Auto-travel in Skyrim : V - Skyrim

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 3:08 pm

Just take Morrowinds system and incorporation it into Skyrim. Problem solved.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 6:03 pm

Just take Morrowinds system and incorporation it into Skyrim. Problem solved.

And also keep Horses for small trip between the town you reached with morrowind style fast travel and the cave you want to explore.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:32 am

People who didn't want to use it were happy? Are you serious? Is that why a thread pops up every freaking week on this subject?

I really need to make this clearer because I realized I failed to do so before. I want fast travel. I don't want Oblivion fast travel because I (as in me) think (as in my opinion) that it was a lazy, un-fun, un-immersive implementation.

True, you are right.

Yes but does the 'if you don't like it, you don't have to use it' attitude not seem correct to you? There was no penalty for not using fast travel, there was no penalty for using fast travel. So if it doesn't affect you in any way....why complain about it?

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:08 am

Yes but does the 'if you don't like it, you don't have to use it' attitude not seem correct to you? There was no penalty for not using fast travel, there was no penalty for using fast travel. So if it doesn't affect you in any way....why complain about it?

Umm... it kind of does effect me because I have to travel, obviously. To me Oblivion style fast travel deteriorates the experience, and does not help to make me feel like the world is real. Also, and here's a point you might be surprised to hear me say, running everywhere all of the time is boring.

~~If you read my post on the first page, and DonTheDunmer's you might get what I mean~~.
Here I'll show you

Fast travel took out most of the fun from the game. You didn't have to use it, but you ended up using it anyway.
I think system that is is cross breed between Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion could work.

Fast Travel System where you can fast travel safely by paying for it (like in Morrowind).
If you don't have the money for boat, caravan etc you could Fast Travel recklessly (like in Oblivion and Daggerfall) with chance of getting diseases, health loss etc. or cautiously by staying in Inns and lose money that way.
Mounts or running can get you there as well, for free with the benefits of finding locations but also running into bears and cliff racers. You'd just have to do that manually to get the benefits.

System like this would reward the player for going for adventure, once you have enough loot and you have done the trip thousand times, you can hop on the slitstrider and pay for the trip. This would mean that the paid travelling would be twice as expensive as it was in Morrowind, if not more. No problem when you have lots of money. The game needs more ways for the player to use money, once you have the gear you need and the house you need you only need to worry about travel costs and keeping that gear repaired.

My whole reasoning for disliking fast travel (the way it's done in Oblivion) is it's just not fun to me. It's not immersive, and it feels like an extremely lazy solution to the problem of needing travel in a huge open world.

I think Morrowind did it the best out of the Elder Scrolls games, but it still didn't do it perfectly. It was more of a step in the right direction, and I think it really svcks that they decided to scrap it rather than expand on it.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:45 am

As the saying goes, the journey is half the fun. And fast-travel cuts that in half again.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:16 pm

So you're saying we should all spend 20 minutes in real time running to the next town and back 5 times to complete a quest? If you want to do that, you should be able to have the option yes - but people who just want to get the quest done and play it casually should also have the option to do it in their spare time, should they not?

Read http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1149173-auto-travel-in-skyrim/page__view__findpost__p__16804186. It's not about removing fast travel. It's about making it more realistic.
If you don't want to play the game for exploration, just for the quests go right ahead.

For me that falls in the category of the game playing itself. You don't need to do any thinking when the arrow shows exactly where you need to go. You don't even have to read what you need to do. Top that with the ability that you don't even have to walk to that quest marker, just teleport there instantly.
I think that makes it too easy. If you want the game to play itself while it teleports you to your desired location at least get some things that aren't benefits. For example losing bit of your money for staying at inns for the night. Getting diseases if your character is unlucky. Get health loss and damage to your armour from encounters on the way.
Go check out how Daggerfalls fast travel was done. Even that is improvement over what Oblivions Fast travel is. With improvements on the interface that'd already be great. Just top that with option that stops it being the easy button.

Your argument sounds to me like saying "I just want to admire the views in the game. FastFight makes me skip all the unnecessary time spent fighting bandits and wolves I come across". But nobody thinks like that right? Actually, that was the only reason my mother played Oblivion.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:36 pm

Umm... it kind of does effect me because I have to travel, obviously. To me Oblivion style fast travel deteriorates the experience, and does not help to make me feel like the world is real. Also, and here's a point you might be surprised to hear me say, running everywhere all of the time is boring.

If you read my post on the last page, and DonTheDunmer's you might get what I mean.

I read all the posts in a thread before I make a comment don't worry!

I think you seem to be taking what I've been saying in a negative fashion, I mentioned earlier that I would gladly support the option to have it turned on / off or have a morrowind style system. I have just been attempting to demonstrate that there ARE different types of people out there, and that Bethesda has to cater for all of them by finding a middle ground of sorts. I don't believe anything I've been saying is irrelevant, nor do I believe anything I've said is offensive.

I naturally appreciate your opinion and I honestly hope that we all get something we enjoy in the next one. Please do not take my words so negatively in the future - if I make a point I should be allowed to defend it like you and others do

"Your argument sounds to me like saying "I just want to admire the views in the game. FastFight makes me skip all the unnecessary time spent fighting bandits and wolves I come across". But nobody thinks like that right? Actually, that was the only reason my mother played Oblivion. "

I think you got the reverse from what I'm trying to say

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:58 am

If I keep hearing "but, immersion!" as a reason people loathe a totally optional feature I'm going to start bashing my head on the desk. If that bothers your "immersion", I'd hate to know what the menu screens do. Or the health bars, the HUD, the speedy day-night cycle, and the ton of other unrealistic things TES has. Hell, Morrowind's travel was immersion breaking enough - they'd just stand there 24 hours a day waiting to haul you somewhere.

I used OB's fast travel. I'll admit it - it's not about immersion or fun or whatever, it's removing tedium. If I'm just say, hauling junk from Dungeon X to my house, I'll be damned if I walk back and forth four times.

As far as Skyrim goes, Morrowind's system would work..with a bit of tweaking. Guild Mages wouldn't want to transport just anyone across the country and back, not everywhere is going to have access to a river..

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 4:15 pm

I read all the posts in a thread before I make a comment don't worry!

I think you seem to be taking what I've been saying in a negative fashion, I mentioned earlier that I would gladly support the option to have it turned on / off or have a morrowind style system. I have just been attempting to demonstrate that there ARE different types of people out there, and that Bethesda has to cater for all of them by finding a middle ground of sorts. I don't believe anything I've been saying is irrelevant, nor do I believe anything I've said is offensive.

I naturally appreciate your opinion and I honestly hope that we all get something we enjoy in the next one. Please do not take my words so negatively in the future - if I make a point I should be allowed to defend it like you and others do

I'm not offended, and I wasn't implying that you didn't read it. I was suggesting you go back and read it (or read it if you haven't) so you can see what I want with the game.

I'm not trying to figure out what Bethesda is actually going to do, because at the end of the day that's speculation, not a suggestion. Also, you asked me why complain about it? So I answered you. I feel like they are not catering to people like me, and I feel like as much as we (people who agree with me) try to let people know our position it just keeps getting misrepresented over and over. Even by you saying you would support the option to have it turned on/off or have a Morrowind style system, it seems that you don't really get what my stance is.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:02 pm

I'm not offended, and I wasn't implying that you didn't read it. I was suggesting you go back and read it (or read it if you haven't) so you can see what I want with the game.

I'm not trying to figure out what Bethesda is actually going to do, because at the end of the day that's speculation, not a suggestion. Also, you asked me why complain about it? So I answered you. I feel like they are not catering to people like me, and I feel like as much as we (people who agree with me) try to let people know our position it just keeps getting misrepresented over and over. Even by you saying you would support the option to have it turned on/off or have a Morrowind style system, it seems that you don't really get what my stance is.

I do get what your stance is - you want a fast travel system that doesn't let you go everywhere in the game willy nilly once you've discovered it. However, using a Morrowind style system is very close to what you're suggesting - only being able to travel between towns. What I was suggesting by turning it on / off however is that people who just want to jump in, do quests, get rewards and money, finish the game should be able to do that, and people like yourself who have time / desire to have a longer, more enriching experience should get to do the same. Perhaps by making a hardcoe mode like I mentioned earlier, fast travel could only be restricted to towns.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:14 am

I do get what your stance is - you want a fast travel system that doesn't let you go everywhere in the game willy nilly once you've discovered it. However, using a Morrowind style system is very close to what you're suggesting - only being able to travel between towns. What I was suggesting by turning it on / off however is that people who just want to jump in, do quests, get rewards and money, finish the game should be able to do that, and people like yourself who have time / desire to have a longer, more enriching experience should get to do the same. Perhaps by making a hardcoe mode like I mentioned earlier, fast travel could only be restricted to towns.

Actually, I want a cross between Daggerfall (sort of includes Oblivion), and Morrowind. Give us immersive fast travel (boats, mounts, ect.), and make it cost a lot for the convenience. And give us instant fast travel, with negative effects (ala Daggerfall), also for the convenience. That way if you don't have money, and you can't afford to risk instant fast-traveling you have to run. To me it would make it much more interesting, and rewarding.

Pretty much this

I think system that is is cross breed between Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion could work.

Fast Travel System where you can fast travel safely by paying for it (like in Morrowind).
If you don't have the money for boat, caravan etc you could Fast Travel recklessly (like in Oblivion and Daggerfall) with chance of getting diseases, health loss etc. or cautiously by staying in Inns and lose money that way.
Mounts or running can get you there as well, for free with the benefits of finding locations but also running into bears and cliff racers. You'd just have to do that manually to get the benefits.

System like this would reward the player for going for adventure, once you have enough loot and you have done the trip thousand times, you can hop on the slitstrider and pay for the trip. This would mean that the paid traveling would be twice as expensive as it was in Morrowind, if not more. No problem when you have lots of money. The game needs more ways for the player to use money, once you have the gear you need and the house you need you only need to worry about travel costs and keeping that gear repaired.

And yes, I get it. That's just my opinion. And yours differs from mine.

The reason for this argument is because you were asking why people who don't want Oblivion fast-travel can't just avoid it, in other words not use it. I was telling you, that you were missing the point.

» Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:01 am

The point I was making is that at some point you have to draw the line. Having an option where the player can wizz around the map instantly whether they've previously explored it or not may be fun for some people but it is hardly in the spirit of the game. With an option like fast-travel from anywhere I think that also oversteps the mark. But anyway, I can acknowledge that people want to play this way and accept the option should be open to them. I do not accept that it should be the default option though like it was in Oblivion. The choice should be made when you first start up a new character and then you're stuck with it. I also don't like the idea of changing difficultly on the fly either, but that's another story.

Oblivion's leveled enemies system is so incredibly broken that without the ability to adjust the difficulty it can get to the point where it takes ages to defeat individual enemies. Besides that, I just have to agree to disagree with you. I don't like the idea of taking control away from the player. I think that's one of the game's strengths. Possibly dozens of hours later I don't think an option should be set in stone forever. That's why I suggested the ini file. It's out of the way, but not something that lasts forever.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 3:00 pm

I'd like something like the Silt Strider system, where you have to pay if you want to fast travel.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:44 am

I do get what your stance is - you want a fast travel system that doesn't let you go everywhere in the game willy nilly once you've discovered it. However, using a Morrowind style system is very close to what you're suggesting - only being able to travel between towns. What I was suggesting by turning it on / off however is that people who just want to jump in, do quests, get rewards and money, finish the game should be able to do that, and people like yourself who have time / desire to have a longer, more enriching experience should get to do the same. Perhaps by making a hardcoe mode like I mentioned earlier, fast travel could only be restricted to towns.

With the method I'd design fast travel, you could travel to every location you've found - just like in Oblivion. Only that I'd remove the easy button factor of it.
Essentially you'd have these choices:

To get from Anvil to Imperial City, you could choose from these:
Manually travel there, with your feet or your mount at no cost, unless you run into trouble that you cannot run away from.
Get a boat that gets you there for 200 gold. You wont get into any trouble on the way.
Fast Travel there recklessly for no gold, but you'll likely run into trouble on the way. You might arrive there at night when the city gates are closed and you need to wait until morning, climb the city walls or levitate over them. The bandits you ran into also chipped away 1/4th of your health and some durability from your gear.
Fast travel there cautiously for 50 gold. You'll end up at your destination in good condition. The trip will take longer in-game time, because you tried to avoid fights (although not completely). You also had to sleep in Inn on your way there.

The interface would also allow you to skip using an Inn, skip using methods of transportation etc for less cost but more chance to run into danger - almost just like in Daggerfall. You could also travel to locations you didn't know that were there, mostly cities and towns if you pay for your trip, then you don't have to be the guide or know the way.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:45 am

Read the first page, skimmed the second, skipped the rest. So I apologise for repeating someone elses' idea here.

I personally didn't like Oblivion's Fast-Travel, and I loved Morrowind's. I think it's a mistake to make Fast-Travel too convenient. It's like giving the character a weapon that one-hit KO's the enemy 100% of the time; the end result is the same, but you're skipping all the hard work that got you there.

I understand the need for Fast-Travel, especially in a world the size of Elder Scrolls or Fallout. I just think it needs to be implemented with a little more finesse.

Perhaps Fast-Travel between all guarded highways could be accessable to everyone regardless of mounts, inns or carriages; Fast-Travel off the beaten path requires a carriage or mount; and Fast-Travel to secluded locations requires a personal mount.

That way, a newbie can't just stumble onto some amazing treasure when being chased through a forest by an Ogre, then just fast travel back when s/he's more experienced.

It might also be possible for the game to track specific routes taken between locations, and depending on some arbitrary Danger Rating, the character can travel their own personal paths that are faster and less dangerous than other more well-known roads... or something. I don't know...

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:18 am

I really don't see Bethesda changing fast travel away from what it is now, mainly because it provides the player with Convenience and is welcomed by most players. If they take it out or make it much more difficult, people will complain and the game is "less fun" for the majority of peeps that don't want to travel the hard way.

From a game-play perspective, FastTravel is a winner - as players who want to use it Have it, and those who don't like it can simply Not use it - problem solved, everyone wins.

That and the fact that Fast Travel has been implemented the same way for the last 3 Bethesda-produced AAA titles leads me to believe that we will see the same in TES V.

Miax

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:38 pm

It is optional, you don't have to use it if you don't want too...

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 3:38 pm

I never liked Oblivion's fast travel system but it wasn't just because it ruined immersion for me. In Morrowind you had so many different options of ways to travel but in Oblivion it was reduced to riding a horse, using your own two feet or fast travel. I wouldn't mind fast travel so much if there were more options for those of us that don't want to use it.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:10 pm

I really don't see Bethesda changing fast travel away from what it is now, mainly because it provides the player with Convenience and is welcomed by most players. If they take it out or make it much more difficult, people will complain and the game is "less fun" for the majority of peeps that don't want to travel the hard way.

From a game-play perspective, FastTravel is a winner - as players who want to use it Have it, and those who don't like it can simply Not use it - problem solved, everyone wins.

That and the fact that Fast Travel has been implemented the same way for the last 3 Bethesda-produced AAA titles leads me to believe that we will see the same in TES V.

Miax

'Simply don't use it' isn't a way to handle the complaints. The complainers want fast travel, they just want handled differently from Oblivion. Fast travel has been one of the major focal points for TES fans ever since Oblivion released, Bethesda just ignoring it and recycling the Oblivion method wouldn't be practical at all.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 10:49 am

I say bring back the way it was used in Morrowind.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:51 am

'Simply don't use it' isn't a way to handle the complaints. The complainers want fast travel, they just want handled differently from Oblivion. Fast travel has been one of the major focal points for TES fans ever since Oblivion released, Bethesda just ignoring it and recycling the Oblivion method wouldn't be practical at all.

I think people tend to confuse the two groups. It's important to distinguish between the people who want FT, who like the convenience, but just want it implemented differently, and the people who don't want FT at all.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:05 pm

Im not totally against OBs fast travel, I usually make a damage health/fatigue etc spell so I can hurt myself according to what I made up happened. I think it would please everyone if they added some sort of random encounters that will force you back into the game, only skipping "the boring part". Like say while fast traveling (walking) somwhere your character sees a trader being attacked, the game will 'force' you back to defend/protect it.Same applies with monsters, if they attack youll be 'forced' to fight.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 9:49 pm

'Simply don't use it' isn't a way to handle the complaints. The complainers want fast travel, they just want handled differently from Oblivion. Fast travel has been one of the major focal points for TES fans ever since Oblivion released, Bethesda just ignoring it and recycling the Oblivion method wouldn't be practical at all.

Especially now that they have different engine.

You don't fix design flaws by keeping them in.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:54 pm

I want something like daggerfall.

» Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:36 pm

Hmmm...

I do like the idea of losing money and health, depending on how far you travel. Or like in RDR, letting you watch as your character travels or just skip it altogether.