Yeah, I'm sure that Bethesda are going to canonise Star Trek and Dr Who with the Fallout Universe. I can see no legally ramifications for doing so, nor any fan backlash.

WOW basicaly re-wrote Indian Jones as a large chunk of an Expansion. see

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYA2PUMg4sM

and boy did they get riped for it by a lot of there more vocal fans. I kind of got tired of listening to several podcasts that suddenly turned into Complainaothons about him, and they were STILL complaining about it as late as WOD

Technically, with multiverse theory, and both shows frequent time traveling/parallel universe antics, you wouldn't need to canonize either show within Fallout per say.

Star Trek wouldn't exist in Fallout's universe, it would just have fallen through their own universe into Fallout's, and given Fallout's 1950's scifi B-movie trope setting, that wouldn't be too far fetched.

We already have a jukebox saving Big MT. from a "sonic invasion" in canon, this isn't any more stupid.

Except MK's writings and lore documents aren't "fan fiction" and are taken seriously not only by the writers at Bethesda but also the writers at Zenimax Online. MK's writings aren't as unlore-friendly as Monty Python jokes, A time traveling gate from star trek, Doctor Who, the four horseman, a giant footprint with a crushed corpse, A crashed federation shuttle from star trek, a giant stone talking head, and even more silly encounters.

MK's work isn't fan fiction but universe expanding, special encounters aren't canon but silly little encounters. Plus the BoS doesn't have kinds or monarchs, they are ruled by a council of High Elders.

They aren't a kingdom they are more akin to a monastic order from the time of the crusaders. Their entire structure is based around belief and the same organizational structure of the Crusader sects like the Templars or the Knights hospitalier or the Teutonic Knights.

they ARE fan fiction, they are made by someone who is not part of the company, they have little to do with what actually goes on in-game, and generally tends to contradict what is STATED in game a lot.

He DOES NOT work for teh company, and the work he does has ZERO relation to the company, as in, fan fiction.

Nice poor and false logic. Also if you bothered to know anything about TES you'd understand that the games themselves contradict each other, that's been a trend going on in the elder scrolls games for years now. Now I suggest you get back on topic.

Technically, MK's works are not canon unless referenced in the games themselves. Since MK isn't a Bethesda employee, he thus has no legal way to make anything he writes canon-lore.

Its true Bethesda does take many of them seriously, but they still aren't canon unless directly referenced, or actually put in-game. And many of them, like the one where he lists the names of the 500 companions, all of which are stupid sounding, are jokes by his own admission.

Nothing MK writes is contradicted by the games actually. He is very good at making sure about that.

also bethesda's games already contradicted themselves.

Yeah, but they do that on purpose.

Several of the devs have said, even as far back as Morrowind, that they knowingly and intentionally put contradictory information in their games, sometimes with absolutely no real care for deciding on any "true" version of the story.

The MWBoS armor looks pretty much like the Enclave PA from FO3, just with a cape.

Considering that the BoS was shoehorned into Fallout 3, because someone at Beth thought this as well, doesn't make it so. Fallout can have the BoS sit out of a game or two, and still be Fallout. If Beth was just creative enough to create their own unique factions, the BoS on the East Coast wouldn't have been a thing. They actually did create a tech-based faction of their own, the Institute, but again, because someone at Beth thought like you, and so shoehorned the BoS into the game, it became a ridiculous story of how they got to the East Coast.

I can sit here all day and point at random [censored] in FO that i don't like and claim they shoehorned it in...

They did, it's obvious they did, I don't see how people can say otherwise. Maybe you can explain how the BoS, a small isolationist faction with limited manpower, wasn't shoehorned into Fallout 3?

how WERE they shoehorned in at all? just because they could have made their own thing, does not automatically mean they NEED to do so. We know for a fact the BoS was already splitting apart in Fallout Tactics, and the fact that Bethesda NEEDED to connect to the older games so as to not alienate the original fanbase, and the fact that a less neutral BoS fit perfectly within the story, basically made them the perfect choice.

I don't need to, the game already explained that. But, you're not going to accept that kind of answer, so why should I bother to educate someone who refuses the answer.

I agree that they're appearance as forced, but, at the same time, I can concede that it was probably done for the reasons that PKMN12 says and it probably was the only option tbh when picking up the franchise. They needed some link and the Brotherhood does seem like the best way to link them together. Would have been more plausible if it wasn't set on the East Coast mind but that's the route that they took.

So the airship we see being brought down belongs to the BoS? Does that mean we are going to be at odds with the BoS? I really don't want to have to go to war with the Brotherhood. I always opt to help or join them when I get the chance to.

Nothing so far says you HAVE to fight against them.

Concept art shows the player fighting ALONGSIDE a BoS solider, and a Commonwealth Minuteman, in some large battle, suggesting you can side with them if you want.

The older fanbase was already alienated by various parts of Fallout 3, Beth didn't need the BoS to try and connect with them that way. And how the BoS was handled, less neutral, was one of those ways they alienated older Fallout gamers. It's been heard on here, and elsewhere. And that they fit perfectly into such a B&W story, was one of those examples of how they were shoehorned in. White Knights fighting the Black Knights. They could have just done something unique, faction wise, which older Fallout gamers have said time and time again. Come up with their own high-tech faction for the East, which they did, the Institute.

Instead of adding a recycled faction from previous games, they could have connected the two, in subtler ways, which would have been much more appropriate and logical.

But, to the original point I quoted, the idea that the BoS needs to be in every Fallout location, for it to somehow be Fallout, as was the original point I was speaking to, is not true. The BoS doesn't have to be everywhere, but if they are, they're shoehorned in.

That's a cheap way of trying to explain your position, by giving a non-answer. The game explained the BoS being in the Capital Wasteland poorly, and is apart of how they were shoehorned into being there, just because someone at Beth said they needed to be, so that doesn't help your point at all. If you can actually come up with a reason, and not make excuses or use a poorly written and reasoned story, that would be much more appreciated than just basically saying snidely, "You're wrong."

clearly, you are the kind of person to NEVER be happy and just like complaining about stuff. They gave a answer, an answer that makes sense considering the BoS, you can take it, or no, does not matter to them.

I disagree. Because they were largely destroyed in Fallout 2, the Enclave is the group that was 'shoehorned' in. The BoS was already struggling with their waning dominance in Fallout 2, and the appearance of the Enclave, a more technologically advanced faction, made the situation even more dire. Lyons was only a Paladin when he was sent East; he had a three part mission: to reestablish contact with the Midwest Brotherhood of Steel, to find advanced technology in the Capitol Wasteland, and to investigate a reported Super Mutant presence. This makes perfect sense, because they need to boost their numbers, need to increase their technological edge, and take the threat of The Master's Super Mutant army very seriously. When he discovered Liberty Prime, which could be a huge game changer for the BoS, he was promoted to Elder and ordered to stay in the Capitol Wasteland to repair their new asset.

So you think you understand me from a couple of posts? You don't even realize what my initial complain was towards: That Fallout isn't Fallout, without the BoS somewhere in the game. That simply isn't true. We can have a Fallout game without the BoS in it, just like we can have games without the NCR or any other faction from previous games.

My example of them being shoehorned in to Fallout 3, showed that the BoS being there was a poorly reasoned story, and thus a bad answer. It's major flaw comes from the fact that they chose a part of the BoS, who has always been shown to be isolationist and limited in manpower, and dropping in number, not increasing. Which makes it difficult for groups of people, when they're already losing numbers at home, to go out and lose some more across an entire continent, just so the game can say, "Hey, it's a connection!" It's weak, poor story telling and doing things like that more, will only hurt the franchise.

Yeah obviously, but the Enclave is not what we were discussing was it?

Still, highly dubious Brotherhood of Steel mission. Just because they give a reason doesn't mean it's any good. For one how the hell did they hear of a super-mutant presence on the other-side of the continent? Secondly gaining a technological edge isn't much if you then have to transport it all the way back across the country to California when there's probably many other facilities in-between that would contain technology.

Hell they don't even set up in an actual research lab, thank God that the DoD just happened to be performing major engineering and construction works right beneath the Pentagon in the middle of the city rather than in an actual base or something.

Hopefully so. In one of my play throughs I am planning on being a hero of the people and working for the betterment of the lives of the people of the Bostonian Wasteland. If the BoS are working with the people, I want to be able to side with them.

On the flip side, when I do my raging evil maniac of the wastes, I look forward to blowing that ship up and burning as many of the towns to the ground that I can, leaving a trail of bodies in my wake. No fears, no regrets.... no survivors lol

Underlined is why words are wasted on you.