Have to correct you here. Gearbox technically isn't really working on the game. Sure, they're polishing things up, but a good 88% of the game or so was done by 3D Realms before they shut down, and the other 10% was done by Triptych Games, who consisted of former 3D Realms devs who worked on the game in their houses and shared things back and forth because they were so attached to the game that they didn't want to see Duke go out like he was about to.

So yeah, Gearbox isn't finishing anything. They're just polishing the work of 3D Realms and pushing it out the door.

As far as attention spans go.. casual gamers tend to just want to get to the action right away. They don't really care too much for "configuration" at the start of the game, and they don't care if the game's balance is rough around the edges. You can call this "mindless animals" or just "impatient" or whatever you want, the result - and the reality - is the same.

hardcoe gamers are the opposite.. they care very much for game balance, immersion, and tend to be picky about their gameplay pet peeves/wants. But along with that, they don't mind clicking through an options list to GET what they want.

Given this, "normal" mode should be for casuals, and be the default play mode, or at MOST require one click to choose. Configurable mode should be for hardcoe.

I completely agree with this. I am tired of posts about how everything can be fixed with a toggle option. I really am. http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv175/Proditus/Unnecessary.jpg <_<

There you go. http://tof.canardpc.com/view/6739a9ef-1ae8-4bdf-861a-33e0e985e64f.jpg
See? perfect game.

So me being casual means that I don't want a polished game experience? I care greatly for balance and immersion. These boards are starting to sound more and more like World of Warcraft every day.

There you go. [img]http://tof.canardpc.com/view/5ff119dd-b98d-4985-b098-dc6a59f10fdc.jpg[/img]
See? perfect game.

I'm not sure what your definition of "casual" is, then..

My impression is that the difference between casual and hardcoe players is that hardcoe players want things like:

-Mandatory eating/sleeping
-No cheap combat tactics like running backwards at full speed shooting arrows or quaffing unlimited numbers of instant healing potions
-Punishment for failure
-Limitations to a character's actions (e.g. full fighters can't join the mages guild without significant work and training)

All of the above increase either immersion or game balance or both, at the cost to a player's patience. So "casuals" have less patience and/or less desire for balance and immersion than hardcoe.. or if I'm wrong, what is the difference?

I'd say it's more like Casuals care about having fun, and hardcoe players care about realism to the point where the game is an effort to play. Appealing to hardcoe players just doesn't work. Being a casual simply means you want less commitment for a game. There is nothing wrong with that because, quite frankly, some of us would rather complete the main quest than waste out small amounts of free time figuring out where to camp for the night, or whether or not I'll be screwed because I didn't bring enough food for the long journey between Falkreath and Winterhold.

Werewolves and Vampires are too Twilight. I don't want them in my game.
Drugs and alcohol are stupid. I'm not gonna use them if they're bad for me.
I prefer Oblivion's beast race legs.
Locational damage discriminates against archer classes. I prefer melee.
Horses are pointless. Why have them if you have fast travel?
I prefer no fast travel. Fast travel appeals too much to casuals.
I play on console. Auto-aim is required if you want to be the least bit accurate.
I prefer a smaller number of skills. Too much trouble to level everything independently.
Language skills is pointless and just inconveniences a player who can't speak to some NPC's
Freerunning? This is not Assassin's Creed.
Mounted Combat no, because I hate horses. I don't want to be attacked by bandits on horses either.
I get tired of random encounters. Just because I hate to use fast travel puts me at a disadvantage? Keep combat to the dungeons.
Spellmaking is broken. I don't want it in because I can just make a Charm 100 for 3 seconds spell.
Level scaling is what Oblivion had! Too casual! Argaragagarafgqasr.
hardcoe Mode is too hard for my poor casual soul. No thanks.
Nudity is just gross. I came to play a game, not watch porm.
Why can I be naked but not have six with NPC's? Adds to immersion. Game is too casual without that.
Children are annoying and get in the way. Keep them out of my game.
Weightless gold? That just makes no sense. Completely breaks immersion.
Daggerfall had the best fatigue system ever.
Morrowind had the worst fatigue system ever.
Oblivion had the best fatigue system ever.
Spell scrolls are overpowered if you're a melee class.

See where I'm going with this? It's not black and white. For everything I listed, actually, I can say without a doubt that there have been conversations about all of them, and a good number of people shared those sentiments above. It's stupid, but that's how it goes. You can't make everyone happy.

That's why this choices should be optional... i know you exemplified in a figurative way, but a "kind of casual" player who activates this custom difficulty mode and chooses so many contradictory options should go play Tetris.

No, I think that means players should be happy with the game they get, and if they aren't they should pick another game.

What about pleasing the people who don't want the game to be ridiculously convoluted?

No, I think that means players should be happy with the game they get, and if they aren't they should pick another game.

I do not know if I am casual or hardcoe. I can not stand spreadsheeting and micromanagement, but I love playing 1000 different ways combining classes and strategies in TFC. I guess I like fluid gameplay that has a few options that can be implemented in a variety of ways. Usually games have a ton of options in how to approach a situation, but no variety among situations or a lot of gameplay situations with no variety of options in how to approach them. Perhaps that is the real secret to a good game.... keep the core mechanics simple while allowing the user to apply techniques in a myriad of meaningful ways.

No, I think that means players should be happy with the game they get, and if they aren't they should pick another game.

Thia method would please all players, casual ones and the ones who want a realism and deep experience.

Here we go!

Imagine you are about to start the game, but before you start you are asked to select some options.

hardcoe Points: You have X points

hardcoe Points Level:

- 0 - No hardcoe at all.
- 25 - Simple hardcoe.
- 50 - hardcoe.
- 75 - Hard hardcoe.
- 100 - Super hardcoe.

Each option gives you some points, each level will reward you with a ?Steam achievement? ?Nothing at all? at the end of the game.
Note that, once the game has started, you can not change any option. (You can change it at the end of the prison scape(This is an example, like Oblivion.)

hardcoe options:

-Eating, sleeping and drinking. ( Two levels.)

Level 1: You have to eat, sleep and drink water. You′ll never die, but your Attributes, weapon skills and magic skills will be drained if you don′t do it. (5 points.)
Level 2: You have to eat, sleep and drink water in order to survive. Level 1 will apply, and your health will be drained slowly if you don′t do it.(10 points)

-Where am I?. ( Three levels.)

Level 1: No quest markers at all. You have to guide yourself with NPC′s indications. (10 points.)
Level 2: Level 1 applies. Also, your location in the map will not be shown. (15 points.)
Level 3: Same level as level two, but you will only achieve this level if you choose level 2 of "-It′s cold here."(See below.) (12 points, combined with "It′s cold here" make 30 points.)

Note: While affected by weather you cannot fast travel, No matter which option you choose in "Fast travel" !

-Nice weapon... (15 points)

Weapon stats will not be shown. You′ll have to personally test the weapon in order to see if it can really help you in your adventures.

-It′s cold out there. (Two levels.)

Level 1: Weather will affect your attributes if you stay too much time outside with a cold weather. (8 points.)
Level 2: Level 1 applies, and your health will be drained if you stay too much time outside. (13 points. See "Where am I?")

Note: Wearing warm types of clothes will protect you more time!
Note: While affected by weather you cannot fast travel, No matter which option you choose in "Fast travel" !

-Fast Travel (Two levels.)

Level 1: You can only fast travel to cities or extremely well fortified places. (7 points.)
Level 2: No fast travel. (15 points.)

Willpower (8 points)

Spells can now fail. Considering NPC′s Willpower, yours and the spell magnitude, spells can fail.
Note: This also affects you!

Sneaking (10 points)

An undetected NPC sneaking and hitting you/shooting you in a vital point will harm you extremely, and most probably kill you. If you wear a helmet and an armor, damage dealt will reduce, but your vision will toggle blurred for a short period of time.

Note: It is considered you detect a NPC if you stare at him for a 1/2 second! Or using Detect life spell.

My leg! (10 points)

Your limbs are now damaged if they′re hit, causing temporary health decrease(While damaged, until healed) and damage to your attributes.

Note: A broken arm will cause serious incapability to hold a weapon!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is my idea, and I needed to express it. And I am completely sure that, if Bethesda implemented it, it would be a complete success.

You can modify what you want, points, add some options, tell your opinion...But no poll this time.

No. Consider yourself lucky if there is even a single implementation of a hardcoe mode.

The problem is that to be worth the trouble these kind of options would need to improve gameplay. If it's just going to be tedium, having to do simple/easy things your character could be assumed to do when resting or whatever that don't actually provide any real additional challenge, then I don't see the point of them or why they're even considered "hardcoe".

I see most of the "hardcoe mode" things to be annoying distractions, having to go into my inventory to eat an apple or something every X game hours doesn't seem fun at all.