Thia method would please all players, casual ones and the ones who want a realism and deep experience.

Here we go!

Imagine you are about to start the game, but before you start you are asked to select some options.

hardcoe Points: You have X points

hardcoe Points Level:

- 0 - No hardcoe at all.
- 25 - Simple hardcoe.
- 50 - hardcoe.
- 75 - Hard hardcoe.
- 100 - Super hardcoe.

Each option gives you some points, each level will reward you with a ?Steam achievement? ?Nothing at all? at the end of the game.
Note that, once the game has started, you can not change any option. (You can change it at the end of the prison scape(This is an example, like Oblivion.)

hardcoe options:

-Eating, sleeping and drinking. ( Two levels.)

Level 1: You have to eat, sleep and drink water. You′ll never die, but your Attributes, weapon skills and magic skills will be drained if you don′t do it. (5 points.)
Level 2: You have to eat, sleep and drink water in order to survive. Level 1 will apply, and your health will be drained slowly if you don′t do it.(10 points)

-Where am I?. ( Three levels.)

Level 1: No quest markers at all. You have to guide yourself with NPC′s indications. (10 points.)
Level 2: Level 1 applies. Also, your location in the map will not be shown. (15 points.)
Level 3: Same level as level two, but you will only achieve this level if you choose level 2 of "-It′s cold here."(See below.) (12 points, combined with "It′s cold here" make 30 points.)

Note: While affected by weather you cannot fast travel, No matter which option you choose in "Fast travel" !

-Nice weapon... (15 points)

Weapon stats will not be shown. You′ll have to personally test the weapon in order to see if it can really help you in your adventures.

-It′s cold out there. (Two levels.)

Level 1: Weather will affect your attributes if you stay too much time outside with a cold weather. (8 points.)
Level 2: Level 1 applies, and your health will be drained if you stay too much time outside. (13 points. See "Where am I?")

Note: Wearing warm types of clothes will protect you more time!
Note: While affected by weather you cannot fast travel, No matter which option you choose in "Fast travel" !

-Fast Travel (Two levels.)

Level 1: You can only fast travel to cities or extremely well fortified places. (7 points.)
Level 2: No fast travel. (15 points.)

Willpower (8 points)

Spells can now fail. Considering NPC′s Willpower, yours and the spell magnitude, spells can fail.
Note: This also affects you!

Sneaking (10 points)

An undetected NPC sneaking and hitting you/shooting you in a vital point will harm you extremely, and most probably kill you. If you wear a helmet and an armor, damage dealt will reduce, but your vision will toggle blurred for a short period of time.

Note: It is considered you detect a NPC if you stare at him for a 1/2 second! Or using Detect life spell.

My leg! (10 points)

Your limbs are now damaged if they′re hit, causing temporary health decrease(While damaged, until healed) and damage to your attributes.

Note: A broken arm will cause serious incapability to hold a weapon!

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This is my idea, and I needed to express it. And I am completely sure that, if Bethesda implemented it, it would be a complete success.

You can modify what you want, points, add some options, tell your opinion...But no poll this time.

Sorry, but this wont please every player.

What about pleasing the people who don't want the game to be ridiculously convoluted?

Why not? You can select the options you want

Do you even realize how much coding, extra work, etc would go into making something this convoluted? This is a programmers nightmare. They wont have the time to make something this over the top.

"Why not, you can select the options you want"

Really? So you could select the option for spears then, or for MW dice roll combat, or Daggerfall size world,etc This would not even come close to pleasing everyone.

No. Consider yourself lucky if there is even a single implementation of a hardcoe mode.

That′s not what we are discussing. Making a game needs time. Making a good game needs more time.

I agree just have a one-way toggle setting for some settings.
Like compass, any kind of quest markers or compass icons, and a "hardcoe/survival" mode.

Why make it more complicated than it is?

That's what they said about Duke Nukem.

Then they had to let another company finish it.

And if the game is truly good, it won't need thousands of toggles. Your idea is overcomplicated.

Yeah, pretty much this.
Should there be options? Of coarse, and there are. But this..this is just ridiculous.

You might think not, but it's not so simple as just programming it in, but making it work with every other system already in place. It can't just work, it has to work right.



I completely agree with this. I am tired of posts about how everything can be fixed with a toggle option. I really am. http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv175/Proditus/Unnecessary.jpg <_<

So wait, what are the points for? Just some achievement thing?

A much simpler solution is simply have an on/off hardcoe mode that: Disables fast travel, quest markers, makes potions heal over time, and possibly requires you to eat/drink/sleep. That might not please everyone (your system won't either, especially since its way too complex) but it will certainly make a lot of people happy.

I think the OP's idea is unnecessarily convoluted, but he has the basic idea right.

The devs should design the game for the super-hardcoe. And then they should just take out all the features that would make console kiddies cry, and call that "normal" mode. Make some in-between mode too if you want to. Then just give an option at the start, like a difficulty selection. This WOULD please everyone.

I think the easiest solution for gamesas would be not include any toggling, and simply have the "hardcoe" features be the standard. Or at least that's what I'm hoping for.

Some things could work well as options (like weather effects maybe), but others, particularly the ones that would greatly change the way combat works (like the spell failing and limb damage one) could be trouble since it'd affect the whole game balance. The level designers could just like, but three bandits in a room which would be a difficult encounter on the regular game but be impossible with a few settings changed.

I think of all solutions this may be the best. I heard Fallout New Vegas had this hardcoe and many people liked it.

The idea is not bad, but you haven't sell it very well. As you stated that this could please all players, you have predisposed some people against your idea. Then giving points for immersion didn't seem the best move, as the players that seek immersion, won't appreciate points and achievements. And mentioning the end of the game, is for many people some sort of anathema.

I like the idea though and I would like to see it in game as I would like to decide what I want and what not in my game.

I can't understand what is so complicated about it. If you implement necessities, you can suppress them without problem. Hiding map markers? Easy. Disable an option? Easy too.

you can't please Sparta and Athens at the same time

for me the game seems pretty good some things will be modded but its all good

What about the people who don't want the game to be super convoluted at the start and just want the game to start in a way that pleases everyone in some form or fashion?

And before you say there's no one like that, you're reading his post.

Point is, you can't please everyone no matter what you do.


Have to correct you here. Gearbox technically isn't really working on the game. Sure, they're polishing things up, but a good 88% of the game or so was done by 3D Realms before they shut down, and the other 10% was done by Triptych Games, who consisted of former 3D Realms devs who worked on the game in their houses and shared things back and forth because they were so attached to the game that they didn't want to see Duke go out like he was about to.

So yeah, Gearbox isn't finishing anything. They're just polishing the work of 3D Realms and pushing it out the door.

They've been making this game for more than two-three years now. It's going to be good. Hell, it's going to be GREAT by all accounts. >_>

So it appears that by Bethesda failing to implement your ridiculously complicated system that would please NO ONE, they've succeeded at displeasing another (self-indulgently critical) gamer. Lovely.

"Casual players" is how the so-called "hardcoe Players" call people who disagrees with them. That's all. In that way I'm always right because eh, "I'm a hardcoe Player, and you are a casual player, little bastard"...

I can understand the original concept of both terms, but the truth is that almost everybody use them at their convenience...

As far as attention spans go.. casual gamers tend to just want to get to the action right away. They don't really care too much for "configuration" at the start of the game, and they don't care if the game's balance is rough around the edges. You can call this "mindless animals" or just "impatient" or whatever you want, the result - and the reality - is the same.

hardcoe gamers are the opposite.. they care very much for game balance, immersion, and tend to be picky about their gameplay pet peeves/wants. But along with that, they don't mind clicking through an options list to GET what they want.

Given this, "normal" mode should be for casuals, and be the default play mode, or at MOST require one click to choose. Configurable mode should be for hardcoe.