[Ebony Lawson]

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1093401-relz-bananasplits-better-cities-thread-34/

"This is a translation of Bananasplit's awesome Better Cities mod, which aims at making all the cities in the game more beautiful.
All credit goes to Bananasplit for the creation of his mod, I merely translated some names and the new Guide to Skingrad."
SATU

As you know we took over the job started by Satu with Skingrad and Bravil. The following cities from Bananasplit's Better Cities were also translated:
- Imperial City Market
- Chorrol
- Anvil
- Leyawiin
Then we added Reckless' Better City Cheydinhal, Wolfslady's Better City Bruma & Better Arboretum, SilentResident's ImpeREAL, jf2ln Anvil Bay and Bravil Dock and finally OnWard Softworks (aka TheXanadu & TheLastVoice) 's Leyawiin Port.

All these files are in the same pack in http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16513.
Expect new Patches/Fixes/Enhancements every Now and Then

Find the http://www.scharesoft.de/joomla/forum/showthread.php?t=18464.
Find the http://tesall.ru/files/oblivion/betcities/.

_______________________________________________________
Technical Features:
Unique range of formID for each City/district:
Allow the merging of the esp while using TES4Gecko to never change any formID and thus banishing forever the need of clean saves between different version (started on version 4.3.0). This step was needed because of the Modularity of the mod. [Tool used: TES4Edit]
Modularity:
Each city and each IC District is offered in two ways: as a separate ESP on its own, or as part of two merged Full ESPs. This allows users to pick and choose which cities/Districts to use, so if they don't like one they can choose not to use it, or if a city or District conflicts with another mod they use, they can choose not to use it. Yet if you do want to use all cities, there's a single ESP for all, and if you want all IC Districts, there's a single ESP for all, which helps reduce the number of active ESPs in your load order if you do want every city and every District. We expand this concept into the City Defences ESPs - separate ESPs for each city, or a single Full ESP for all of them. And then again with the FPS patch ESPs as well! [Tool used: Brains!!!]
Unique worldspace in the Imperial City:
Allow to have a separate Map for the Imperial City and also to banish any conflict with any mod dealing with the Imperial Isle (Unique Landscape Imperial Isle and others) as the districts do not share their landscape edition with the Imperial Isle anymore. The drawback is that the Better Imperial City needs to be loaded last (or so) in your load order to ensure that no mod is resetting the IC to its initial worldspace. You also can't fast travel outside the city (Speed is Limited!) but you need to get out of the IC to be able to fast travel to other places outside the IC. [Tool used: TES4Edit]
Way of dealing with Doors:
We replace the doors by BC version of the same doors when we have to move them from their vanilla position. The vanilla doors are disabled and made non persistent so that their state wont be kept in your saved game and if you remove Better Cities, the vanilla doors will automatically be back at their right place without any issue. [Tool used: Brains!!!]
Customization:
Nearly each city/district has its own customization based on the users preferences on gore, FPS issue and compatibility with other mods. The customization comes in 2 different way: In Game Menu for those who use OBSE (which is recommended also to use Streamline and lower the FPS hit of Better Cities) and Manual where the user needs to enter some console commands to achieve the customization desired. [Tool used: OBSE and Brains]
BAIN & Scripted Installation:
The installation which comes in 3 archives (Mains files with the esp/esm, Main resources with the bsa archives and Update to the Resources if and when needed) is all scripted to facilitate an omod installation with Oblivion Mod Manager. In the same way, the archives are packaged to allow an easy BAIN Installation when Using Wrye Bash. [Tool Used: OBMM and Wrye Bash]
Cleaned ESP:
All our plugins are cleaned with TES4Edit to limit the conflicts with Oblivion Vanilla and Other mods. Of course this doesn't mean that others mods wont conflict with Better Cities but just that we took extreme precautions to limit those conflict as much as we could. Before reporting any conflict, make sure that Better Cities is loaded after the mod you think is conflicting. [Tool used: TES4Edit]
PiFFYed Meshes:
All our meshes are PyFFIed and further stripped of useless data to ensure an optimum performance in game. [Tool used: PyFFI]
BSA Archives:
All the main resources are then packaged into BSA archives (when this is possible) to allow an easy install/uninstall. The BSA are separated into different categories for customization purposes (B&M or vanilla Bravil textures for instance) and translation purposes (English Names on Textures and English Dialogs which can be replaced by their translated version for any other language). [OBMM BSA Creator]
An ESM (A Master):
Early on we found that some new resources were being used by more than one city. Without an ESM, this means duplication of base objects in each ESP - not very tidy! So we adopted a single ESM to contain base records for all cities and Districts to reference as needed. Dialogue also goes into the ESM, as some of our dialogue is voiced, but voice files are stored in the Data folder based upon the ESM or ESP they are used by - since BC is modular, this gets messy as the same dialogue used by Better Cities - Chorrol.esp is needed by Better Cities Full.esp. So to avoid duplication of MP3s, the dialogue was moved into the ESM, allowing the MP3s to be stored once for use by the ESM only. Also (!) we store ALL interiors in the ESM instead of in each city or District ESP which makes creation of AI packages simpler as they can safely reference interiors from multiple cities or Districts. At the same time, this allows for the possibility of other ESPs to use the BC interiors without needing to be dependent on the BC ESPs. This means more to modders than mod users of course! [Tools used: TES4Edit and Brains!!!]
Built-in compatibility with other popular mods:
(Where possible)
Better Cities is specially tweaked in some locations to enable compatibility with other conflicting mods, without the need for patches. Examples include Bravil for Lost Spires, Bruma for Heart of the Dead, and the Arboretum for Let the People Drink. Lost Spires moved the city walls and raised some land up beside the Chapel to place a new building. Better Cities also moves the city walls to match Lost Spires, and raises the land height, so that Lost Spires' new building fits in perfectly. Yet this area is NOT left empty if you don't use Lost Spires. Without Lost Spires, you'll find a burnt out house ruin on the same spot, so you won't realize the area is reserved for Lost Spires. We do this for other mods as well! [Tool used: Brains!!!]

_______________________________________________________
Requirements
Official Oblivion Patched with http://static.gamesas.com/Oblivion/Oblivion_v1.2.0416English.exe (or whichever version you need for your language.

_______________________________________________________
Video Preview
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9Iu5Mu22sQ by mrcrusty. Thanks!!!
You can also http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14584 to get a better quality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ajw0xdSCOg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdz3nwPw7S8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSz3WoNrYTw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh4wwpDXVjM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Q8DQkT2TPQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zBpGMyIEnw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41ryK572TkY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMarn0-gblQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FlqGNQbsIw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGGmbXUbwIM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzCHYT1tR7E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNlqwF41bX4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usNORqG7V-I
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrFgnwf7ems

_______________________________________________________
Compatibility Patches & Fixes
Textures mods: No textures is altered by these mods so any mod changing the textures is compatible.
Unofficial Oblivion Patch: This mod is recommended with Better Cities because it fixes many things like for instance the giant scrying balls being handled as static without havoc which comes handy around Bruma, plus many other things that should have been addressed by Bethesda.

Already Compatible
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11495 OK (Arrival at Leyawiin Harbour possible by Robert Evrae. This requires OBSE v14+)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19039 OK (created compatible by RGM)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=12016: OK (special version of Bravil)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9858: OK (source Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=12249 (aka MMM, OOO, Fran & Warcry): OK (source Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7825: OK (source Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9724: OK (source Lyre)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13692: OK (version 1.3+)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=15617: OK (source Greenwarden & IceMan80)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14829: OK (source SheerShaw)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7902: OK (source Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11249: OK (source Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=6895 OK (Compatible esp created by Geniel)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=17201 OK (Compatible esp created by Lametrie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14425: OK (source Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=17644 OK (created compatible via quest by AlexKnight1978)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16316 OK (created compatible by Ervvyn with OBSE v0014a+ detection)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=6846: OK (source Bluepie)
http://www.lostspires.com: OK
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9655: OK (source Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19628 OK (by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13303: OK integrated in Better Cities IC Market and Temple Districts.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19589: OK Integrated in Better Cities.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10256: OK Integrated in Better Cities IC.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14957: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Market District.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3868: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Talos Plaza.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3771: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Palace.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4620: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Temple District.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4650: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Temple District.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4651: OK Integrated into Better Cities IC Temple District.
http://kvatch.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=887: OK (Source BBC Team)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22226: OK (Source Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=6779: OK (Source Vorians)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11999: OK (Source Vorians)
http://theelderscrolls.info/?go=dlfile&fileid=349: OK (BG2408)

Minor Issues
http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=oblivionmods.detail&id=991: OK except for few floating signs (source Whitestrake)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14853: OK need to disable a wine barrel with the console (source Vorians)

Incompatible
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14442: NO but Better Cities have their own City Defenses now.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11333: NO with IC Market only (source 2Cold Scorpio-RGc1)
http://www.leiawen.net/ceedee/BabSite/html/addons.html: NO with IC Market only (source wmj)
Artifacts of the Ancestors with Blood & Mud and thus with Blood & Mud Editions of Better Cities.

Users Fixes and Patches
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4954: OK (Fix by StarLion) http://rapidshare.com/files/77526935/IWR-Windows.esp.html.
http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11027: OK (fix by Trader01) http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14490.
http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=oblivionmods.detail&id=4513 http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=17454: OK (Patch by Roxas116)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=18203 OK (http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19263)

Patches & Fixes included in the Extras
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14601: OK (BBC must be loaded after VHB to ensure highest compatibility) (Patch by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3172: OK (Fix by Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11778 OK (fix by Vorians)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14939 OK (patch by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13692: OK (fix by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19228 OK (patch by Vorians)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=10223 OK since version 2.4
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9450: OK (source Vorians and Blupie fixes)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19058 OK (made compatible by Ismelda)
http://www.stephanewuttunee.net/tnr_tie.html: OK (by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3027: OK (Patch by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7155: OK (Fix by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11598: OK (Patch by BluePie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7663: OK (fix by Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=8714: OK (Patch by Bluepie)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9357: OK (by Ismelda)
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=11189: OK (Patch by Vorians - get all Vorians http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13834).
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=5156: OK (Patch by Vorians) Load Better Cities after Thievery in the Imperial City and the patch after Better Cities.
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3849: OK (Patch by Vorians)

_______________________________________________________
FPS Tips:
Use http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=795779
You can alter your Oblivion.ini file (After a Backup) to change these settings (http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=794126&st=129#)
fLODFadeOutActorMultCity: Default value is 1. Change it to lower the distance you see NPCs in the city. Suggestion 0.4 - 0.8
fLODFadeOutItemMultCity: Default value is 1. Change it to lower the distance you see items in the city. Suggestion 0.4 - 0.8
fLODFadeOutObjectMultCity: Default value is 1. Change it to lower the distance you see objects in the city. Suggestion 0.4 - 0.8
(I use it at 0.8 for the 3 of them).
_______________________________________________________
Possible Issues & FAQ
You might encounter some items that are really out of place when you update your Better Cities.
I don't have any explanantion on why this happens but the only way to fix it is:
- Uncheck the Better Cities plugins (cities, fixes, patchs at additions).
- Save your game.
- Re-enable the better cities plugins and load the game.
All should be back to normal. If you do not want to loose any quest progress (there are some small quests in now), do not uncheck the master (Better Cities Resources.esm) as it holds all the quests.

Also check our http://thenexusforums.com/index.php?showtopic=220413 for instant answers to most commonly asked questions.
_______________________________________________________
Bug Reports
Read the http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=449239 pinned in this forum.
- Try to make Beta Comments (Tracking Down Problems With Specific Mods in the Oblivion Mods FAQ)
- Post a picture of the issue if possible (we spent more time modding than actually playing. We test the stuff we just created but we are humans and still can't miss things).
- When taking a screenshot, open your console and type in

• SDT 33 (then enter)
  
• TDT (then enter and close the console)

This will bring to the screen coordinates, cell name and so on which helps to locate where you are and where your bug was found.
Open the console and type TDT again to remove all the info from your screen.
_______________________________________________________
Projects of Interest about Cities:
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=796509
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=817511

_______________________________________________________
Alternative Mods:
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19589 by SilentResident

_______________________________________________________
Free Doors and Used Free Doors:

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_ICMarketWestMap.jpg

Door 3 is reserved for the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19058.
Door 4 is reserved for the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3172.
Door 5 has an interior included in the ICMarket.
Door 6 is reserved for http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=8714.
Doors 1 & 2 are free.

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_ICMarketEastMap.jpg

Door 10 is reserved for the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=14957.
Door 11 is reserved for the http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=7155.
Door 13 is reserved for the http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13692.
Door 14 is reserved for the http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=13303.
Doors 7, 8, 9 & 15 are free.

http://bettercities.free.fr/2009/02/BBCMarketUpperLevelMap.jpg

Doors 16 & 19 are free.

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_AnvilMap.jpg - http://bettercities.free.fr/Maps/BC_Anvil_Map.jpg

Door 1 & 5 have an interior included in Anvil.
Doors 2, 3 & 4 are free.

http://bettercities.free.fr/Maps/BC_Bravil_B&M_Map.jpg

No Free Doors

http://bettercities.free.fr/2008/11/FD_BravilNorth.jpg

No Free Doors

http://bettercities.free.fr/2008/11/FD_BravilSouth.jpg

No Free Doors

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_LeyawiinMap.jpg

Door 4 is reserved for http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=8520
No Free Doors

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_LeyawiinDockMap.jpg

Doors 6 & 9 have interiors included in Leyawiin.
Doors 7 & 8 are free.

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_BrumaMap.jpg

No Free Doors

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_CheydinhalNorthMap.jpg
http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_CheydinhalSouthMap.jpg

No Free Doors.

http://ismeldalasombra.free.fr/2008/Oblivion/01/FD_ChorrolMap.jpg

No Free Doors
Door 3 is reserved for http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=24564

http://bettercities.free.fr/Maps/BC_Skingrad_Map.jpg

2 doors are free.

_______________________________________________________
Injected Records
Bananasplit's Better Cities Team will use a range of Injected ID into Oblivion.ESM which is from
0000FB00 to 0000FBFF
It is a range of 256 records which are free in Oblivion.ESM that we will use for toggle items to ensure compatibility with other mods without having to make patches or dependent files.
Please do not use any ID from this range in your own mods.

_______________________________________________________
For Translators:
My psd files of the shop signs are http://www.megaupload.com/?d=LCL06VKL

[lauraa]

We ensured some time ago, with Arthmoor and Veritas Secreto that TIE secret entrance where compatible with Better Cities, Open Better Cities and Open Cities Classic. There is no reason to suppose that this compatibility has been changed. Isn't it Arthmoor?

With regular TIE, sure. I haven't done anything to change that since you guys last looked at it, other than to make sure OCC/OCR support is working properly.

Thing is, I have no idea what state TIE In.esp is in, so I have no idea whether any of the support exists there at all.

[Facebook me]

With regular TIE, sure. I haven't done anything to change that since you guys last looked at it, other than to make sure OCC/OCR support is working properly.

Thing is, I have no idea what state TIE In.esp is in, so I have no idea whether any of the support exists there at all.

Well I don't either. We never did anything for that one. And some other TIE that were lurking around when we modified TIE.

May He Who Must Not Be Named be sacrificed on the altar of his own madness.

[gandalf]

I tried not to post but I'm getting nowhere fast am trying to update from 4.5.2b to current version, in OBMM I deactivate Better Cities and Install the new version, the installation if fine and the game starts up fine but while loading my save every time it just crashes, so I reinstall the 4.5.2b and do a clean save (was in Vindasle cave I think) uninstall and reinstall the new version again, game starts up fine and then my save loads only time I CTD when I try to exit the cave, same thing just keeps happening over and over so it left me no choice but to come and ask for help AGAIN

[Jonathan Braz]

I tried not to post but I'm getting nowhere fast am trying to update from 4.5.2b to current version, in OBMM I deactivate Better Cities and Install the new version, the installation if fine and the game starts up fine but while loading my save every time it just crashes, so I reinstall the 4.5.2b and do a clean save (was in Vindasle cave I think) uninstall and reinstall the new version again, game starts up fine and then my save loads only time I CTD when I try to exit the cave, same thing just keeps happening over and over so it left me no choice but to come and ask for help AGAIN

I suggest to try to exit your cave and go somewhere else while Better Cities is deactivated. Then you save and activate again to check. I have no clue why your game should crash like that but I will also recommend the use of OBSE with http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22282 which can indeed prevent a lot of crashes.

[FirDaus LOVe farhana]

I suggest to try to exit your cave and go somewhere else while Better Cities is deactivated. Then you save and activate again to check. I have no clue why your game should crash like that but I will also recommend the use of OBSE with http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=22282 which can indeed prevent a lot of crashes.

I'm already using Windom Earle Oblivion Crash Prevention System. Just so all is clear, upon installing, resource pack A and B should NOT be combine and should be installed separately via OBMM first pack A then pack B correct?

[sam westover]

I'm already using Windom Earle Oblivion Crash Prevention System. Just so all is clear, upon installing, resource pack A and B should NOT be combine and should be installed separately via OBMM first pack A then pack B correct?

You are. No combination because the script wont install the "Better Cities - Textures.bsa". So each archive get it own omod.

[Everardo Montano]

I suggest to try to exit your cave and go somewhere else while Better Cities is deactivated. Then you save and activate again to check.

Doing it that way worked, ideally clean saving in a cave or house (which has nothing to do with the mod) is supposed to be the best was no I don't know how it can have a negative effect :huh: but it's worked so where fine now. Thanks for that

[Nice one]

Doing it that way worked, ideally clean saving in a cave or house (which has nothing to do with the mod) is supposed to be the best was no I don't know how it can have a negative effect :huh: but it's worked so where fine now. Thanks for that

I would vote for the testing hall being the best because it is associated with few mods' real content... ^____^

[Elea Rossi]

I would vote for the testing hall being the best because it is associated with few mods' real content... ^____^

Didn't even cross my mind but I think I'll use there from now on lol, good shout :foodndrink:

[Project]

Doing it that way worked, ideally clean saving in a cave or house (which has nothing to do with the mod) is supposed to be the best was no I don't know how it can have a negative effect :huh: but it's worked so where fine now. Thanks for that

What you really need to do when making a clean save, is to always go somewhere other than where you were. When you disable a mod, if there were scripts from that mod running in the background when you saved, then some vestiges of those scripts might continue to exist after disabling the mod. Changing cells should help the game to purge those last script processes and halt them properly, so that when you next save they won't exist any more. So yes, saving in an interior not related to the mod (and preferably containing no NPCs or creatures) is certainly the best move, BUT if you're already in such a location when you remove the mod, pick another interior for the clean save.

[Batricia Alele]

I'm Tempted to post this in the CS forum but since you guys are used to using the editor with this mod I figured I would ask here. I am trying to add a door to the market district for some testing, And I am simply putting it slightly in front of a barred not-in-use door. This is fine, there are no problems but it seems every time I try to save the plugin with any better city ESP or ESM loaded it crashes. I can save a plugin with just oblivion.esm, but any better cities file along with oblivion.esm causes saving to crash the editor. Have you guys encountered this? Do you know a way to solve the crashing?

[Spooky Angel]

I'm Tempted to post this in the CS forum but since you guys are used to using the editor with this mod I figured I would ask here. I am trying to add a door to the market district for some testing, And I am simply putting it slightly in front of a barred not-in-use door. This is fine, there are no problems but it seems every time I try to save the plugin with any better city ESP or ESM loaded it crashes. I can save a plugin with just oblivion.esm, but any better cities file along with oblivion.esm causes saving to crash the editor. Have you guys encountered this? Do you know a way to solve the crashing?

Let me guess, CS roaked and crashed, yes?

I had exactly the same thing with Chorrol. What I did was to copy the esp I wanted to patch, and then use Bash to make the copy dependant on the original. Then I used TES4Edit to clean out the esp so it was basically empty.

worked like a charm.

[Cathrine Jack]

I'm Tempted to post this in the CS forum but since you guys are used to using the editor with this mod I figured I would ask here. I am trying to add a door to the market district for some testing, And I am simply putting it slightly in front of a barred not-in-use door. This is fine, there are no problems but it seems every time I try to save the plugin with any better city ESP or ESM loaded it crashes. I can save a plugin with just oblivion.esm, but any better cities file along with oblivion.esm causes saving to crash the editor. Have you guys encountered this? Do you know a way to solve the crashing?

Your problem is due to a bug in the CS. You have another ESP loaded in the CS, and this will always cause the CS to crash when you try to save UNLESS the active ESP (the one your actually editing) contains the Tamriel worldspace record. So make any edit in the Tamriel worldspace, and you'll then be able to save. I typically suggest dropping a rock into cell -60,-20 or nearby, as it's fairly unlikely that another mod will touch that area. And if you know how to use TES4Edit, you can also remove this edit later on (but if you then wish to make further edits to your ESP, you'll then have to make another edit in the Tamriel worldspace before saving).

[gemma]

Do the FPS patches actually help FPS? Do they only reduce clutter?

[Stephanie Kemp]

Do the FPS patches actually help FPS? Do they only reduce clutter?

Reducing the clutter is the only way we know to help the FPS as the better way to reduce the FPS is to add clutter.

May He Who Must Not Be Named be splattered like a bug on a windshield.

[LijLuva]

Do the FPS patches actually help FPS? Do they only reduce clutter?

Reduced clutter (random shapes to render) cuts down on the processor's load, so yes...

[bimsy]

Reducing the clutter is the only way we know to help the FPS as the better way to reduce the FPS is to add clutter.

May He Who Must Not Be Named be splattered like a bug on a windshield.

Is it possible to merge the FPS patches into one patch?

[Michelle davies]

Is it possible to merge the FPS patches into one patch?

Yes it is. And for proof, you only need to use the merged ones we already did and provide with the mod.

May He Who Must Not Be Named be decapitate in a public place.

[sam smith]

How do I make the latest version of Better Cities work with Open Better Cities? Right now the game will run and the cities are open but in Anvil there seems to be a lot of two of the same objects in the same place, causing their textures to overlap, resulting in this strange black texture that jumps around a lot. If I disable one of the objects with the console it solves the problem. Also, in front of all of the city gates there is still an inanimate gate. Like there are the gates that open like they should with Open Cities, but in front of them there is (I guess) a texture that looks like the city wall and city gates. If I use the console to disable the inanimate wall the problem is solved. It's really just more of an annoyance than a real problem, as I only have to disable them once with the console and then save and they are gone forever, but it could get tedious with multiple characters. Any suggestions?

[Isaiah Burdeau]

How do I make the latest version of Better Cities work with Open Better Cities? Right now the game will run and the cities are open but in Anvil there seems to be a lot of two of the same objects in the same place, causing their textures to overlap, resulting in this strange black texture that jumps around a lot. If I disable one of the objects with the console it solves the problem. Also, in front of all of the city gates there is still an inanimate gate. Like there are the gates that open like they should with Open Cities, but in front of them there is (I guess) a texture that looks like the city wall and city gates. If I use the console to disable the inanimate wall the problem is solved. It's really just more of an annoyance than a real problem, as I only have to disable them once with the console and then save and they are gone forever, but it could get tedious with multiple characters. Any suggestions?

OBC is no longer supported, but this sounds like you may just need to do a clean update.

Updating Saves - http://tesivpositive.animolious.com/?page=updating_saves <-- Do this for both the OBC and BC plugins.

[Rebekah Rebekah Nicole]

I use the Bank of Cyrodiil mod, and also the patch supplied by BC, but still get this huge blocked and boarded door before the bank's door.

The mods are in the correct order (I use Wrye Bash), and the patch in BC (with the same name as the bank mod) overwrite the bank mod itself.

What gives? Is there something I am doing wrong?

[Sabrina Steige]

I use the Bank of Cyrodiil mod, and also the patch supplied by BC, but still get this huge blocked and boarded door before the bank's door.

The mods are in the correct order (I use Wrye Bash), and the patch in BC (with the same name as the bank mod) overwrite the bank mod itself.

What gives? Is there something I am doing wrong?

I have not ever had that issue. The BC version replaces the original. Are you sure you have the BC version installed?

My very old, in progress and outdated LO (with BC's Bank of Cyrodiil installed)

Spoiler

Active Mod Files:00  Oblivion.esm01  underdark.esm02  GTAesgaard_2.esm03  Cybiades.esm  [Version 2.0]04  All Natural Base.esm  [Version 0.9.9]05  Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm  [Version 4.5bSI]06  Francesco's Optional New Items Add-On.esm  [Version 4.5bSI]07  Cobl Main.esm  [Version 1.72]08  Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm  [Version 1.34]09  Mart's Monster Mod.esm  [Version 3.7b3p3]0A  CyrodiilUpgradeResourcePack.esm0B  TamrielTravellers.esm  [Version 1.39c]0C  FCOM_Convergence.esm  [Version 0.9.9MB3]0D  Better Cities Resources.esm0E  CURP_Controller.esm0F  Progress.esm  [Version 2.2]10  CM Partners.esm11  Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp  [Version 3.2.7]12  TRoN.esp**  TNR (Merged).esp13  DLCShiveringIsles.esp  [Version 1.4.0]14  SM Plugin Refurbish - SI.esp  [Version 1.30]15  Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Bosses.esp16  Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Enemies.esp++  FranDarkSeducerWeapFix.esp++  FCOM_Francescos.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_FrancescosItemsAddOn.esp  [Version 0.9.9]17  FCOM_FrancescosNamedBosses.esp  [Version 0.9.9]18  All Natural - Real Lights.esp  [Version 0.9.9]19  All Natural.esp  [Version 0.9.9]1A  All Natural - SI.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  All Natural - EW + AWS.esp  [Version Final]1B  Enhanced Water (Merged).esp1C  MIS.esp1D  Storms & Sound.esp1E  WindowLightingSystem.esp1F  7lbsBedrolls-OBSE.esp20  ClocksOfCyrodiil_BC_OBC_OC_OCLR_Vanilla.esp21  ImprovedSigns.esp22  P1DseeYouSleep.esp23  Reznod_Mannequin.esp24  Enhanced Economy.esp  [Version 4.0.6]25  Choices and Consequences.esp  [Version 2.02]26  Map Marker Overhaul.esp  [Version 3.4]27  Map Marker Overhaul - SI additions.esp  [Version 3.0.2]28  sr_super_hotkeys.esp  [Version 0.54]29  DLCSpellTomes.esp++  DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.1]2A  XiaNewAmuletsV1.esp2B  Merged - New Items.esp2C  kuerteeHorseCommands.esp2D  KDCircletsOOOOptimized - NPC Equip.esp  [Version 1.2]++  FCOM_KDCircletsOOOOptimizedNPCEquip.esp  [Version 0.9.9]2E  Slof's Oblivion Robe Trader.esp2F  Cobl Glue.esp  [Version 1.72]30  Cobl Si.esp  [Version 1.63]31  OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp  [Version 1.72]32  Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp33  FCOM_BobsArmory.esp  [Version 0.9.9]34  Loth's Blunt Weapons for Npcs.esp++  FCOM_LothsBluntWeapons.esp  [Version 0.9.9]35  Oblivion WarCry EV.esp  [Version 1.08a]36  FCOM_WarCry.esp  [Version 0.9.9MB3]37  Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp  [Version 1.34]++  OOO-Water_Weeds.esp  [Version 1.33]++  OOO_XiaNewAmulets Addon.esp  [Version 0.5]38  OMOBS (Merged).esp  [Version 1.0]++  OOO-Better_Priced_Clutter.esp39  Choices and Consequences - OOO.esp  [Version 2.0]3A  FCOM_Convergence.esp  [Version 0.9.9Mb3]++  FCOM_EntropicOrderRebalance.esp  [Version 0.9.9beta2]3B  FCOM_RealSwords.esp  [Version 0.9.9]3C  FCOM_DurabilityAndDamage.esp  [Version 0.9.9]3D  Mart's Monster Mod - More Wilderness Life No Gates.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]++  FCOM_SaferRoads.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  Mart's Monster Mod - Looting NPCs & Creatures.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]++  Mart's Monster Mod - No Bone Loot.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]3E  Mart's Monster Mod - Farm Animals.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]3F  Mart's Monster Mod - Diverse WaterLife.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3f]++  Mart's Monster Mod - Slof Horses Complete.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]++  Mart's Monster Mod - Diverse Runeskulls Loot OOO.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]++  TamrielTravellerAdvscript.esp  [Version 1.40Alpha]40  TamrielTravellers4OOO.esp  [Version 1.39c]++  TamrielTravellersItemsNPC.esp  [Version 1.39c]41  TamrielTravellersItemsCobl.esp  [Version 1.39c]42  ShiveringIsleTravellers.esp  [Version 1.39c]**  Merged - Graphics NoMerge.esp++  FCOM_TamrielTravelers.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_HungersUnitySI.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_Archery.esp  [Version 1.0]++  FCOM_ArcheryRealSwords.esp  [Version 2]++  Mart's Monster Mod - Shivering Isles.esp  [Version 3.7b3p3]++  PersuasionOverhaul_OOO.esp  [Version 1.2]++  PersuasionOverhaul_MMM.esp  [Version 1.2]43  AlchemistsCave-COBL.esp44  Amajor7 Imperial Furniture.esp45  BenirusManorRebuilt.esp46  Gift of Kynareth.esp47  GTAesgaard.esp48  GTAesgaard_2.esp49  Kragenir's Death Quest.esp4A  KDQ - Rural Line Additions.esp4B  Kvatch Reclaimed.esp4C  GlenvarCastle.esp4D  Slof's Oblivion Goth Shop.esp4E  Sylar_INNMergedCyrodillInnsRevised.esp  [Version 4]4F  Sylar_INNMergedCyrodillInnsRevised_COCPatch.esp50  The Ayleid Steps.esp  [Version 3.3.2]51  The Black Cat Jewelry Store - Daedric Statues.esp52  TheElderCouncil.esp53  TheForgottenShields.esp54  VaultsofCyrodiilBC.esp55  VHBloodlines 1.2.esp  [Version 1.5]56  za_bankmod.esp57  zDangerSense.esp58  DLCBattlehornCastle.esp59  DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.4]5A  SM Plugin Refurbish - Battlehorn.esp  [Version 1.30]5B  Knights.esp5C  Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp  [Version 1.0.9]++  SM Plugin Refurbish - Knights.esp  [Version 1.06]5D  Cybiades.esp  [Version 2.1]5E  CybiadesDungeon.esp  [Version 2.1]5F  TOTF.esp60  RTT.esp61  The Lost Spires.esp62  Ungarion1TheWelkyndSword.esp  [Version 1.4]63  Blood&Mud.esp64  Blood&Mud - EE patch.esp  [Version 1.0]**  Blood&Mud Vwalk.esp65  Origin of the Mages Guild.esp  [Version 6.5]66  The Mystery of the Dulan cult.esp67  FCOM_Blood&Mud.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_Knights.esp  [Version 0.9.9Mb3]++  FCOM_WelkyndSwordBlood&Mud.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_SlofsRobeTrader.esp  [Version 0.9.9]68  FCOM_OMG.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  FCOM_OMGSRT.esp  [Version 0.9.9]69  FCOM_DulanCult.esp  [Version 0.9.9]6A  HeartOftheDead.esp  [Version 6.2]6B  xuldarkforest.esp  [Version 1.0.4]6C  LostSpires-DarkForest patch.esp6D  xulStendarrValley.esp  [Version 1.2.2]6E  xulTheHeath.esp6F  MMMMWL-TheHeath patch.esp70  XulEntiusGorge.esp71  xulFallenleafEverglade.esp  [Version 1.3.1]72  LostSpires-Everglade patch.esp73  TheElderCouncil-FallenleafEverglade patch.esp  [Version 1.2]74  xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp  [Version 1.2.1]75  xulChorrolHinterland.esp  [Version 1.2.2]76  VeronaHouseBloodlines-ChorrolHinterland fix.esp77  mythsandlegends.esp78  xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp  [Version 1.6.3]79  VeronaHouseBloodlines-LostCoast fix.esp7A  KragenirsDeathQuest-LostCoast patch.esp7B  xulBravilBarrowfields.esp  [Version 1.3.2]7C  LostSpires-BravilBarrowfields patch.esp7D  xulLushWoodlands.esp  [Version 1.3]7E  VeronaHouseBloodlines-LushWoodlands fix.esp7F  xulAncientYews.esp  [Version 1.4.3]80  xulAncientRedwoods.esp  [Version 1.6]81  xulCloudtopMountains.esp  [Version 1.0.3]82  KragenirsDeathQuest-CloudtopMountains patch.esp83  xulArriusCreek.esp  [Version 1.1.3]84  xulPatch_AY_AC.esp  [Version 1.1]85  HeartoftheDead-ArriusCreek patch.esp86  xulRollingHills_EV.esp  [Version 1.3.2]87  MMMMWL-RollingHills patch.esp88  KragenirsDeathQuest-RollingHills patch.esp89  xulPantherRiver.esp8A  Blood&Mud-PantherRiver patch.esp8B  xulRiverEthe.esp  [Version 1.0.2]8C  xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp  [Version 1.0.2]8D  NakedNord.esp8E  xulImperialIsle.esp  [Version 1.6.5]8F  xulBlackwoodForest.esp90  xulCheydinhalFalls.esp  [Version 1.0.1]91  TearsOfTheFiend-CheydinhalFalls patch.esp92  xulAspenWood.esp  [Version 1.0.1]93  xulSkingradOutskirts.esp94  PersonalPackGuars.esp  [Version 0.56]95  FightersGuildContracts.esp96  Better Cities - House price patch.esp  [Version 1.0]97  Harvest [Flora].esp  [Version 3.0.0]98  Bag of Holding.esp  [Version 1.5.0]99  Cliff_BetterLetters.esp  [Version 1.1]9A  DropLitTorchOBSE.esp  [Version 2.1]9B  Kyoma's Journal Mod.esp  [Version 3.2.0]9C  PersuasionOverhaul.esp  [Version 1.43]9D  TEC_4ERA_Dialog_Filter.esp9E  Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp  [Version 3.08]9F  Slof's Dogs.espA0  Storms & Sound Patches (Merged).espA1  Enhanced Economy - House prices.esp  [Version 1.0]A2  Quest Award Leveller.esp  [Version 2.1.0]A3  StartChoices.espA4  SM Encumbrance and Fatigue.esp  [Version 2.6]A5  Realistic Force (Merged).espA6  RefScope.esp  [Version 2.0.2]A7  RenGuardOverhaul.espA8  Enhanced Grabbing.esp  [Version 0.5]A9  nGCD.espAA  nGCD Oghma Infinium.esp++  nGCD Skeleton Key.espAB  ProgressGSD.esp  [Version 2.0]AC  ProgressMBSP.esp  [Version 2.0]AD  ProgressRBSP.esp  [Version 1.0]AE  ProgressRacial.espAF  ProgressArmorer.esp  [Version 1.0]B0  ProgressMercantile.esp  [Version 1.11]B1  Legendary Abilities-Shield MOJ.esp  [Version 2.0]B2  Grandmaster of Alchemy.espB3  ActorsInEmotions.espB4  Let There Be Darkness (Merged).espB5  Atmospheric Loading Screens - No Text.espB6  bgBalancingEVCore.esp  [Version 10.52EV-D]++  TamrielTravellers Cosmetics Cobl or RBP.espB7  bgMagicEV.esp  [Version 1.7EV]++  bgMagicSpellTomes_for_WryeBash.esp  [Version 1.68EV]B8  bgMagicEVPaperChase.esp  [Version 1.68EV]B9  SupremeMagicka.esp  [Version 0.90]++  SM Mergeable Modules (Merged).espBA  SM NoMerge Modules (Merged).espBB  bgIntegrationEV.esp  [Version 0.993]**  bgIntegrationEV - Alternative NPC Faces by LazyMonk.esp  [Version 0.96]BC  Willful Resistance.esp  [Version 4.0]BD  Better Cities - Full City Defences.espBE  Better Cities Full - B&M Edition.espBF  BCBravilB&MFULL-Barrowfields patch.espC0  Better Cities - Ruined Tail's Tale.espC1  BCChorrol-ChorrolHinterland fix.espC2  Better Cities - Tears of the Fiend.espC3  BCCheydinhalFULLB&M-CheydinhalFalls patch.espC4  BCSkingrad-SkingradOutskirts patch.espC5  Better Cities - VHBloodlines.espC6  Better Cities - VWD of the IC.espC7  Better Imperial City.espC8  Better Cities - COBL.esp  [Version 2]C9  Viconia.esp++  Faces - Companions.esp**  Viconia Vwalk.esp++  Viconia_delayer.esp++  Bashed Delayers E - MERGE ONLY.esp  [Version 1.08]++  Merged - Quest Delayers.esp**  All Natural - Indoor Weather Filter For Mods.esp  [Version 0.9.9]++  Merged - Misc.espCA  Merged - Small Tweaks.espCB  Bashed Patch, 0.espCC  FormID Finder4.espCD  kuerteeActorDetails.esp

[Chloé]

I use the Bank of Cyrodiil mod, and also the patch supplied by BC, but still get this huge blocked and boarded door before the bank's door.

The mods are in the correct order (I use Wrye Bash), and the patch in BC (with the same name as the bank mod) overwrite the bank mod itself.

What gives? Is there something I am doing wrong?

As Tomlong suggested, it sounds like you're still using the original version instead of our replacer version.

[Devils Cheek]

Am using the full version of BBC.
Do I need the pach called Better Cities - VWD of the IC.esp ?