Not strictly true, in AC2 at least thieves and agiles can also climb all over like Ezio. Your more general point still stands though, it is NPC behaviour rather than player behaviour that makes climbing tricky in something like Skyrim I suspect.

It saddens me how many people want to turn this tremendous RPG franchise into just another button-mashing fighting game.

It saddens me even more that there's at least some chance that Beth will do it.

But it reassures me to realize that there's likely some group of talented and dedicated individuals out there right now who are working on the game that's going to be to the RPG genre as Daggerfall was back when Beth was just a group of talented and dedicated individuals, and those of us who appreciate a good RPG will be able to leave this increasingly bloated, increasingly baby-fied, increasingly brainless mess of a game series behind.

Indeed, can't he explain more deeply what he means, or admit being wrong?

He's not done so with any of his baiting threads yet, why would he start now?

Oh no, the game won't have climbing because it's hard to implement properly, that OBVIOUSLY means that the game will be less of an RPG than it was...

...how the hell did you got into this conclusion?

Assassin's Creed has all these animations, but the world is shallow as a result. You see two NPCs argueing with eachother? You can't do anything except bump into them. Might as well be watching a documentary on TV. The point is that Bethesda has higher priorities.

While having climbing would be cool your constant 'should be easy' statements are annoying. If it's so easy you do it.

as for the how the system would work I guess that would be simple to put into the game, when you begin climbing look at the handhold you want to grab then press either elft or right trigger (or left/right hand buttons for PC) and your character will grab that ledge and automatically use his legs. Think about modern warfare 2, where you had to climb the ice with the pickaxe, only you can only go for certain, (somewhat highlighted or otherwose obvious) handholds. while it would be cool I don't see it coming into play

Honestly I see climbing making a return when tesselation becomes common on consoles. It will make climbing look a lot better and until then I'd rather they not bother with it.

I don't think programming climbing is that simple. Even if climbing was simply like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jUWm2ynQr4&t=0m49s with ice picks, they would have to programme it to every mountain/rock face on the entire map and no one would pick the exact same routes. But you can't even climb ladders.

Perhaps they could implement it into a quest or some missions where a scripted rockface is climbed. Perhaps a dungeon is half way up a cliff/rock face with a rope/ladder, with ice picks or an animation for climbing up. Other than that there would be too much to programme and it would probably be glitchy and look rough.

I for one am more interested in werewolves than climbing.

By seeing thread after thread of people saying "like Assassin's Creed", "like Red Dead Redemption", "like Mirror's Edge", or wondering about fighting combos, or.... etc, etc, etc.

:shrug:

Yeah... by this logic, Skyrim would also be really non-RPG because of the use of mounts, like Red Dead Redemption. Very good logic.

Seriously, this forum is weird sometimes. It seems you can't compare a feature from another game with Skyrim, before people start talking about "This isn't... [insert game name]!".

Have it ever occured to some people that games other than Skyrim/TES actually do some really good things as well, that maybe Skyrim/TES doesn't do so well? Things can Skyrim/TES can learn from?

WTF are you babbling about?


I've played TES games since Daggerfall. I play them in order to create characters and follow them as they learn and grow and explore and gain skills and gain power and come to terms with an alien world. I don't play TES games just to run around with some generic first person hero, mash buttons and kill stuff. There are already plenty of games in which I can do that. But this forum is stuffed full of people who want to turn TES into just another game in which you run around with some generic first person hero, mash buttons and kill stuff. That, as I noted, saddens me. If they have their way about it, which, to some extent at least, they certainly will, the game will be that much less. Every minute and every dollar that Beth has to spend on eye candy and super-uber-kewl fighting moves is one minute and one dollar less that they have to spend on plot, dialogue, choices, consequences, character development, NPCs, lore, dungeons, terrain, towns..... all the things that go into making a ROLE-PLAYING game rather than a first person button-masher.

This.

Unless you're experienced in this kind of work, you shouldn't have much say in what's easy because for all we know, adding those animations could be quite difficult.

And your threads make my head hurt

Great generalization of your very own personal opinion.

Don't even know where to begin, but it's probably not even necessary. Trying to explain something to you seems like a lost cause, when the answer has already been stated by Bethesda themself.

im still here

and climbing would actualy be a reason to keep acrobatics....

and decent hand to hand things an excuse to keep the skill, so if anything its more rpg like

Wow.

"Easy," no. Feasible? Yes.

I hope athletics includes some perks for climbing abilities,a good animation blending system does make complex animations easier to execute with grace.

sorry for you pal but games evolve. bethesda try to satisfy their older fans but they cant satisfy less than 50 000 people who played daggerfall and will buy skyrim over the millions who will buy it

Much of what I gather when playing Daggerfall is that a lot of the combat is button mashing and enemy crushing. Every dungeon you enter you kill like 20 people with ease. It's a major hack-n-slash combat game. The only difference now is that it'll actually look like you kill them when you kill them.

Don't get me wrong, daggerfall is great (lots of character customization in all facets) but it's a poor example of combat since most of it is monster-mashing and dungeon crawling.



:shakehead:

procedural animation system.. have a generic climbing animation, and make it so that the character model's hands and feet will automatically seek out collision model surfaces so it can make small adjustments if you're on a warped surface. Not easy, but feasible.

At the very least they need to let people jump and grab onto flat ledges, and mount small walls.



An RPG with intuitive visual features and good gameplay ideas...? IMPOSSIBLE! GOOD DAY, SIR.

I would like to grab onto ledges. Then again, Gamebryo had trouble with ladders, so I think that may be asking a bit too much for now.

How about we accept,what bethesda does with skyrim.They are already adding new things in,some we know of,some we don't.No matter what they try or do ,people always want more,and it always doesn't work like that. We have way more info to know yet on many,many things. Hell,we don't even know everything about combat yet,just half of it probably. There might be one thing someone, somewhere,won't like about skyrim,but i bet all the stuff we do/will like ,will outweigh,the stuff we don't. Let the game plant it's feet first,and let the info come in.

@ OP: The nature of your topics/or choice of words for some reason does not seem to rub well with people,especially me. Alot of people say the same things about either your threads or posts.
Hell,it's even triggered some others having a go at each other. I can understand you/and others wanting things added,but there has to be a limit or common sense somewhere. If there is that many things that bother you about skyrim so far,don't buy it.Find something that fits your needs or expectations. It's almost impossible to please everyone,when a game as such as massive interest/audience. While your entitled to your opinion/or what you'd like to see in skyrim,i sometimes think your choice of words etc,just rubs people the wrong way. Maybe it's not intentional...but it happens that often people are going to jump at it. I ain't perfect either,but maybe you should think about your wording/approch to a topic,so people can happen discuss it with a smile/sense rather than posting through hot-headedness. It may also help to be more involved in your topic,rather than disappear. If your willing to start a topic,you should contribute more to it,either to explain yourself better,or agree/disagree with people,in the right manner.

This!

There's something called tradeoffs. You know that thing that happens when you have a finite amount of people working for a finite amount of time.

dude im totaly with op look at games like easports mma (h2h) and assasins creed(climbing) shoot wow has all sorts of mounts and i dont think any of those games took more than 5 or 6 days to make .

A developer might have a list a mile long full of great ideas that they want in the game,but sometimes you can't do that. I bet if you asked a dev after a game is made if they wish they'd of added this or that,they would say yes. It's not easy making such decisions when there is so many ideas flapping around,there has to be a cut of point,for whatever reason....it's not as simple as black or white my friend. Your trying to please millions of people all at the same time....ain't going to happen.