SAF next. While I'm at it I wanted to create flat-chested, reptilian style female upperbodies to go along with the optional upperbody slot control you can enable from the console, to make your female Argonians no longer have mammalian briasts and such, like they were in Morrowind, if you prefer them this way. But I think doing this right will take too long, so I might just release the body meshes without upperbodies first.

Half of them down, 4 more bodies remaining. Then all bodies are at v3.0 (final) and I shouldn't have to touch any of them anymore.
I was also thinking about adding support for the other, less prominent bodies out there, like Eshme's, TGND or... I don't know... what other bodies are there that won't just work with AB Exnem/HGEC (yet different texture layout or far too different meshes)?

For some weird cause I won't get any runtime errors at all when testing my scripts. Perhaps this functionality is somehow turned off for my OBSE and I can't figure out how to turn it back on again, but this basically leaves me tapping around blind when testing my mods.
Did anybody encounter any further runtime error message spam like the afore-mentioned since the last upload of my fixes to SAF v0.6b at May 1st? I'm really trying to get them all silenced while I'm at it once. Thanks in advance for any feedback as usual.

Oh and regarding that last question in my last post, I'm open for requests now. If there ever was a particular body/body mod you always wanted to be supported by AB and SAF, and which doesn't just look right with one of the existing packages already either, speak up now and I might add it to the list.