i know only one problem with new patch and that ,.. when dragons attacks he do very much damage i see in some other forum 300dmg in 1s with dragon blaster

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't they say before the game released, that they had developed a way to get bug fixes out much quicker? Whatever happened with that?

marketing ?

To everyone saying Bethesda cannot help missing some newly introduced bugs, I have two words for you:

Regression Tests

Google it.

Every big software development project should cover their code with tests that can automatically be run whenever a new build is made. A lot of the new bugs I saw mentioned are easy to write automated tests for. It is definetly bad that Bethesda didn't do this.

thx for reading my mind, this is a very legit question.

I remember I bought MW at launch... I dont remember many gamebreaking things (didnt play a lot), but what reassured me never to buy another TES game less than a year after launch was that I had spent some enormous time trying to find some dwarven ruin that was said to be 'east' off some road. After hours not finding it (and fighting cliffracers and such) I read somewhere there was a conversation bug and it was actually meant 'west'.

I SOLD the game the next day. I had bought Daggerfall on launch and felt insulted, robbed. To trust Beth and all that propaganda saying wonders of them again was a repeating an embarrasing mistake. Never again.

what's wrong with the patch? i know i'm not the first asking but no answers yet

I could not agree with you more. I told several of my friends that as soon as the patch went live, there would be several threads complaining about said patch. I should have made a bet or something.

This surprised me a bit. I thought that the games would be developed along with an automated testing suite so a machine can crunch through thousands of tests every time a new build is completed. E.g. When they program in the elemental resistance effect, they also code a test that equips a char with the effect, does 10pts damage, and checks the health went down the right amount. This is then added to the long list of other automated tests to run every time a build is completed. Trying to retest every feature manually sounds insane!

If its massive game then it should have been had massively more time on testing.

And where is the damn patch that actually balances end game for destruction spells and and makes harder to make your imba 1 shot dragons characters even at master difficulty?

Could you be more specific? What platform? Exactly what did the patch break? You realize that silly claims like your suggestion that they did no bug testing do not strengthen your complaint? Huge, complex games on multiple platforms have lots and lots of moving parts. Bethesda games would undoubtedly be less buggy if they reduced them in scope and allowed players less freedom, but we don't really want that do we? If it's too frustrating for you, by all means put the game aside for awhile. Otherwise we may need to adjust our gameplay while they fix things.

You are correct. I'm not a tester, but developer (both gaming and non-gaming products). There are tons of tools for automated tests, as small as units tests (e.g. to test a function that calculates damage done. A few unit tests on this function would have shown that damage was not calculated correctly when resistances come into play) and as big as complete scripted scenarios that play out (like what you mention). Unfortunately, a lot of software companies don't put enough time in their test processes, they don't take quality assurance (which is what testing should be about) seriously (enough). Result: they end up with a massive game that is not automatically tested and a handful of testers that can only discover so much.

A BETHESDA GAME HAVING BUGS?!

PATCHES INTRODUCING EVEN MORE BUGS?!

Sound the alarm, this is so big new, like, this never happened before... :rolleyes:

Well that's kind of the point. If it was a struggle to release the game, that means it wasn't ready to be released and was rushed.

With many big games that end up disappointing a lot of people by not being complete upon release (to my mind, Shogun 2 stands out) you get people jumping to the defence of the game developers with ready-made arguments like "Give them a break guys they work so hard!", as if a) You know how hard they are working B) they work any harder than any other game developer who can release a great game bug-free and c) effort alone should confer reward (Oh well you tried really hard to make that report as accurate as possible even though it wasn't at all..... have a raise!).

Honestly, if you went to see a blockbuster movie and the CGI wasn't finished (e.g. Wolverines claws were still green plastic, or lightsabers were still bamboo sticks) would you be happy with "Well they said the movie would be out by the date it was released so we have to accept it as it is, it's not their fault!")
Would you read a major book filled with typos, grammar mistakes and lacking punctuation? Would you be happy with that because the author tried his hardest? (in your opinion)

The fact is, if something is not complete by the time it is supposed to be released, the only option is to delay is release. I would rather wait another three months for a game than play a game for three weeks and then have to shelve it for a few months until the developers make it playable.

Why is the gaming industry the only one where it is cool to release something incomplete and not only will people buy it, they will praise you for it.

I'm sure Star Wars or The Matrix would still be great films if you watched them unfinished, but you can't watch them unfinished because the people who made them made sure they were finished before releasing them. That is their responsibility. That is also the responsibility of game developers.

Skyrim is still a great game, I still enjoy playing it, but I can't now because of the bugs, which not only did the patch not fix but actually added to! That is unacceptable however you look at it. It is clear they rushed it to release on 11.11.11 (stupid to put so much publicity on the date, makes delays very difficult) and it is clear it was rushed to be released before Xmas to make the Xmas rush money.
While, of course games developers want to make money for their work like any other person, most people get paid for doing their job right, and turning out polished, completed work. Can you say in your job you could hand in a report or whatever with inconsistencies and errors and nothing would be made of it? (Or if you are in school, homework only half done, or even an exam that wasn't finished, would you still expect an A from that exam?) Yet people treat the developers like infallible gods, or people that need their defending. If Skyrim was the perfect game, or even a game that does not deserve criticism, then would it not speak for itself? Surely if it was that good, people would have no reason to complain, or are all those people criticising aspects of this game just people who love to criticise things for the sake of it?

If we all just milled around treating everything we liked as if it was perfect, or if consumers didn't point out faults and raise criticisms with things even though they enjoyed them then how would faults that need to be addressed be discovered? How would developers be held accountable? Even if you enjoy Skyrim, no one can say it doesn't have bugs and faults.

The people who criticise only do so because they are disappointed that a game with such astounding potential, a game so great in so many ways is let down by such simple issues that would have been dealt with pre-release if the release date hadn't been rushed. Of course it could just be laziness too, but I do doubt that.

As a game compared to most other games, it is amazing and brilliant, far above most, but judged as it should be, on it's own merits and own potential (From what we were told by Bethesda pre-release, it is clear it isn't what they said it would be) it isn't what it should be, it hasn't lived up to potential and it should be better than it is.

People complain because a great game could have been THE greatest game of the new century, and because developers were happy to settle for less than they should have.

Yeah, god forbid they actually learn a thing or two from past mistakes, and get better as they release new games. :shakehead:

I'm sorry, that is not a silly claim. Have you read the programmers/developers in this very thread saying how many automated testing software programs exist? No one is saying they didn't do bug tests, people are suggesting that they didn't do enough bug tests.

Do you really think it is that difficult to find this bug when thousands of people have found it on the very first day of the patch release without even trying? Just by playing?

But talking about silly claims, lets look at yours; that Bethesda games would be made less buggy by reducing the scope of the games. No, Bethesda games would be made less buggy by increased bug testing, better patching and not rushing the release.

On to silly claim number 2 from.... you know.... you. Again; "Put the game aside for a while or adjust your gaming while they fix things". Okay, I buy a car that has faulty breaks, I'll just adjust my driving for a while until it can be fixed. I buy a kettle that won't heat water past 60 degrees. I'll just adjust my drinking while it's fixed. I buy a toilet that.... well, you get the picture.

If it was a free game, or in beta stages, you would have a point. But it is a supposedly finished game that people have paid a lot of money for, if I pay ￡40 for a game I expect to be able to play it as soon as I put it in my machine after getting it back from the shop where I exchanged my hard earned cash for it, and Ii should be able to play it without issue.

Is that somehow foolish or unreasonable?

Agree 1000000%

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ni75ipKjvDk&feature=related


Puff the magic dragon , now flies backward :blink:

Skyrim is the first game I have purchased from Bethesda. After reading about this game before release, it sound great, so I bought it and I am enjoying it very much! However, I was experiencing lag issues before, and now after release of the 1.2 patch (PS3). What I didn't know before I purchased the game is there were similar issues with the save file size causing lag problems in previous games from Bethesda. My question is, how or why can this problem continue to surface in newer releases? I understand there are going to be problems, but why isn't this problem fixed by now?

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1297205-unofficial-buglist/

Just saying, take a look. 517 bugs and counting. All found within 3 weeks of release.

Acceptable?

What did this patch break exactly?

http://www.myfacewhen.net/uploads/418-raisins-face.jpg

A signification portion of the list is composed of design decisions that don't really count as bugs. Yeah, there are no footprints in the snow. Tough. Yeah, there are a lot of bugs there, but this is still probably the least buggy TES game on release I"ve ever seen. Morrowind used to crash so often it could tell when it was about to do so and made crash-recovery savegames! Daggerfall has so many bugs that some of them will probably need to be emulated by DaggerXL just because the players will miss them.

There are, however, some extremely frustrating issues. For example, the disappearing item bug with chests was there in Oblivion and it's back. Not cool. Games are often like this. They tend to be built by clever programmers who do a lot of hacking to meet release dates. Even game engines written by John Carmack used to show a lot of the same sorts of weird bugs and instability.

As a developer, I agree they probably need a better testing routine, but I can't comment on any other aspect of the resistance issue without having an idea of what they patched.

It's obvious they didn't playtest this patch, saying otherwise just shows what kind of blinders you are wearing. I love the game. Bethesda is damaging it by not doing any regression testing.


edit: forum changes fanb'oi to devoted fan automatically. :celebration:

I was hoping it would be "adoring fan" bliviongate:

I don't mind a few minor gliches. I don't. But a lot of this stuff breaks main quests. I'm trying not to be too spoilery here, but there's an item needed for the main quest that doesn't show up for some people. Sorry guys but I think it's not release-worthy if you can't even finish the main quest until they fix that quest with a patch. If a few dragons fly backwards, doesn't bother me much. I don't care about house decorating, so meh on that as well. Also, apparently water disappears for random reasons -- again, not a big deal.