[Sweets Sweets]

Hello,

Just wondering, can I use Apachii Goddess Store with BC? Tried to search the forum regarding it, but no luck

Thanks!

[Elina]

I whipped up a small patch. You can get it http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=5ce8d9a40acd6ec86b21be4093fab7ac4024a5032c9a4882f88875faa4c6c51e (http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=5ce8d9a40acd6ec86b21be4093fab7ac4024a5032c9a4882f88875faa4c6c51e). It only addresses (25,-36) and (25,-37). I don't know if there are any other problems in the landscape.

This patch only works if Kumiko is installed before BC. Install the patch after BC.

Let me know if there are any problems with it.

Thanks for the patch. The path leading to the manor is fixed now, but there's still some land tearing on the east. Still, thank you very much, now it looks much better.

@koki373737 I'm using BC and Apachii Goddes Stores, so yes you can use it without any problem. Only mod i know that conflicts with the shop is Verona House, but i don't know if they fixed it for compatibility.

[Rach B]

There's a conflict with 'Against the Zealots of the Nine'.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3849

Where the quest mod places the 'Jolard Manor' is where BC places the prison in Cheydinall. Since Zealots of the nine is on the TOQL, thought it might be good to know.

[Robert Bindley]

There's a conflict with 'Against the Zealots of the Nine'.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3849

Where the quest mod places the 'Jolard Manor' is where BC places the prison in Cheydinall. Since Zealots of the nine is on the TOQL, thought it might be good to know.

Unique Landscapes and Better Cities causes a coflict in the Market Square which I can't seem to fix. The road across from Thronirs store is all hills and the road is probably 4 feet below it.

[David Chambers]

Unique Landscapes and Better Cities causes a coflict in the Market Square which I can't seem to fix. The road across from Thronirs store is all hills and the road is probably 4 feet below it.

I think there may be a different mod at play there. UL should make no changes to the interior of the city and BC should make no changes outside. I've also been using UL Imperial City and Better Cities together without incident.

Have you tried both mods one at a time? If you turn off the .esp for UL-IC you should be able to see if there's still a problem near Thoronir's shop, The Copious Coinpurse. Good luck tracking down the issue.

[Angelina Mayo]

I think there may be a different mod at play there. UL should make no changes to the interior of the city and BC should make no changes outside. I've also been using UL Imperial City and Better Cities together without incident.

Have you tried both mods one at a time? If you turn off the .esp for UL-IC you should be able to see if there's still a problem near Thoronir's shop, The Copious Coinpurse. Good luck tracking down the issue.

Here is my load order:

I'm no expert at Bashing patches but it did work once, but then didn't on the next load. Can't say what I added to break it.

Oblivion.esm
All Natural Base.esm
Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm
Francesco's Optional New Items Add-On.esm
battlemagearmor2-0Base.esm
Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm
Mart's Monster Mod.esm
FCOM_Convergence.esm
Better Cities Resources.esm
Progress.esm
Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp
DLCShiveringIsles.esp
Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp
Better Cities .esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Bosses.esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Enemies.esp
Francesco's Optional Chance of More Enemies.esp
Francesco's Optional Leveled Guards.esp
FCOM_Francescos.esp
FCOM_FrancescosItemsAddOn.esp
FCOM_FrancescosNamedBosses.esp
Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.esp
Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp
All Natural - Real Lights.esp
All Natural.esp
All Natural - EW + NW + AWS.esp
Enhanced Water v2.0 ND.esp
Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp
IWR-Lights.esp
IWR-Windows.esp
IWR-Shutters.esp
Akatosh Mount By Saiden Storm.esp
CDM-Skip Purification.esp
ClocksOfCyrodiil.esp
ClocksOfCyrodiil_BC_OBC_OC_OCLR_Vanilla.esp
DaggerfallBooks.esp
diversegrasses.esp
MorrowindBooks.esp
Xero's Fame Indicator.esp
Living Economy.esp
Living Economy - Items.esp
Map Marker Overhaul.esp
DLCHorseArmor.esp
DLCOrrery.esp
DLCVileLair.esp
DLCMehrunesRazor.esp
MaleBodyReplacerV3.esp
Adonnays Classical Weaponry.esp
Adonnays Elven Weaponry.esp
battlemagearmor2-0 compatability loot.esp
DMACArmor.esp
DMRangerArmor.esp
KDDwemerSpectacles.esp
mnp Nighteye Goggles.esp
Nicoroshi Creations DW Light.esp
Nighteye Glasses.obse.esp
Noble Battlemage Armor.esp
Thieves Arsenal.esp
Mage Equipment.esp
EY_BM_Armory.esp
DLCThievesDen.esp
Slof's Oblivion Robe Trader.esp
Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp
Cheat Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp
FCOM_BobsArmory.esp
Oblivion WarCry EV.esp
FCOM_WarCry.esp
Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp
OOO-Water_Weeds.esp
OOO-Container_Trap_Instant_Effects.esp
FCOM_Convergence.esp
FCOM_RealSwords.esp
FCOM_SpawnRatesReduced.esp
FCOM_SaferRoads.esp
FCOM_NoReaversInGates.esp
FCOM_NoAdventurersInGates.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Looting NPCs & Creatures.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Less Bone Loot.esp
Mart's Monster Mod - Hunting & Crafting.esp
FCOM_DiverseGuardUnity.esp
FCOM_BobsGuardUnity.esp
FCOM_HungersUnitySI.esp
OOO-WaterFish.esp
BlackRockManorV11.esp
Jagnot- Imperial City Library V1.3.esp
DLCfrostcrag.esp
Knights.esp
xuldarkforest.esp
xulStendarrValley.esp
xulTheHeath.esp
XulEntiusGorge.esp
xulFallenleafEverglade.esp
xulColovianHighlands_EV.esp
xulChorrolHinterland.esp
mythsandlegends.esp
xulBeachesOfCyrodiilLostCoast.esp
xulBravilBarrowfields.esp
xulLushWoodlands.esp
xulAncientYews.esp
xulAncientRedwoods.esp
xulCloudtopMountains.esp
xulArriusCreek.esp
xulPatch_AY_AC.esp
xulRollingHills_EV.esp
xulPantherRiver.esp
xulRiverEthe.esp
xulBrenaRiverRavine.esp
xulImperialIsle.esp
xulBlackwoodForest.esp
Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp
Harvest [Flora].esp
Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp
Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp
Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp
Bag of Holding.esp
P1DkeyChain.esp
Toggleable Quantity Prompt.esp
Alternative Start by Robert Evrae.esp
Finders Keepers.esp
nGCD.esp
ProgressMBSP.esp
ProgressSBSP.esp
ProgressRBSP.esp
ProgressRacial.esp
ProgressArmorer.esp
Beautiful People.esp
Better Cities Full.esp
Better Cities - Full City Defences.esp
BCChorrol-ChorrolHinterland fix.esp
BCBravilFULL-Barrowfields patch.esp
Better Cities - No LEYAWIIN Flooding.esp
Better Imperial City.esp
Bashed Patch, 0.esp
Streamline 3.1.esp
WarriorBandages_V2.0.esp
BSS BmAS 2-0 WarlockExBeta.esp
BSS BmAS 2-0 baseheavytolight.esp
BSS BmAS 2-0 warlockheavytolight.esp
RSArmor.esp

[ashleigh bryden]

What is RS Armor and why does it needs to be loaded last?

Anyway if you have any landscape issue in the IC, it only means than one of your mod loaded after Better Imperial City shouldn't be there but loaded before Better Cities.

[Oscar Vazquez]

There's a conflict with 'Against the Zealots of the Nine'.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3849

Where the quest mod places the 'Jolard Manor' is where BC places the prison in Cheydinall. Since Zealots of the nine is on the TOQL, thought it might be good to know.

I thought we already patched this? I just can't recall all the other mods we've resolved conflicts with, there's been too many! Is this NOT one of those we offer a patch for then?

[Alan Whiston]

There's a conflict with 'Against the Zealots of the Nine'.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=3849

Where the quest mod places the 'Jolard Manor' is where BC places the prison in Cheydinall. Since Zealots of the nine is on the TOQL, thought it might be good to know.

I thought we already patched this? I just can't recall all the other mods we've resolved conflicts with, there's been too many! Is this NOT one of those we offer a patch for then?

On the first page of this thread there is the list of compatible/incompatible mods and this one is already noted as incompatible in Cheydinhal. So this is no news and no there is no patch for it.

Remember that Better Cities is modular. You are not forced to use all the cities at once. It is also only cosmetic so removing one city wont change anything to your game. You can always do your quest with Against the Zaelots of the Nine and when you're done reactivate Cheydinhal or just keep Cheydinhal Vanilla and keep Against the Zaelots of the Nine active in your load order. We can't patch all and every mod that's one thing sure.

[Ricky Meehan]

Does anyone know if there are compatibility issues with the Imperial Waters Mod? I just love that mod and how it adds a waterfall effect to the IC's inner wall. I know it works with ImpeREAL City, but i don't know about the Better Cities mod.

[Dawn Farrell]

Does anyone know if there are compatibility issues with the Imperial Waters Mod? I just love that mod and how it adds a waterfall effect to the IC's inner wall. I know it works with ImpeREAL City, but i don't know about the Better Cities mod.

No problem. That mod has a Better Cities version.
All it does is 'turn off' the waterfalls in the Market (Better Cities sticks extra buildings in front of them.)

I played a tiny part in getting that, right after it was first uploaded, so have been using it with this mod for some time. Go for it.

Here it is: http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=25804 (Use the "Optional files" one, and your good to go.)

[Hussnein Amin]

No problem. That mod has a Better Cities version.
All it does is 'turn off' the waterfalls in the Market (Better Cities sticks extra buildings in front of them.)

I played a tiny part in getting that, right after it was first uploaded, so have been using it with this mod for some time. Go for it.

Here it is: http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=25804 (Use the "Optional files" one, and your good to go.)

Thanks It's a really awesome mod and adds to the beauty of the IC so much better. THe let the people Drink one is good also, but it conflicts with Certain Unique Landscapes too much.

[Andrew Lang]

Thanks for the patch. The path leading to the manor is fixed now, but there's still some land tearing on the east. Still, thank you very much, now it looks much better.

I can't seem to find the tears. Can you be a little more specific? Maybe you can post the region coordinates or the CS ref ID of an object near the tear. Thanks!

[Darian Ennels]

Thanks It's a really awesome mod and adds to the beauty of the IC so much better. THe let the people Drink one is good also, but it conflicts with Certain Unique Landscapes too much.

That is a great mod (I have that one too.)

Really, what conflicts? I know there is a conflict between Let the People Drink, UL Imperial Isle (ULII) and New Roads and Bridges, but there is a patch for that on the New Roads and Bridges page on TESNexus (might warrant an update, as ULII has been updated since then, but it seems to work fine.) Perhaps you should mention it on the Unique landscapes thread; they have made tons of patches for other mods, and continue to do so.

[Vickytoria Vasquez]

Thanks It's a really awesome mod and adds to the beauty of the IC so much better. THe let the people Drink one is good also, but it conflicts with Certain Unique Landscapes too much.

LtPD doesn't conflict with any UL mod at all.

[Silencio]

I've done some extensive testing regarding a crashing issue I'm having, and for some reason it's Better Cities, even though I don't see the connection. This is what happens:

1. I load a savegame anywhere.
2. I go to a (different) exterior location or I go through at least enough cells so that the location I saved my game in is no longer in the memory and will have to be loaded fully again if I decide to access it.
3. For whatever reason I decide to re-load that savegame I loaded in step 1.
4. Crash.

The crash occurs every time. I've tested it with a new game with only Better Cities active, and it still happens. I don't get any crashes if I the game reloads instantly because it still has the cell loaded in memory. Otherwise it crashes just after the loading screen appears.

Actually, loading any savegame and then loading a different savegame where I'm in a different cell crashes the game. It doesn't matter if these are all interior or exterior cells not even remotely related to Better Cities. Disabling Better Cities solves it every time.

Even weirder, I've narrowed it down to the RESOURCES esm file. It doesn't matter if the actual better cities esps that rely on it are active or not, it is the resource esm that is causing these crashes.

I'm running Better Cities 4-3-6b with all the appropriate resources downloaded and installed. The cities themselves look just fine so it doesn't sound like a faulty install. I redownloaded everything from Nexus again to be sure (and I'm positive that I got it all) but that didn't solve the crashes either.

I'm using the latest official Oblivion patch. I don't have Shivering Isles.

Any idea what's up? I find this to be a very strange situation as you can imagine. If there's any other information you need let me know.

[CHARLODDE]

For the curiosity factor more than anything, I ran the BC resources file through Tes4Edit using the non-SI oblivion.esm. Did the "check for errors" procedure, and it turns up a number of things that are being referenced from Shivering Isles. Apparently the game loads ok this way the first time, but trying to do an in-game reload does indeed fail with just the resource ESM being the only active mod.

[Jason King]

Arcane University loads a ton of SI effects, but doesn't require SI as a master. Without SI you'll get a bunch of missing mesh icon's. These effects can be disabled in the console with a startquest command found in the personalizing better cities guide. I'm assuming that is what you saw with tes4edit.

[Jose ordaz]

For the curiosity factor more than anything, I ran the BC resources file through Tes4Edit using the non-SI oblivion.esm. Did the "check for errors" procedure, and it turns up a number of things that are being referenced from Shivering Isles. Apparently the game loads ok this way the first time, but trying to do an in-game reload does indeed fail with just the resource ESM being the only active mod.

I just did the check for error:

[Filtering done]  Processed Records: 1265240 Elapsed Time: 00:06              XTRG - Target -> Target is not persistent            Above errors were found in :BANLeyawiinShip02DummyMarker01 [REFR:0117851A] (places XMarkerHeading [STAT:00000034] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of LeyawiinShip02MidDeck "The Numidium Mid Deck" [CELL:01178515])              XTRG - Target -> Target is not persistent            Above errors were found in :BANLeyawiinShip02ArcheryMarker [REFR:01178519] (places XMarkerHeading [STAT:00000034] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of LeyawiinShip02MidDeck "The Numidium Mid Deck" [CELL:01178515])              XTRG - Target -> Target is not persistent            Above errors were found in :BANLeyawiinShip02DummyMarker02 [REFR:01178518] (places XMarkerHeading [STAT:00000034] in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of LeyawiinShip02MidDeck "The Numidium Mid Deck" [CELL:01178515])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Persistent Children of LeyawiinShip02MidDeck "The Numidium Mid Deck" [CELL:01178515]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of LeyawiinShip02MidDeck "The Numidium Mid Deck" [CELL:01178515]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 9    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 7  Above errors were found in :GRUP Top "CELL"Above errors were found in :[01] Better Cities Resources.esm

(those are probably made persistent when using Leyawiin and even if not they are certainly not from SI).

And this is all I got. We have no reference to SI in our master, no reference at all to anything Vanilla but the TestParticles cell and some HELLO, GOOBDYE (generics) topics in dialog and then only to add new lines to those topics.

I do really have no clue of what you are talking about. Nor how does a non SI version of Oblivion could show error related to SI in our master except for the generic dialog lines which are automatically imported and for which there is nothing we can do because it is just the way it works.

[Alexandra Ryan]

This is what I'm talking about:

              NAME - Base -> [00046745]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01003A8F] (places [00046745]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])              NAME - Base -> [00046745]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01003A8C] (places [00046745]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])              NAME - Base -> [0004BB69]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010027C2] (places [0004BB69]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])              NAME - Base -> [00046745]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010027C0] (places [00046745]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])              NAME - Base -> [0004BB69]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01001839] (places [0004BB69]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])              NAME - Base -> [00046745]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01001838] (places [00046745]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of SkingradMTCWaxwingHouse "Waxwing's House" [CELL:0101E60A]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 2    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 6              NAME - Base -> [0004BB69]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01004817] (places [0004BB69]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksHouse04 "Greysmark's House" [CELL:0102CF8D])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksHouse04 "Greysmark's House" [CELL:0102CF8D]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilDocksHouse04 "Greysmark's House" [CELL:0102CF8D]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 0    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 5              NAME - Base -> [0008FA33]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01178219] (places [0008FA33]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ChorrolBathHouse01 "Women's Public Bath House" [CELL:011781FC])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ChorrolBathHouse01 "Women's Public Bath House" [CELL:011781FC]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of ChorrolBathHouse01 "Women's Public Bath House" [CELL:011781FC]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 0    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 4              NAME - Base -> [00046F24]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010084DA] (places [00046F24]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of LeyawiinMarshHouse "Marsh's House" [CELL:0100831B])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of LeyawiinMarshHouse "Marsh's House" [CELL:0100831B]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of LeyawiinMarshHouse "Marsh's House" [CELL:0100831B]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 6    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 3              NAME - Base -> [00081BF5]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01178315] (places [00081BF5]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketBathhouse04 "Public Bathing House Gardens" [CELL:01003856])              NAME - Base -> [00081BF5]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01178316] (places [00081BF5]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketBathhouse04 "Public Bathing House Gardens" [CELL:01003856])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketBathhouse04 "Public Bathing House Gardens" [CELL:01003856]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of ICMarketBathhouse04 "Public Bathing House Gardens" [CELL:01003856]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 2              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0100330D] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCMorganMiningSupplies "Morgan's Mining Supplies" [CELL:0101E728])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0100330C] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCMorganMiningSupplies "Morgan's Mining Supplies" [CELL:0101E728])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCMorganMiningSupplies "Morgan's Mining Supplies" [CELL:0101E728]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilMTCMorganMiningSupplies "Morgan's Mining Supplies" [CELL:0101E728]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 1              NAME - Base -> [00046F24]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101126F] (places [00046F24]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])              NAME - Base -> [000112EE]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010112AB] (places [000112EE]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])              NAME - Base -> [00045608]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010112AC] (places [00045608]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])              NAME - Base -> [00044E4D]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010112B1] (places [00044E4D]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])              NAME - Base -> [0005291D]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010112BC] (places [0005291D]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])              NAME - Base -> [0004DA9C]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010112C4] (places [0004DA9C]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilDocksMTCRiversideJunkShop "Riverside Junk Shop" [CELL:0101588A]              NAME - Base -> [0009739F]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01177EA8] (places [0009739F]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E])              NAME - Base -> [0009740B]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01177EA7] (places [0009740B]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E])              NAME - Base -> [0009740C]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01177EA6] (places [0009740C]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E])              NAME - Base -> [00097411]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01177EA5] (places [00097411]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BrumaRefugeeHouse "Refugee's House" [CELL:01008C3E]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 0    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 2              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101212A] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101212B] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010121B2] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010121EA] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0001B056]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012218] (places [0001B056]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012220] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012222] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [00073924]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01013411] (places [00073924]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])              NAME - Base -> [0008257D]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01013412] (places [0008257D]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilMTCCobbler "The Bravil Cobbler and Tailor" [CELL:0101207B]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 5              NAME - Base -> [0007CAA2]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0117A84B] (places [0007CAA2]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketEmpiresBestTailoring "Empire's Best Tailoring" [CELL:0117A805])              NAME - Base -> [0007CAA2]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01008DB7] (places [0007CAA2]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketEmpiresBestTailoring "Empire's Best Tailoring" [CELL:0117A805])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of ICMarketEmpiresBestTailoring "Empire's Best Tailoring" [CELL:0117A805]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of ICMarketEmpiresBestTailoring "Empire's Best Tailoring" [CELL:0117A805]              NAME - Base -> [00059B56]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0100529D] (places [00059B56]  in GRUP Cell Persistent Children of ICTunnelWaterfrontEntrance "Imperial City Waterfront Tunnel" [CELL:0116687D])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Persistent Children of ICTunnelWaterfrontEntrance "Imperial City Waterfront Tunnel" [CELL:0116687D]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of ICTunnelWaterfrontEntrance "Imperial City Waterfront Tunnel" [CELL:0116687D]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 4    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 1              NAME - Base -> [0006D22D]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010033A0] (places [0006D22D]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCNaqviHouse "Naqvi's House" [CELL:0101E6FE])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCNaqviHouse "Naqvi's House" [CELL:0101E6FE]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilMTCNaqviHouse "Naqvi's House" [CELL:0101E6FE]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 7              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012ADF] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [0007DB98]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012AE0] (places [0007DB98]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [000570F4]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01012B52] (places [000570F4]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [000112F1]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101573A] (places [000112F1]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [0001B056]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101573B] (places [0001B056]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [0001B056]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101573C] (places [0001B056]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])              NAME - Base -> [0001B056]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:0101573D] (places [0001B056]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilMTCHerbalist "Herbalist" [CELL:01012976]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 5              NAME - Base -> [00040CC0]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:010076B7] (places [00040CC0]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaLuciaPetLoverHouse "Lucia the Pet-Lover's House" [CELL:0100767A])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BrumaLuciaPetLoverHouse "Lucia the Pet-Lover's House" [CELL:0100767A]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BrumaLuciaPetLoverHouse "Lucia the Pet-Lover's House" [CELL:0100767A]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 3              NAME - Base -> [00046F24]             Above errors were found in :[REFR:01008956] (places [00046F24]  in GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCAdasHouse "Ada's House" [CELL:01008854])          Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Temporary Children of BravilDocksMTCAdasHouse "Ada's House" [CELL:01008854]        Above errors were found in :GRUP Cell Children of BravilDocksMTCAdasHouse "Ada's House" [CELL:01008854]      Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Sub-Block 0    Above errors were found in :GRUP Interior Cell Block 0  Above errors were found in :GRUP Top "CELL"        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANBravilPlaguePerson02 "Vorka" [NPC_:0117A554]        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANWaterfrontTentperson05 "Meersmark" [NPC_:01179FEE]        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANSkingradTavMan06 "Gambler" [NPC_:01179621]        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANSkingradRangerMember02 "Edrik" [NPC_:0117960D]        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANSkingradRangerMember01 "Meadowdark" [NPC_:0117960C]        Eyes #0 -> [0005FA43]       Above errors were found in :ENAM - Eyes    Above errors were found in :BANWaterfrontBarperson05 "Fenrin Willowsdark" [NPC_:01007C32]  Above errors were found in :GRUP Top "NPC_"          Item -> [0008257D]         Above errors were found in :CNTO - Item          Item -> [00073924]         Above errors were found in :CNTO - Item      Above errors were found in :Items    Above errors were found in :BANBravilContainerVendorChestCobbler "VendorChestCobbler" [CONT:01012256]          Item -> [00055883]         Above errors were found in :CNTO - Item          Item -> [0005291D]         Above errors were found in :CNTO - Item      Above errors were found in :Items    Above errors were found in :BANBravilContainerVendorChestJunk "VendorChestJunk" [CONT:01011A41]  Above errors were found in :GRUP Top "CONT"Above errors were found in :[01] Better Cities Resources.esm

You have to start tes4edit while using a copy of oblivion.esm from before SI is installed in order to see this. I've removed the dialogue part which doesn't hurt anything.

If you grab some of the unreferenced IDs and then load tes4edit again with the SI version of oblivion.esm, you'll find a number of these missing references belong to items with the specific prefix "SE" which indicates them as being SI assets.

The report was taken from the ESM file freshly downloaded off of Nexus 2 days ago, which is marked as 4.3.6b there.

When I tested to see if the game would crash, it does so for me only when loading the non-SI oblivion.esm and *ONLY* your resource ESM file. Which means nothing else can be contaminating the game. It only crashes when attempting an in-game load saved in a different cell, just as povuholo describes it. Switching the oblivion.esm back to the SI version and repeating the same test results in normal response.

[Project]

I had an error similar to that just yesterday. I removed a ship from Elsweyr in the CS. I checked my edits in TES4Edit and half of it could not be resolved unless I had SI's esp loaded. This didn't make any sense to me because it was an oblivion ship. I ended up ditching that esp anyway in favor of another method. I still don't understand what exactly happened or why the CS can't leave it's gruby hands off of things.

[Rach B]

Hello Everyone.

I have actually been experiencing the same thing described by Povuholo, I just never tracked it to Better Cities, probably because it never occured to me it could be a resource issue. I added several new mods at the same time, including the newest update of BBC, along with tinkering with Wrye Bash, and assumed it was something I had done there. Pov's description however exactly fits my issue, except that I DO have Shivering Isles. My game loads fast enough that it was nothing more than a nuisance to restart, but I thought my information may be useful.

I can't imagine not having Better Cities in my game, and the CTD on reloads hasn't doused my enthusiasm in the least! Keep up the good work, and I'll check back. Let me know if any of you need my load order or some debugging on my end.

[dean Cutler]

You have to start tes4edit while using a copy of oblivion.esm from before SI is installed in order to see this. I've removed the dialogue part which doesn't hurt anything.

Neither of us has a non-SI Oblivion.esm so this is not something we would ever look into. Plus I don't touch the look-for-errors option in TES4Edit as the one time I did, it produced a whole load of weird info, and when I asked Elminster what it all meant he got very upset with me and we had a brief falling out, so I stopped talking about it and just don't use that feature.

With regards to povuholo's initial query, never load a save game from in-game, always quit to menu first, as the game engine contains bugs which mess up loading saves if you've already loaded a save. Sometimes it also messes up even after having quit to menu first, in which case you may need to quit to desktop before loading a save. This problem is not caused by Better Cities, it is in the game engine itself and can occur with any mods or even without any mods.

Arthmoor, I'll take a look at what you've copied in here, if you have any more info, please PM me.

[Ebou Suso]

I guess we have a simple answer: Saying that Better Cities Requires SI extension.

It is quite hard to figure from the Cs that this mesh:
Dungeons\RuinInteriors\DecorationsAndStatues\RuinsHangingLightAnchor.NIF (which is found in the DLCShiveringIsle.bsa)
and some other are indeed SI only. It may be possible that we didn't add so much SI new material in Better Cities but it is safer to assume that we did (or we will) and that we don't want to strip them off or re-upload SI stuff as it is forbidden anyway. So the easy going solution is to say that SI is required.

[Mari martnez Martinez]

Must be nice for you, being at home now, able to look into this now, having internet at home now, being able to respond now rather than waiting until the following day when back at work.....


I'm told I might have working internet when I get home tonight!!!!! (yeah right, who believes that?)

So, if BC finally becomes dependent on SI, this means we no longer have to ensure we avoid all SI material. That'll be nice.