Bethesda please do something with Marriage. : V - Skyrim

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:21 am

I'd rather have only 2 or 3 eligible characters, but way more developed characters, instead of 50 bland and empty characters that you really don't care about.

I also don't care about "marriage" per se. Romance is what people want in a story (marriage or not). Even in real life, marriage is overrated, so why would you want that in a game? Specially after taking out the reasons that makes people get married like love and six.

The only use for this feature is for people that get deep in the role-playing part of it, if you're willing to fill a lot of blanks.

Marriage is and always was overrated. Marriage is a business contract. In some countries, you don't marry for love at all ever. You marry because they're going to take care of you and your family. That's it.

Why do you think there's a lot of stories of the men floozing around? Because they married their wives because they were paid to care for them. Not love them.

It's also why today's marriage/divorce rate is all wonked up. Church weddings are more about the contract than love. People only marry in the western world for love anymore, and love goes away. Then comes divorce.

That's why the Catholic church doesn't support divorce. You didn't promise to love each other forever, you promised to take care of and support each other in your love of God. Nothing more.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:29 am

This thread went to [censored].

Arguing about what is socially acceptable in games in not the topic here.

Marriage needs more content whether it be quests, dialogue options, etc.

Raising children would also be an interesting feature, but I understand that's asking a lot.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:56 am

Marriage is and always was overrated. Marriage is a business contract. In some countries, you don't marry for love at all ever. You marry because they're going to take care of you and your family. That's it.

Which would also be a far more interesting backstory than what the current marriage system gives us.

Having to relate to a person you are married to because of political convenience, rather than having a naturally formed romantic relationship, and whether that turns into coldness and bickering, or letting actual affection for the other person blossom in spite of the circumstances, would be a far more compelling story than simply grabbing a random NPC, putting them in your house, and making them bake you pies.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:41 pm

This is one of those few topics where I have to defend Beth for keeping it minimal. They had no idea if this feature was going to be hugely controversial, so they did a good job treading on the ice. They made it available, relatively simple, and pretty straightforward.

I fully imagine some mods coming out which expand the idea greatly, then in TES VI we will see the feature expanded to be more similar to the mods. Sometimes Beth takes baby steps, and I can't fault them for that.

Agreed.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 2:14 pm

Marriage is an immersion feature in Skyrim.
Immersion is something you guys said you wanted us to have, which I am very grateful for. But marriage is so pointless and irritating, I just don't see a need for it.

I and many others were warning everyone before the game was released that the marriage system is going to svck and is not even worth implementing. It was always going to be a simple add on, that wouldn't add much to the game let alone immersion. I got abused for not wanting more options...

You all went on how Bethesda can make it work even though no other game has ever achieved such a feat.

All I can say is you wanted it, you got it! :whistling:

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:41 am

In all of those games there was no viewed direct six lol, (hello and goodbye witcher 2/ (That game had no heavy six at all lol A fade out of two people clotheless and kissing is no what i'm talking about)) BTW most of those games did not make amazing sales excluding god of war, GTA, and maybe fable. Perhaps it is you who resides under a rock beacuse you are obviously unaware that game's include sixual themes in a acceptable way. all of those games Insert six in somewhat of socially acceptable way, they both directly and indirectly hint at six.

:banghead: Do you ever get tired of being wrong? Yes there was direct six in the Witcher 2 dude including full frontal nudity with no fade outs that was only for witcher 1. I'm pretty sure I'm not allowed to link you them so you'll just have to Google it. And Dragon Age and Mass Effect sell "Very Well"

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:32 am

I'M not bothered, not home much anhyway, my only grief is, how come i can no longer find any amulets of Mara, i want to marry another girl too but i cant divorce/get rid of my current wife, and i cant find/buy another amulet of mara to simply get another wife in another city.
Overall though i'm quite happy with the system, its simple, nothing flash and she has a shop so i can sell more stuff. its basically like a hot house guard i can sell things to ^^

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 2:28 am

Yeah it's kind of silly that the "romance" with Ahnanssi from Morrowind had more depth to it. Was hoping for more conversations, as well as some flirting options. Overall, it is lacking. I just hope Bethesda takes the hints from fans, and fleshs marriage out in the next game.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:36 am

This is one of those few topics where I have to defend Beth for keeping it minimal. They had no idea if this feature was going to be hugely controversial, so they did a good job treading on the ice. They made it available, relatively simple, and pretty straightforward.

I fully imagine some mods coming out which expand the idea greatly, then in TES VI we will see the feature expanded to be more similar to the mods. Sometimes Beth takes baby steps, and I can't fault them for that.

Agreed.

No.

This isn't something where they wouldn't have known what the effects would have been, they knew exactly what they were doing. They pretty much lifted this system from a combination of Fable, and the scripting done by modders from Oblivion. They knew how to make a good or bad system out of this.

The whole gay marriage aspect or whatever, they knew full well what sorts of controversy that might bring up (and really, it didn't bring up much... which isn't surprising, since Fable did the exact same thing several years ago, and BioWare has been letting you have gay relationships for a lot longer.

The real controversy about marriage in this game is purely about how shallow the system is, and how disappointed fans were that the system was so utterly shallow as to be a mockery of the people who were waiting to see it.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:17 am

This is one of those few topics where I have to defend Beth for keeping it minimal. They had no idea if this feature was going to be hugely controversial, so they did a good job treading on the ice. They made it available, relatively simple, and pretty straightforward.

It was never going to be controversial they're not breaking new ground here far from it Bio-Ware did that back in the 90's with BG 2 and than again with Mass Effect. Fallout NV was more controversial. The ICE was solid they just didn't bother like they never bothered to give your followers much personality either.

They made it available, relatively simple, and pretty straightforward.

They made it boring, repetitive and way too straightforward.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:57 am

hello and goodbye witcher 2/ (That game had no heavy six at all lol A fade out of two people clotheless and kissing is no what i'm talking about))

How about checking your facts first? :unsure2:

There are full blown six scenes in Witcher 2 with close to no censoring or fade to black. Riding, humping, all that.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:39 pm

You got a weird definition of whats sociably acceptable if not hypocritical

Of course it sounds contradicting, However if it were not true and society didn't give a damn I'm sure we would see alot more advlt themed video games, unfortunatley videogames are usually made to accomodate children and adolecents, (Cod) (halo) (most games) the games you listed are not a common sight at all.
If society was completly ok and encouraged games including sixual themes why on earth did bethesda keep quiet about sam six marriage, and how children would work?

No one's asking for an A rated game just Non Robot Companions and marriage partners.

I understand that, I agree you should be able to have more interactions with characters as long as they are displayed in an acceptable way.

CD Projekt, Bio-Ware and Lionhead Studios say hello. Also saying that sixual acts are typically not so popular unless the game is extremly well done is saying that Skyrim wasn't done well, and like I've already posted Mid Evil Fantasy RPGs usually have some six element in them, and to not have them is a rare sight. Would you like me to list them all again or are you cool with just going back a page, because I can list them all again to prove my point if you want.

No, I don't mean minor sixual themes I'm talking about having six with a lizard man wich I find extremly disturbing. RDR is a great example of a game that included sixual themes in a acceptable maner. CD projekt made the witcher series and sold around 400,000 copies........ out of around 200 million americans with the means to purchase a 60 $ game. when a game hits near a million sales then it can be considered "popular".

Anyways, I think skyrim could use some more characterization, but no more sixual themes than the amount it all ready has.

And BTW yes I was wrong I only looked up from witcher 1, however their sales were not impressive due to their heavy scenes.

Fable did great in sales as they kept the scenes more moderate and mature.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:27 am

I really have to agree with the OP. And I don't see why everyone's making this about six - it's about the marriages being dull and bland, and not really adding anything to the game.

If you're going to go through the trouble of adding a new feature to the game, and leaking about it, making an achievement for it, etc., at least put a little effort into it.

And am I the only one seriously depressed by the selection of husbands? Ugh. :/ I know it's the land of the Nords, but do almost all the choice have to be he-manly bear types, or bearded wonders?

Here's hoping that in the inevitable expansions/updates, they'll add a bit more depth, and a bit more selection. (Or really, either way going with it would be good - fewer candidates, but a lot more depth to the relationship at least in SOME of them, or at least a little more depth, and more/better choices.)

I agree this topic has gone way out of hand, instead of us arguing perhaps we could review ways to improve marriage. I just don't want any of that witcher crap in a game like this.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 1:07 pm

I won't be buying another TES game because the fact is this game looks great and has lots of character depth but only for your character and only on the material side . Where are the interesting characters and story it's simply not here. If i had known this was Oblivion with a new graphics engine i would not have bought this game very dissapointed with the cookie cutter characters and there complete lack of depth. I will keep playing it maybe it gets better i certainly hope so . I can't wait for Mass Effect 3 so i can play a game with a great story and characters. This game has not lived up to expectations .

this, skyrim is a cardboard world with boring NPC's - just cause skyrim is a large open world game doesn't mean they can get lazy with everything else. hire writers and voice actors and actually create deep npc's, learn from bioware

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 4:44 pm

RDR is a great example of a game that included sixual themes in a acceptable maner.

So you call that scene with abraham "acceptable manner? not that I care about six being or not being in the game, just thought it's strange that you find RDR socially acceptable whilst it raised quite some discussions on the fora.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 6:04 pm

Of course it sounds contradicting, However if it were not true and society didn't give a damn I'm sure we would see alot more advlt themed video games, unfortunatley videogames are usually made to accomodate children and adolecents, (Cod) (halo) (most games) the games you listed are not a common sight at all.
If society was completly ok and encouraged games including sixual themes why on earth did bethesda keep quiet about sam six marriage, and how children would work?

What? Mass Effect and Dragon Age are not are not a common sight? You need to start checking your facts dude most of the games I listed aside from Two Worlds 2 are very popular RPG's and COD, halo are FPS so I have no idea why you'd bring those up

No, I don't mean minor sixual themes I'm talking about having six with a lizard man wich I find extremly disturbing. RDR is a great example of a game that included sixual themes in a acceptable maner. Also, Lion head studios and CD projekt aren't major game publishers sure fable is moderatley popular game but no where near a master piece like skyrim. CD projekt made the witcher series and sold around 400,000 copies........ out of around 200 million americans with the means to purchase a 60 $ game. when a game hits near a million sales then it can be considered "popular".

Anyways, I think skyrim could use some more characterization, but no more sixual themes than the amount it all ready has.

And BTW yes I was wrong I only looked up from witcher 1, however their sales were not impressive for such a great game.

Fable did allright in sales but it didn't have that much heavy six.

You could have six with a lizard man in Mass Effect 2 so I don't see what the big deal here would be here, and if you find the crap in RDR acceptable I honestly don't know what were arguing about.

FYI it sounds like you play mostly FPS, they have no weight here most "RPGs" have sixual themes.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 4:05 pm

Why so much comparison to real life marriage. If coming home and getting food and money is your marriage you should run and let the girl go have a shot at a happy marriage, also think about yourself, don't you want to be happy. I don't care what anyone says but that is not real marriage. Sorry I had to say something. No wonder most people on here admit to having no love life, it's because you think a skyrim marriage is like a real marriage. Hate me for this and comment back with whatever rebutle you have but it's true.

Now for my reply to the actual post. Marriage should be a little more involved or not at all. My character is not the lovey type. He's a ruthless killer that doesn't have time to invest in marriage.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:08 am

So you call that scene with abraham "acceptable manner? not that I care about six being or not being in the game, just thought it's strange that you find RDR socially acceptable whilst it raised quite some discussions on the fora.

Oh yes,I forgot about that, NvM on that RDR. Never played up until that part.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:21 am

your on the internet, if your really dissapointed you can't see your wife naked which is obviously why you started this thread, go to google, it will blow.your.mind.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:44 am

The Sims is like playing with barbie dolls. In Elder Scrolls, you are your own character. Marriage is universal and doesn't belong to only one game genre.

barbie dolls that can be burned, starve to death, abducted, eaten alive by flies, hit by space junk, die of heart attacks and the list goes on and on... The Sims isnt as kiddie as some may think...

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:31 pm

Oh yes,I forgot about that, NvM on that RDR.

:down: Your arguments have just lost all credibility

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:03 am

your on the internet, if your really dissapointed you can't see your wife naked which is obviously why you started this thread, go to google, it will blow.your.mind.

If someone talks about a lack of characterization or interaction with a character in a game, and the immersion-breaking consequences of that, and the only form of human interaction you can think anyone would want with another person is six, then the one with a dirty mind here is you.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:47 am

This. It's Skyrim, not the Sims. If you want more romantic features in a game, you're playing the wrong one.

Mass Effect has romantic features and it is a sci-fi 3rd person shooter RPG, therefore, it qualifies as the Sims. Dragon Age has romantic features and is a fantasy, tactical third person RPG, therefore it qualifies as the Sims.

Skyrim is a first person, fantasy RPG with features of marriage. People are asking for an update that puts it at least somewhat comparable to the two games above. Therefore, people are asking for Skyrim to turn into the Sims.

Ah logic, how I miss you so.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:37 pm

What? Mass Effect and Dragon Age are not are not a common sight? You need to start checking your facts dude most of the games I listed aside from Two Worlds 2 are very popular RPG's and COD, halo are FPS so I have no idea why you'd bring those up

Yes, I know i listed my facts wrong, mass effect made 7 million It was Witcher that suffered in sales.
i'll be sure to look up the real statistics next time.

if you find the crap in RDR acceptable I honestly don't know what were arguing about.

Never finished campaign I mainly played multiplayer, and a some of the campaign. (up to where i got to mexico)

FYI it sounds like you play mostly FPS, they have no weight here most "RPGs" have sixual themes.

I typically don't play RPG's for that main reason, as I find heavy sixual interactions to be a major turn off, (I feel like they completly ruin a good RPG(s) that i was looking forword to.) I think skyrim just needs a little more dialogue and better character depth.

» Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:53 am

:down: Your arguments have just lost all credibility

No, it just means I just have to use google more to look up statistics

Anyways lets get back on topic from this debate:
I don't feel as though nudity and six doesn't fit in well with TES/ sure having more interactions with your wife would be better if they're going to implement marriage rather than have single functioning characters.

BTW that was a good debate. :foodndrink: