you mean I don't have to level stupid minor skills I don't care about?

OMG no longer an RPG!

I am encouraged by everyone's responses so far, no one seems to be completely hating the changes - I was expecting at a few large rants about this

I am all in favour of an overhaul of the character building elements, I never did get why we had things like Acrobatics, maybe I was missing something

I would have liked Strength to be in there as well as Stamina though

but we've gained an entire dimension, Perks, which end up giving more customization/specialization than Oblivion.

Encumbrance perks of course. They could use simple perks that just let you carry more, but they could also include some more advanced perks. Maybe a perk on the sneak tree that makes treasure items weigh less, or a perk that makes arrows weightless and cheaper. They could just spread out a few simple encumbrance perks over many skills. Have one in barter smiting and sneaking. If you had all three skills, you would be able to pick up all three. It makes some sense. People who spread out there skills need to carry more items to support them.

Anything we lost here we gained 10 fold from perks.You can mod in what ever the attributes would do with a cure all perk.

Double post.

This is the first disappointing thing I am hearing ... and it seems to follow an very dangerouse tendency of late game sequels like Crysis 2 and Dragon age 2 flops , they changed it too much consollized that they lost their appeal , interest and become just another consolle among many games .... I hope this is not happening to skyrim too , Why remove Attirbutes ? This makes it feel less and less a RPG!

Probably based on your race, gender, and maybe stanima.
Also someone said something about using perks, thats a good bet.

But there better have plenty of athletic and acrobatic like perks - Like less fall damage or longer sprint or something. Or a giant sprint jump


- Prometheus, I doubt this has anything to do with consoles....

I think its a good thing less [censored] micromanagement and more tangible physical results.

What I've been saying for a while, since I've been suspecting the removal of attributes from when they first said you give bonuses to health, magicka, and stamina at level up: let stamina derive your encumberance. Letting your max stamina determine how much you can carry makes sense to me, and it makes stamina just as important as health and magicka. Plus I don't think it would work very well as a perk, because carrying capacity is important for more than one skill, and I really don't want to see multiple skills having the same perk in their trees.

One of the things I loved when I first started Morrowind was the huge selection of skills and attributes you could pick from, it felt like you could do anything. I haven't read a whole lot on Skyrim as I want it to be a surprise but hopefully they didn't change what made the Elder Scroll games so unique, I still want to pick from a huge list of skills like before and not feel so confined to certain things.

I dont know you guys but for me a RPG was and is about spending also a lot of time on creating your character , balancing your stats , deciding the perks and all the stuff befoure get into game , all those semplifications are really starting to annoy me since I have already seen two of my favourite games f=)$=%$= up by the CONSOLLIZATION plague !!!

It also seems to be a current fad for people to ignore the fact that the flawed features being thrown out are being replaced by a new feature that is different but accomplishes the very thing that the "improved feature" would have done and more. So I don't understand how people can be outraged when the new systems in place does everything the old system did but better. I just don't get it but that's me.

A huge skill list isn't really what makes TES unique. In fact it's probably the thing it has in common with most other RPGs.




Now you spend your time balancing your perks . Also, how is getting rid of attributes consolizing?? To me, consolizing is making the controls simpler, then UI bigger and aiming the graphics at the consoles.

I love the idea because of all the extra role play actions you can add along with the animations. I would rather have a perk that lets me eat the heart of an any enemy I kill versus lame stat modifiers.

You can still customize your stats, but during gameplay rather than at the beginning.

As I've said in other threads, I'm looking forward to seeing how the "no attributes" system works, because the massive pile of metagaming that was involved in Oblivion stats (picking un-used Major skills to "control" leveling; doing repetitive and boring "training" activities - like weighting down your cast key because it was going to take you 45 minutes of 1-pt Resto spells to force your next level; keeping a record sheet of all your skill gains so that you'd know when you had +5 stat bonuses; etc) was pretty annoying, actually.


Yeah, there are a few concerns. But the stat & leveling system in Oblivion wasn't some amazing paragon that defies change. :shrug:

This.

This.

As far as I know they haven't. As others said the whole encumberance thing will probably be perk related.

This way you loose the characterization of your character, it is sliding toward an dragonage II dangerouse path , they removed everything there yes you can pick a race and model a biut the face and then you get the character they prepared for you , no other customization ? I think personally is a bad choice and very very bad idea , may be I am traditionalist but DAMN I loved Morrowind system with all the micro management stuff and little slots for armour pieces , they get simplifying and simplifying and this I do not like at all ...

fatique or health depending on how thre balance works.

Yes and no. First of all your example is very hypothetical and we know enugh about the skill system to get a bit more specific. We basically know that there are two skills for melee weapons one hand and two hand, but that perks are grouped in axe/sword/mace. Now back to your example. Lets say we have two people Warrior mic one hand and magey mic magic. The warrior has built himself up to be a one handed combat master well magey is built to be a magic master.

They both pick up a two hand axe. Now you would think they are both just as good, but that's not the case. Both have 0 skill in two hand, but the warrior gets some fringe benefits from his one hand skill. To start with, he has more stamina. That is used to make power attacks with all melee weapons. Next, he has the bleeding axe perk from the one hand skill. That perk counts on all axes not just one hand axes. The mage, has nothing. He can't even use his spells with that weapon.

I wrote that we've lost a large chunk of our INITIAL character build . . . perks come later.

FO3 had both and that worked pretty well.

Simplifing is not a bad thing and the features that they are changing for Skyrim such as getting rid of Attributes is a good thing. Heck I was just playing Oblivion a couple minutes ago and I'm trying to get those 4 more points of Hand To Hand so that I can have 5 Strength for my level, Even though my character is a battle mage. Yeah the system is flawed and I'm glad the attributes are gone I won't miss them at all.