I just tested it via the console and yes its per second. Its still questionable to be running around with -3END (-60 health), -2AGL and -2STR to regenerate 8 health per second. If you need regeneration you can just use one of your near infinite Stimpacks, Super or regular.

I just tested it via the console and yes its per second. Its still questionable to be running around with -3END (-60 health), -2AGL and -2STR to regenerate 8 health per second. If you need regeneration you can just use one of your near infinite Stimpacks, Super or regular.

I agree, that's questionable, but it's also you cherry picking an extreme example to try to make your point.

How about -1 Endurance for permanent 2hp/sec regeneration, or -2 End -1 Agi for 4 hp/sec? In the right build (I used S 8 P 4 E 9 C 1 A 9 I 6 L 3, IIRC) you don't miss the Endurance or Agility, and having it as a permanent ability allows it to be a part of your tactics in every single battle without cutting into your resources (unlike Stimpacks). With the aforementioned DT perks/implant/good armor, it stops a huge amount of the damage you take in the game, which is especially valuable for characters who have to weather ranged weapons fire to get into melee range with their enemies. It also allows you to save your Stimpacks for spamming super-regeneration on hardcoe, if you choose to do that - and if you're doing that, you're going to cut into the numbers of your stimpacks pretty quick, much more quickly than you would simply healing up damage taken on Normal Mode.

It's a great perk for hardcoe. And it goes to the point of this thread; unlimited, relatively fast healing will save you a lot of caps, and that should be weighed in any assessment of Survival vs Barter.

I'm pretty far into the game now and I'm developing some pretty strong opinions on these two skills.


Initially, I was like "Psh, I played Fallout 3 and I was in nooo short supply of caps, I don't think I'm going to need Barter again."

It also helped that there was a brand spanking new skill in New Vegas, Survival, which let you live off the fat of the land.

Or so I thought.

After funneling a lot of my skill points and scavenging efforts into Survival and totally neglecting Barter, I feel like I have come to a conclusion.


I have made a massive mistake.


Allow me to elaborate on the situation with some basic Pros and Cons.


On the Survival side of the fence, the basic mechanics are using campfires to cook your own food, tan hides, make poisons, and be self-reliant. The reality is that the campfires are very inconveniently located (particularly bothersome is that none of them are near official Player Housing assets), the recipes require a lot of skill points put into the Survival skill to make even the most apparently simple things, scrounging up ingredients for these recipes is tedious as a whole plant will usually yield only one or two ingredient items, and the recipes then demand a lot of the ingredients (and even some insane ingredients - a tin can to make an omelet?) to make an item that is essentially kinda like a StimPak that, if you're in hardcoe mode, also mitigates your hunger.

The Pros? I'm struggling to find them. This skill is laden with Cons. Making poisons seems pretty cool until you find out it's a single dose, single strike sort of mechanic, and they're only applicable to melee weapons and spears (no duh, right?). I thought tanning hides was going to be a step into all sorts of cool armor modifications or other crafting, but it's essentially throwing a lot of these hard to obtain ingredients into a gecko hide that's worth a hundred or so caps. Nevermind, there's no profit to be found in Survival crafting in the first place - the ingredients are often worth more than the resulting product.


Barter. Let me tell you a little bit about Barter and why it's the better choice, and the choice I wish I had made. Number 1, Caps. Pure, simple caps. You save money and make a little more, and all this money you would see with Barter can supplement your diet and hydration with caps to spare on other actually useful things like guns, ammunition, and other supplies. Number 2, the Barter skill unlocks a highly desirable perk that halves the weight of anything in your inventory that weighs two pounds or less - take a look at your inventory some time and get a good feel for how many items would benefit from that. If you're in hardcoe mode, that means all the food and water and ammo you're lugging around weighs half as less. Further, unlike in Fallout 3, there are plenty of things to command the attention of your bottle cap collection - things like high-end medical procedures (you know the ones), gambling, item repairs, and weapon modifications.

The Cons? The only real Con is that you don't get to play with the shiny new Survival skill. I promise you you're not missing out on it, though. The bulk of its utility is in cooking dog, coyote, and gecko meat into steaks. That's just about it. It's the only reasonable recipe with a positive return - throwing meat on a fire and cooking it.

My bottom line is that Survival needs a lot of work, from recipe tweaks to ingredient yields and weights, more recipes that yield actual equipment and items (like non-addictive chem anologues!), to better campfire placement, and even making ovens/stovetops useable like a campfire (at least the ones in Player Housing and some popular shacks).

If you are playing hardcoe, I think Barter is the way you should go. It's the hardcoe golden skill. Drop 70 points in it and never look back.

I took Survival all the way up to 100 on my first play-thru.
My character was unarmed/melee beast, I didnt take rad child but I was punching deathclaws limbs off fairly easily.
My barter ended up around 40.

One thing with survival that seems to be undervalued, the higher it goes the better foods get. Desert salads rock with high survival skills, I had them providing 21hp per second over 15 seconds at 100 survival. Thats 315hp in 15 seconds, without Arcade, and without stimpack sickness.
Also, high survival boosts the +stat effects several items of food and alchol ( eg. +3 strength from steaks, +3 str/+3cha/-3int beer, +75 energy/fire resistance on the atomic mixer).

Yes, it takes time to collect the components to make stuff like desert salad, trailmix or caravan lunches, but the return is better than stimpacks (I rarely used stims) and the high tier foods + rad child could make for a very potent tank.

My second character I have to be ready to TAB and know what foods regenerates what amount and to balance my health so that heals aren't wasted.

You sound like one of the healers in my WoW guild. His motto, no heals wasted.