Hello,

Sorry if I pick wrong category, but thought the skills problem may be touching the whole saga.
Also sorry of any language bugs. No, i mean REALLY sorry.

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As we all know there are some non-combat skills in fallout games, like science, medics, speech etc.
Well, it might be interesting if some artistic skills. The new Art Skill would depend of charisma.

Using of it:
- Player could earn some money by giving shows (singing, dancing?) at clubs or bars. It would work automatically, not as a mini-games.
- Player could impress some NPCs with poethical speech, to make new friends, access extra features, avoid trouble or simply get their trust.
- Player could find some artistic items at wastlands. (mostly paintings, musical records etc.) The higher your art skill - the more money he could earn by selling them to specific NPCs.
- Player could use his art skills (by playing instruments) during the battle to increase some of compainions' combat values (APs, damage resistance, etc.) or reduce them to enemies. That works pretty well in other RPG's like D&D series.
- Player could get some controversial perks, like:
"Danse Macabre" - bonus to melee fighting
"Will Of Life" - HP increasemant, no matter of Endurance or Strength
"Improvisation" - immiedatly access to any perk of current level, even if player doesn't have required skills or SPECIAL values
etc.

What do You thinks about that idea?

edit:
Note that some artistic elements already appeared if fallouts:
- In F1 and F2 we can meet some people who are "singing"
- A painting (with Elvis-like buddy) can be found in both F1 and F2
- In F3 there is Agatha quest + some musical items
- We can also get a birthday poem in F3
- In Tactics we can found pre-war music store with some guitars lying on the floor (they cannot be picked up)
and some other

Hhhmm... Art skill would have a little of meaning, and they are taking useless or not so useful skills off.

If new skill is introduced, I would like if it would be gambling. It is so cool to make riches by playing dices in Fallout 2.

I don't think that is a good idea.

1. Artistic lifestyle would be that last thing to do for a person surviving in a nuclear apocalypse.
2. Who would actually use this? 99% of players would rather focus on more useful skills, such as lockpick or doctor.
3. Selling paintings is a thing I consider to be more barter-associated thing.
4. Playing a harp while there are Muties around doesn't sound a very good idea considering that FO4 is a post-apocalyptic RPG/FPS.
5. There would have to be a lot of paintings and musical stuff out there. Just a few paintings would make this skill completely useless.

Just my five cents.

Sure of it? We can already meet gamblers, boxers, porm actors.. why not singers or painters? People must do something at their free time.
Just imaginate a raider camp with lot of fancy spike-thing with an old music stage at the centre, and some punk-dudes making some postapocaliptic barbarian music-like noise.


Maybe. But note that not everybody are playing as bruisers with miniguns. You can already pick a way of thief, a diplomat (F1 Albert), even a science 'geek' and win a game with minimal fighting.


Both skills might be used.


Ok.. You got me.


There doesn't have to be a LOT of them really. Remember quests about bringing documents to Rivet City museum? Or getting some Lincoln stuff to ex-slaves? I think they would be some people (like Tempenny) who would pay A LOT of caps for some good sort of pre-war art. More you know about art - more money You will get.

I don't think it would be out of place, really. It made me think of the Postman, actually (not a very good movie as a whole, but did have some interesting aspects.) Entertainment is actually an important survival skill that's often overlooked. If you can't keep your spirits up in the face of adversity, you're much more likely to give up. The survival value of building a fire, for example, if you're lost in the wilderness - it has more to do with keeping warm; it provides you with something useful to do and lifts your spirits once you've accomplished it.

A travelling bard or something of the sort would be a very valuable commodity in the Wastes, really.

You might have some troubles incorporating it into the existing system, and making it useful enough to focus on, though. But I don't see why it couldn't work, and I certainly think it fits.

True.

I'm gonna say that while it would be mildly amusing to have to sing and dance your way out of being shredded by super-mutant minigun fire, gamewise it wouldn't really make sense to add an "art" skill as all the advantages can already be gained through exsiting traits, skills, stats, etc. Charisma, barter, magnetic personality, etc... The main difference being that these skills have a much more broad application. For example knowing about a painting from pre-war that most merchants don't give a frogs fart about doesn't help you sell it, barter does. Sure it has some promise but it's overall application would be very limited and overlap other systems already in place.

Ever hear of the phrase "Music soothes the savage beast." What if music was a type of weapon that made aggressive people a little more reluctant to kill you, as long as it was the music they liked of course. Think about it, Frank Sinatra was spared from a Mobsters bullet because he was a Singer that a Godfather liked. I think it could be a great element to add into the game if it doesn't brake the backs of those putting the system into the game.

a) Note that muties are not very smart. In F1 You could speak-your-way-out by telling Harry that You are robot, new race of mutant or even calling him 'mom'. "Poor wandering musican" might be work as well.

b ) I also think that some 'more organized' raiders would let You go if You'll cooporate with them. Even if hostile - they would keep You as a prisoner, rather than killing. (and giving You a chance to escape)

c) How about telling Your enemy that You are a songwriter, and You feel really impressed by him. And You would like to tell more people how 'great n'godlike' he is.. but to do this, You must be set free. I'm sure some people will swallow it.

d) And one more sentence: "He's just another crazy punk. Not dangerous. Leave'em". Play weak and You'll live forever.

Belive me. There a lot of ways to avoid trouble if You got some talents.


Plasma rifle may use big guns skill, and laser pistol - small guns, and Alien Blaster - science. But they are not.
Hacking terminals or getting extra HPs from stimpacks might by accessable by perks. But not - they have their own skills.
I se no reason why art couldn't be as a separate skill. Especially that it have so many applications.


As I said - both skills might be used. To know how to sell something is one. To know it true value is another.

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EDIT:
When You bring some lincoln' stuff to hannibal, he offers some money to you. You can use barter/speech to increase amount of caps You can get.
It might work similar with selling pre-war art. There would be some Colectioners who will pay for bringing art-stuff to them. In that case art skill would be used to increase payment.

When selling art-stuff to wastelanders - barter skill would be used, but the items would be almost worthless anyway.

I think it has a place in a PnP RPG, but not in a CRPG

um yea :shakehead:

Like I say, it could be implemented well enough to be usefull, but it would overlap and essentialy be a throw away skill, in fallout 2 I became a boxer, I became a porm star, but I never put any points into "boxing" or "porm starring" skills. I think "artist" as a title would be much better than "art" as a tag skill. Again, everything you have listed as perks for having an art skill are already in the game, just under different names and with a wider application. Perhaps by completing a preset quest the artist title can be applied and offer a bonus, but the fallout universe is not an upbeat, music playing, picture painting, kind of world. If you really wanna play as a bard play some fantasy rpg.

That. Make it a perk.

I think this is an AWESOME idea. Maybe not so much for the visual arts, but for music at least. And for me to say that, it's really something.

Sure sure, knowing how to sing or play a guitar may seem useless when you look at it in the context of the world, but you need to think of it this way.

People with a skill for artistic expression are practically an extinct species. You could actually be singularly UNIQUE as an individual if you had developed a talent for this sort of thing while in the vault.

New music is not being made anymore. The only music anyone knows, in fact, is the few records ThreeDog plays, or ancestral songs passed down through generations. In the previous Fallouts, music was non-existant. The only thing I remember is one of the tanker vagrants saying he had a band.

One of the reasons that classical musicians were so popular, and so celebrated, is because it was so RARE for a person to be educated in music, or have access to an instrument. Only in the last 100 years, since the invention of the phonograph, has the common person had easy access to music just to LISTEN to, let alone perform.

This is the reason the old songs like "My Darlin' Clementine", "Bicycle Built for Two", "She'll be comin' round the mountain", etc. were popular; without the ability to listen to a song repeatedly, and since so few people played instruments, it had to be simple enough to be remembered with minimal listenings.

Therefor, in the Wasteland, where NOBODY hears new music, or makes it, or even KNOWS anybody who OWNS an instrument, let alone plays one, a talented musician would probably be viewed with awe, almost like a magician.

No matter how tough life is for the people of the wasteland, they DO require entertainment. All humans do. And they DO have spare time. In practice, obviously, as everyone in the game wanders around without really DOING much, but in concept, too. EVERYBODY takes a time-out at some point.

When they do, it'd be cool to be the dude playing the ruined old piano in the corner in return for free drinks, or to impress the sloot at the end of the bar. Much like real life.

It would also give you something to do with all those Harmonicas.