Why is it that Bethesda seems so technically challenged? Graphics that just aren't up to par with the other "best" open world games out there. A world that's separated into interiors and exteriors, again. Even apparently no extra stuff for the pc.

I've seen a lot of arguments defending Bethesda over this, none of them work. Most of their customers are on the pc, there's no reason to limit themselves to just consoles. http://360.kombo.com/images/media/1661/twoworlds2_080210_21650.jpeg game looks just as good in technical terms, and is made by a much smaller team, on the consoles and pc. There's no reason the game couldn't be a seamless world, Red Faction Guerrilla is an even more interactive game and that's one entire world.

What puzzles me the most is the "no extra shiny" for the pc. Other people can do it. Independent game studios with four people can manage DX11. Modders with no financial incentive, no time, and no formal training can manage it. The issue isn't time, isn't money, a single guy working on such could sell an extra 2,000 copies or whatever it costs to pay for him. I don't understand what's holding them back. It's not like people who propose they don't care are going to be harmed by making the game prettier. Game development is more complicated than a simple "guns or butter" scenario.

There's a lot questions about Skryim's development that seem to need answering, a lot of people who say "I don't care" and will take time to post just how much they don't care. But for now I'd just like this question answered.

Two Worlds 2(which I have played and beat the main quest) Does not look nearly as good as Skyrim based on the pics I have seen, TW2 does not even look that much better than Ob to me.

Also its far to early for Beth to be releasing those kinds of technical details.

And we are less than 25% of Beth fan base if you look at sales of recent games(The Fallouts).

Two Worlds 2 has seperate interiors too... And I'm not sure PC players really are that dominant relatively to console players.

So what's your point...

That's kind of jumping the gun, don't you think?

BGS hasn't even released the system requirements yet and you are saying that they aren't doing anything extra for the PC?

Wait and see what they do before getting irritated about nothing.

Don't forget that in the past TES (and FO) games, almost every single item in the game had physics applied to it which requires an enormous amount of system resources to handle correctly. Every other game that people attempt to compare to TES/FO are either FPS games that don't allow you to pick up every single item, or are RPGs that are completely different in scope.

Fact is, you can't get an apples to apples comparison since Bethesda has the only apple tree.

I assume the OP is referring to a quote from Todd Howard, posted in http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1161816-skyrim-to-look-the-same-graphically-on-all-sytems/.

By pop-up issues, does Todd mean about things popping into view as you move through the world, or about pop-ups on the interface for quests and stuff?

Originally I thought it was about the interface, but now I think that doesn't make much sense.

I'm not sure why but it has become a trend in the gaming industry to release titles for as many platforms as possible in an attempt to reel in more customers. And every time they do it they take the crappiest platform as the base for all releases on other platforms. :brokencomputer:

What I can't understand is why it's so impossible to create different ingame graphics for different platforms...does it take a masters degree in quantum physics to write up an extra line of code here and there?

FF13 was the same - the demos looked awesome because they were done on the ps3 but when release day came everything was defaulted to the bland colored, murkier xbox 360...(and "NO!" I am not comparing it to TES so don't go flaming on me for that!)

Think it is more about issues just 'popping up' out of nowhere lol.

Pop ups in the environment.

That's because the average player's computer could not handle that many thousands of objects being rendered at the same time - you'd get too much of a framerate hit. Any modder knows this.


No they're not. If I recall correctly, I think Game's chart showed 17% of Fallout 3's sales were on PC.


No they can't. Modders have near-infinite time, but hit many of the same hurdles. Your point about large open cells - ask anyone who's used my Mournhold Expanded mod for Morrowind about the Mournhold Docks cell about its framerates. That is what happens when you put something like 100 animated NPCs into a cell with a couple of hundred thousand objects for company. The only way to have fixed that would have been to split up the cells, which I was unwilling to do, but as a modder I had that luxury of telling disgruntled players to deal with it or uninstall. If I was a game developer, I would have no choice: I would have to split it up into smaller cells, at the expense of the expansive feeling I liked.

Do you know when I could run Qarl's Texture Pack for Oblivion? 2011. That's - what? - five years or so after it came out. That's how long it took me to have a computer with the resources that could handle it plus all the other things I wanted that computer to do (such as other mods). Bethesda didn't stick smaller textures on Oblivion because they hate players and want us to be unhappy! It was about allowing people like me, at the time, to play the game with minimum-spec rigs - and even then I had to upgrade our graphics card to play it. Anything "more shiny" would have made the game unplayable for most people.

I like you e-bunny. You are smart, and more importantly, correct.

Graphics sliders.... As has been repeated at least 40 times :brokencomputer:

Personally, I am getting sick and tired of hearing about consoles. Maybe it is just me...

Making textures "slideable" wouldn't be possible?
I bet Skyrim will use something like "very low" "low" "medium" "high" "very high" instead.

This is an RPG. Graphics are secondary, and should be. The graphics for Daggerfall were fine. The graphics for Morrowind were fine. The graphics for Oblivion are fine. The graphics for Skyrim will be fine.

What should be talked about is the game play and the RPG aspects of the game. If that isnt' right than all the shiny graphics in the world can't save the game, Oblivion being a prime example.

This quote from Todd Howard about the PC and console versions of Skyrim looking the same - where did it come from?

OP said most players play on PC.

Where is the data to back that up?

Two quick things. First, I expect Bethesda will learn from the response they received about the clunky interface in TES:IV. The interface on the PC version felt out of place and clumsy. Second, I can't imagine them developing the in-game graphics and limiting them to the graphics and processing power of the relatively outdated console hardware. It was different when the consoles were not that much different from PCs.

From an NL game magazine issue, including an article of Skyrim, which, in turn, included a small interview with Todd Howard.

Sorry, stupid me. :banghead:

This

What really bothers me is some features are being in the game just to be there.
Oblivion had a MAGNIFICENT physics component that was NOT used! Apart from "wow, look the minotaur going down the slope" effects, physics was not a part of the gameplay, not a part of puzzles. It was amazing and useless at the same time. Just to see how apples pop off the tables like popcorn.

Now another technical aspect where Bethesda is behind is animations. Man, they looked bad in Oblivion. Not to mention Morrowind where they were atrocious, but that was in the era when the story and content and atmosphere were still heavy weights in the big balance of things. If Skyrim isn't ready to deliver some BEAUTIFUL animations, in fashion with what 2011 AAA games deliver as standard, I would really be pissed. I hope that Havok behavior thing can pull off something fresh and interesting, although when I look at the list of games that use it, it's nothing big. On the other hand Euphoria is awesome!

Take a moment to watch these clips. They are made by an indie studio, with Blender and Open Source. Is it natural to expect MUCH more from Bethesda, who are not an indie studio, and who are suposedly sitting on a mountain of gold after the success of Oblivion and F3?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVWZbxGFGiA&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTMpsR6XI_s&feature=player_embedded

I agree with this. The rehaul Nehrim for Oblivion that was recently released in English made excellent use of physics for puzzles and the like.