Brotherhood of Steel is... good.

Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:27 pm

Having played Fallout 1, 2, 3, and New Vegas literally TO DEATH, I decided to delve into the two "spin-offs" of the series, Fallout Tactics, and Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel.

Starting up Fallout Tactics, the supposed "true-to-Fallout-game" I was greeted by an http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kxq3Rmq1ho (what?) followed by a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFV1QvnLVsM&feature=related (double and triple what?). I was then plunged into some rather unintuitive gameplay, much differently than Fallout 1, 2, and 3, all of which I didn't even HAVE a manual for. Needless to say, the flawed story was not enough to get me over the learning curve and I stopped playing.

Then, the "BURNED GAME". The "black sheep" of the Fallout Franchise, and the reason "Interplay should never have the Fallout license again." I boot it up, and get greeted by a http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifnMjqdm4QE&feature=related This time, I'm thrown into a dispute with Raiders and townsfolk over the Junktown-esque city of Carbon. Everything's going pretty well until... the infamous "thong babe". Actually named "Raider Matron" she, in fact, sports clothing about as skimpy as the female raiders from Fallout 3 and New Vegas, with the exception of the fact that instead of sporting skimpy, lore-friendly patchwork armor, http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110627122131/fallout/images/b/b4/Jane.jpg. Yeah, that's kind of embarrassing. But in all fairness, I'm 2 hours into the game, and I would probably say it's somewhere in between Fallout 3 and Tactics, in overall "goodness" (on a scale of NV-2-1-3-BoS-T:BoS). It has boss battles, that with the exception of the Giant Roboscorpion from Old World Blues, and Frank Horrigan from Fallout 2, are more nuanced than any I've seen in a Fallout game to date. The Dialogue is about as "bad" as the dialogue as Fallout 3, except in a different way (if that makes any sense).

In closing, Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel is not a bad game. There is some clear pandering to the often-immature "console crowd" but in my opinion it's better and more reconcilable with current canon than Tactics. If you're looking for a stupid fun Fallout fix, I would recommend giving it a fair chance. And if you're one of those people who have never played it, but use the term "Burned Game" day in and day out to describe it, I would recommend Google searching "bandwagon appeal".
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Peter lopez
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:20 pm

He's a witch - BURN HIM. Chase him back to whence he came!
:flamethrower: :obliviongate:

/Humour

Seriously, I think the issue with PBOS is that it was an "average" game, but a terrible "Fallout" game.
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cutiecute
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:09 pm

An opinion?! Not on my watch! :tongue: Humor aside people just like to hate on it. Most of the people have probably never played it and just want to be part of the fad. I haven't played it before so I don't know if it's bad or good, but I'm not beat the dead horse and hate on a game I've never played.
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Kevan Olson
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:12 pm

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_canon#Non-canon_works


Oh and: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUsvYsxMMKs
That was good? :shudders:
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XPidgex Jefferson
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:33 pm

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_canon#Non-canon_works


What Gabriel said.
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stephanie eastwood
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:38 pm

-snip-


I disagree with all of that. I could say more but there'd be some no-no words.
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Manny(BAKE)
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:44 pm

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_canon#Non-canon_works


Oh and: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUsvYsxMMKs
That was good? :shudders:

That wasn't the opening. That was the trailer. Trailers are often awful.
Have you seen the Donnie Darko trailers?
Have you seen the Rise of the Planet of the Apes trailers?
Have you seen the Star Wars: A New Hope trailers?

I disagree with all of that. I could say more but there'd be some no-no words.

Have you played it? Because if you haven't, you don't have a worthwhile opinion. That may sound dismissive, but if you haven't experienced something, you can't pass judgement on it. You are most likely the exact type of person I targeted this thread at.

Now answer me this, have either of you actually played the game? On a basic, logical level, I have played the game so my opinion is much more valid than yours.
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Emma
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:09 pm

Oh and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMPkVY088VE&feature=related

"I was born just after the bombs fell"

This means around 2077 to 2085.

"Then the Brotherhood came, and everything changed..."

She looks like 20'ish to early 30's in this screenshot: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Nadia
This would mean that the Brotherhood would have had to show up in latest being 2015.

Then we have the BOS: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Brotherhood_of_Steel#Early_Years

"Little is known about the early years of the Brotherhood of Steel. In 2134, a faction led by Sergeant Dennis Allen gained strength in the organization, and urged the Brotherhood's Elders to let them explore the southeast ruins of the primary West Tek Research Facility, now called the Glow after it was directly hit by a Chinese nuclear bomb, for technological artifacts."

Not much is known but the earliest date we have is 2134.
Now I ask of you to tell me how the hell the Brotherhood managed to establish such dominance that it could send out a chapter to Texas.
Let alone why she and a [censored] ghoul was accepted into the ranks of the BOS at such an early age when bigotry towards outsiders was still hefty.
It also says the game takes place in 2208: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout:_Brotherhood_of_Steel#Setting
Doesn't that mean our dear Nadia is at youngest 193 years old?

And how the hell did Attis get a hold of more FEV? Did he create it? How? Mariposa was blown up as seen in Fallout 2 and West-Tek is but a faint memory.

There are far more inconsistencies in F:BOS than it is in FT.

[edit]

And this is just the tip of the iceberg, I haven't even played F:BOS and after searching around for 10 minutes I already find this much crap.
I can't imagine how much if [censored]s over canon, I would love to buy it, play it and rant about it but I'm afraid that The Ring will happen to me if I do.
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Samantha Wood
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:06 pm

You chose The Burned Game over Tactics!?!?!?! WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT???!

Seriously? Tactics kicks ass, the MWBoS are the only ones I fully support, all the rest svck imho.
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Ashley Clifft
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:04 pm

That wasn't the opening. That was the trailer. Trailers are often awful.
Have you seen the Donnie Darko trailers?
Have you seen the Rise of the Planet of the Apes trailers?
Have you seen the Star Wars: A New Hope trailers?


Have you played it? Because if you haven't, you don't have a worthwhile opinion. That may sound dismissive, but if you haven't experienced something, you can't pass judgement on it. You are most likely the exact type of person I targeted this thread at.

Now answer me this, have either of you actually played the game? On a basic, logical level, I have played the game so my opinion is much more valid than yours.



Played,

Horrible,
Inconsistent,
Nonsensical
Abomination

No thanks, Tactics was gold compared to this, at least is considered Semi-Canon,
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Francesca
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:00 pm

Oh and here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMPkVY088VE&feature=related

"I was born just after the bombs fell"

This means around 2077 to 2085.

"Then the Brotherhood came, and everything changed..."

She looks like 20'ish to early 30's in this screenshot: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Nadia
This would mean that the Brotherhood would have had to show up in latest being 2015.

Then we have the BOS: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Brotherhood_of_Steel#Early_Years

"Little is known about the early years of the Brotherhood of Steel. In 2134, a faction led by Sergeant Dennis Allen gained strength in the organization, and urged the Brotherhood's Elders to let them explore the southeast ruins of the primary West Tek Research Facility, now called the Glow after it was directly hit by a Chinese nuclear bomb, for technological artifacts."

Not much is known but the earliest date we have is 2134.
Now I ask of you to tell me how the hell the Brotherhood managed to establish such dominance that it could send out a chapter to Texas.
Let alone why she and a [censored] ghoul was accepted into the ranks of the BOS at such an early age when bigotry towards outsiders was still hefty.
It also says the game takes place in 2208: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout:_Brotherhood_of_Steel#Setting
Doesn't that mean our dear Nadia is at youngest 193 years old?

And how the hell did Attis get a hold of more FEV? Did he create it? How? Mariposa was blown up as seen in Fallout 2 and West-Tek is but a faint memory.

There are far more inconsistencies in F:BOS than it is in FT


Did I not mention that those were trailers? The manual and actual game completely contradict the timeline laid out by the trailers. Suffice it to say that the game takes place in 2208, and all the character origins described in the game fit well within such a time period,, so your entire timeline continuity argument is invalid. I will reiterate, this is how someone who has actually played a game has a more valid perception of it.

The chapter sent out to Texas is clearly under developed. Most likely a small group of "soldiers' who are now far detached from the actual Brotherhood of Steel at Lost Hills. It is in no way unacceptable to predict that a detachment from Lost Hills could sustain a minor foothold in Texas after 70 or so years. This is evidenced by their lack of sufficient armor and weapons for initiates, and their willingness to take almost anyone as an initiate. This brings me to my next point, Cain, the ghoul (who is, not an integral part of the story, as he is only one of 6 playable characters with separate stories) had trouble entering the Texas Brotherhood of Steel due to bigotry against ghouls. That's why he is sent on the mission to Carbon, to prove that a Ghoul is valuable to the Brotherhood of Steel.

As to how Attis was able to get a hold of FEV, I really don't understand the problem? The Enclave had modified FEV in the late 2200's, and the exact nature of FEV has never been fleshed out. For all we know, Attis could have extracted the FEV from his own blood. This is all postulation on my part, as I have not yet met Attis, and the Vault has very sparse information on BoS.

These "inconsistencies" (not really inconsistencies) are nothing compared to the Tactics. Where not only does the BoS ride fuel-powered Humvees, but they have came from a military vault and run into a unique strain of Deathclaws that for some unexplained reason have undergone rapid, unnecessary mutation to grow hair and speak whereas Deathclaws on the East AND West Coast are entirely the same, developmentally.

Played,

Horrible,
Inconsistent,
Nonsensical
Abomination

No thanks, Tactics was gold compared to this, at least is considered Semi-Canon,

Thank you for that valid, insightful list of contentions. Surely you have out-debated me with your unevidenced single-word replies as opposed to my fleshed out, anecdotal arguments. :rolleyes:
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xxLindsAffec
 
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Post » Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:31 am

In closing, Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel is not a bad game. There is some clear pandering to the often-immature "console crowd" but in my opinion it's better and more reconcilable with current canon than Tactics. If you're looking for a stupid fun Fallout fix, I would recommend giving it a fair chance. And if you're one of those people who have never played it, but use the term "Burned Game" day in and day out to describe it, I would recommend Google searching "bandwagon appeal".


I have played FO:POS, is not a uterlly bad game, I can give you that but at the same it's not on the same level of the first two Fallouts, FO3/NV or even Tatics.
Tatics even contradicts some cannon, but is an enjoyable game if you like some RTS mixed with RPG. The story is not stelar or very original, but is competent at least.
But the main point is not that.

Interplay cancelled Fallout 3 for this piece of garbage?
You've got to be kidding!

Imagine if Bethesda postponed Skyrim for the end of 2012 because they want to lauch...Doom 2 for iPhone!
And then they cancel the game.
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Catherine Harte
 
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Post » Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:01 am

These "inconsistencies" (not really inconsistencies) are nothing compared to the Tactics. Where not only does the BoS ride fuel-powered Humvees, but they have came from a military vault and run into a unique strain of Deathclaws that for some unexplained reason have undergone rapid, unnecessary mutation to grow hair and speak whereas Deathclaws on the East AND West Coast are entirely the same, developmentally.


Tactics is SEMI-Canon, so not everything is canon

Burned Games is NON-Canon, Bethesda confirmed it


Dealt with it :disguise:
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Mylizards Dot com
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:56 am

I've never played F:BoS, nor do I really want to, but I would play it so I could understand it, I mean, the game is contradictive to established lore, so is Tactics, but over all, I do agree that despite my well researched opinion, it is lacking that I never PLAYED F:BoS.
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Nick Swan
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:37 pm

Tactics is SEMI-Canon, so not everything is canon

Burned Games is NON-Canon, Bethesda confirmed it


Dealt with it :disguise:


I've been staying out of it, as I haven't played the game, but I just have to say. From what I can gather, what you just said is inconsequential to the OP's point.
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Ana
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:32 pm

Tactics is SEMI-Canon, so not everything is canon

Burned Games is NON-Canon, Bethesda confirmed it


Dealt with it :disguise:

And of course, Bethesda's (the developers responsible for Fallout 3) stand on canonity is the definitive factor in quality of any Fallout game. Do you understand how ridiculous that sounds?
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Alisha Clarke
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:47 am

Oh and: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUsvYsxMMKs
That was good? :shudders:


That was absolutely mind blowing :flamethrower: :shocking:
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Melis Hristina
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:24 am

I've never played F:BoS, nor do I really want to, but I would play it so I could understand it, I mean, the game is contradictive to established lore, so is Tactics, but over all, I do agree that despite my well researched opinion, it is lacking that I never PLAYED F:BoS.

I haven't run into a single facet of the game that actually contradicts existing lore at the moment, and I'm over 2 hours in. There are definitely some things that are out of place (see: Raider Matron in lingerie) but nothing outright non-canon. It's a misconception perpetuated by the same people who use the term "Burned Game".
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James Baldwin
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:06 pm

1. Did I not mention that those were trailers? The manual and actual game completely contradict the timeline laid out by the trailers. Suffice it to say that the game takes place in 2208, and all the character origins described in the game fit well within such a time period,, so your entire timeline continuity argument is invalid. I will reiterate, this is how someone who has actually played a game has a more valid perception of it.

2. The chapter sent out to Texas is clearly under developed. Most likely a small group of "soldiers' who are now far detached from the actual Brotherhood of Steel at Lost Hills. It is in no way unacceptable to predict that a detachment from Lost Hills could sustain a minor foothold in Texas after 70 or so years. This is evidenced by their lack of sufficient armor and weapons for initiates, and their willingness to take almost anyone as an initiate. This brings me to my next point, Cain, the ghoul (who is, not an integral part of the story, as he is only one of 6 playable characters with separate stories) had trouble entering the Texas Brotherhood of Steel due to bigotry against ghouls. That's why he is sent on the mission to Carbon, to prove that a Ghoul is valuable to the Brotherhood of Steel.

3. As to how Attis was able to get a hold of FEV, I really don't understand the problem? The Enclave had modified FEV in the late 2200's, and the exact nature of FEV has never been fleshed out. For all we know, Attis could have extracted the FEV from his own blood. This is all postulation on my part, as I have not yet met Attis, and the Vault has very sparse information on BoS.

4. These "inconsistencies" (not really inconsistencies) are nothing compared to the Tactics. Where not only does the BoS ride fuel-powered Humvees, but they have came from a military vault and run into a unique strain of Deathclaws that for some unexplained reason have undergone rapid, unnecessary mutation to grow hair and speak whereas Deathclaws on the East AND West Coast are entirely the same, developmentally.


Thank you for that valid, insightful list of contentions. Surely you have out-debated me with your unevidenced single-word replies as opposed to my fleshed out, anecdotal arguments. :rolleyes:

1. Then they made an inconsistency with their own inconsistency.

2. And "why" is a small group of soldiers just allowed to go off on their merry adventure? BOS is very very very strict with rules, I doubt they'd send any chapter away in those conditions. As to Cain, did he prove himself then? Cause the Vault Dweller ventured into a radiation hell to retrieve research notes (IIRC) in order to be allowed in. What did Cain do?

3. What more needs to be fleshed out? America was afraid of biological and biochemical warfare so West-Tek was contracted to work on the Pan-Immunity Virion Project which later became the Forced Evolutionary Virus. After the government found out about it they immediately transfered it over to Mariposa for further testing, where soon after the bombs fell. They sent it to Mariposa for a reason, not just so they could send it away to 40 other sites. Enclave got their FEV from Mariposa when they stormed it but had to pull out due to the 2nd gen super mutants forcing them out. And in 2277 they likely had FEV left from the Oil Rig when they evacuated it. And how the hell is FEV taken from their bodies? How is a super mutant in an underdeveloped area going to get the resources to reproduce it?

4. And what's so bad about vehicles? Oil was running out, it hadn't ran out completely before the bombs hit. that they came from a military vault is an inconsistency sort of, but even then the military vault could easily be Mariposa, it was a vault by definition that was run by the US army, a military vault. Deathclaws where originally mean to be hairy, so if anything it's a correction to the lore, and that they can speak, well here are some suggestive speculations:

"Furthermore, some of them were noted to be capable of speech as early as in 2197, which means that they probably developed speech through spontaneous mutation, or were experimented on by someone other than the Enclave. Another possibility that they were designed to have an intellect and ability to speak before the Great War."
Oh and emphasis on some^.

It wasn't explained why but that doesn't mean that their design is an inconsistency at all.
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Lizs
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:14 pm

If the OP likes BoS over Tactics it's his opinion and he has the right to it.

Fallout BoS isn't canon but that does not stop people from thinking it is a good game.

Fallout Tactics is awesome!
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Kay O'Hara
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:12 pm

Oh, how about the Vault Dweller [censored] taking a wrong turn at Albuquerque and ending up in Texas so you can team up with him.
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Karine laverre
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:22 pm

If the OP likes BoS over Tactics it's his opinion and he has the right to it.

Fallout BoS isn't canon but that does not stop people from thinking it is a good game.

Fallout Tactics is awesome!

Hm, when the Tactics veteran comes in I'd expect more really. :/
We're no longer on opinions, we're on canonity, facts.
This is your time to shine man! D:
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Katy Hogben
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:15 pm

Hm, when the Tactics veteran comes in I'd expect more really. :/
We're no longer on opinions, we're on canonity, facts.
This is your time to shine man! D:


The point is it is Fact that BoS isn't canon at all. I don't see why we need to debate that. It is a done deal.

Fallout Tactics only has some minor inconsistencies. Other so called inconsistencies arn't really inconsistencies just people jumping to conclusions, such as "the cars run on Fossil Fuel."

Brotherhood of Steel was made with complete disregard for Fallout lore and canon. If I remember right it was okayed by the same people that cancelled Van Buren. The people that bought out Inerplay.
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MISS KEEP UR
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:17 pm

Hm, when the Tactics veteran comes in I'd expect more really. :/
We're no longer on opinions, we're on canonity, facts.
This is your time to shine man! D:

You told him that Bethesda has said it wasn't canon, but he completely ignored that fact, so, so be it.
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Nicole Kraus
 
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Post » Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:39 pm

The point is it is Fact that BoS isn't canon at all. I don't see why we need to debate that. It is a done deal.

We got anything better to do here?
We've already debated most stuff, never seen a Tactics VS FBOS in canon.
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SUck MYdIck
 
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