I have been playing FNV for over a week virtually without issue (been using ati dll fix to smooth out framerates/stuttering) and its been fun.

However, late last night I experienced a BSOD (my first ever on this set-up) while playing FNV. Was just walking around Novac when it happened. Then, every time I attempted to reboot the system, I got a BSOD at the "starting windows" splash screen. I tried booting from a linux live CD (Kubuntu 10.10) and from the Windows 7 DVD, but the system still crashed during loading.

I have had my system stably overclocked by 10% (to 2.86Ghz) through the ASUS jumper free configuration in the BIOS for the past 2 years. Reseting the CPU to factory clocks allowed my system to boot successfully without error; but if I return to the 10% OC the system won't boot. Haven't had chance to run any diagnostics yet, though I intend to tonight, but I'm worried that my CPU may have been damaged or impaired by the crash.

When running FNV neither my CPU nor my GPU usage has exceeded 50% (typically around 30-40%). My CPU and GPU temps while playing are both around 45-55C

Anyone else had similar experiences? All advice appreciated.


System specs:
OS: Windows 7 Professional 64-bit
CPU: AMD Phenom X4 9950 Black 2.6 GHz
GFX: XFX ATI HD5850 1GB
Mem: 4GB Corsair Dominator DDR2 1066Mhz
MB: ASUS M3A32-MVP Deluxe
PSU: Corsair 850W
Case: Antec 900 Gamer

cant really see this being the fault of the game.

so does it work fine without the overclock? i mean can you still play all the games on your system without fault without the overclock?

sounds more like the motherboard causing an issue with the overlock. I havent used a single asus board that hasnt been quirky with overclocking yet.

though im not experienced with the 1st gen phenoms so im not sure about whether its a cpu problem.

did your cpu overclock with a xmultiplier or by FSB?

If it was a system overclock of 10% it may be the motherboard chip or memory that was running too hot.
This game doesn't overtax the CPU or GPU but there's a lot of data loading/unloading as you move around
so the data path from your hard drive to memory is busy and maybe the southbridge/northbridge chips get hot?

Did your overclock include overvoltage? on the FSB, RAM or MCH

The system seems to work okay with the CPU clock reset to factory defaults, but It was getting late so I didn't have time to fully test the CPU under a constant load. Will be doing some test when I get home. I was using the 10% overclock profile in the BIOS, which increases the FSB and not the multiplier. I also have "cool and quiet" enabled, which automatically ramps down the CPU clock when not under significant load.

But, like I said, the system has been stably overclocked for the past 2 years and I have never had the BSOD on this set-up. In fact my system hardly ever crashes. So it seems a bit of coincidence that it happened:
(1) in FNV, for which many other users have reported BSODs, CTDs and other crashes and freezes
(2) when my CPU usage was at less than 50% and under 60C

But I guess the problem could also be with my memory (as this also gets overclocked using the ASUS profiles) or possibly my motherboard or BIOS. I shall be doing plenty of testing tonight to try to get to the bottom of this, but my hardware has definitely been affected by this crash.

This is possible, but I've got a good case with a good air flow and low component temps (my CPU or GPU never exceed 65C - i have speedfan constantly running and logging my temps). The overclock doesn't touch the voltage, just increases the FSB and RAM (though I will double check tonight). But like I said I've had my system stably overclocked for 2 years and never had a BSOD and I've played a lot demanding games at high settings (Crysis, Assassins Creed, COD4, Stalker COP, GTA4, Far Cry 2, L4D2, etc) as well as Fallout 3.

yeah more and more it keeps pointing to motherboard issues. at least from what i can see.

I highly doubt FNV in comparison to crysis or l4d2 or other games you listed would cause the cpu to get damaged as its not even close to as taxing as the others are. hell im surprised youve played gta$ and didnt get a bsod yet, thats a miracle in itself.

Please explain your reasoning.

well for one i wouldn't consider it a cpu issue since the game isnt demanding enough to cause it to overheat or put it through any form of stress, thats on teh cpu side.

it wouldnt be a gpu problem for the same reasonings, and since you've noted how it doesnt use much gpu usage and barely gets hot thats the same reasoning on that front.

iill admit im biased in this part since i dont like asus boards anymore since they always gave me problems with overclocking and mine always seemed to degrade after about a year of usage and always got a BSOD every month with the, so my reasoning on this could be due to my own experience with these boards..or perhaps im unlucky on that front

couldnt be a harddrive problem since it would be pretty obvious if it would. since hardrives effect on cpu overclocking is practically non existent.

the only 3 things im looking at now would be mobo, psu, and ram.



Did you have any performance hit right before the BSOD? like any fluctuation in performance at all fps wise stuttering etc before it happened, even if it was an hour or more before hand?

Do you think the psu coulda had soemthing to do with it? even though i highly doubt it sicne ive always trusted corsair psu's quite alot.

and you said the RAM was overclocked with the cpu ?

to test if its its the ram overclock the cpu manually by multiplier (if you can) up about 10% like you had it before...if it launches it could have been RAM was just taxed too much sicne oblivion does do some inefficient streaming and would perhaps stress out the RAM (highly unlikely though)

i overclock my cpu by multiplier because it doesnt touch the RAM speeds at all and sicne my ram arent really meant for overlclocking that much i dont bother, a small bump in ram speeds neevr really gave much benefit other than a boost of liek what...1 fps max

could simply be age, 10% OC will stress components somewhat, over a 2 year period that adds up. more so if you powerdown often. even something just going a little out of spec (like caps) can screw up an over clock. couldn't hurt to run memtest if you haven't already, monitor voltages over a period of time see how much they fluctuate (if at all) since you OC'd the system yourself you should already know the standard tests. few stress testing benchmarks might shed some more light on whatever might be causing the problem. could also cause something that's borderline to fail completely though

Makes sense. I'll look into it. Thanks for the advice.

Could be. Will be running some tests tonight. Lot's of fun.

Fallout New Vegas did not burn your system out.

Do not over clock. It reduces the life expectancy of system components. Especially when you have a dirty computer, improper heat sinking, ventilation, or hot weather. Proper heat sinks, fans, etc.... only delay the effect.

10 percent OC is alot. You are pushing electrical componets past their rated values.

Even factory OC's can cause issues, shorten life spans.

Obviously you're taking a risk by overclocking, but you actually seem to be suggesting that we should all be underclocking our systems to be on the safe side. I've been overclocking systems for years and this is my first real problem. 10% is small potatoes with the right cooling solutions (and me being conservative) and there are plenty of people who go well beyond this without issue.

You maybe right about Fallout not burning my system out, but you don't know that for sure. There are a lot of variables when it comes to computing and FNV is full of bugs and has issues with many hardware configs.

But thanks for the useful advice.

Maybe a broken/damaged CPU caused the crash of the game not vice versa...

[censored], I have a Q6600 running @ 3.8 on a H50 and a I7 930 @ 4.6 on a H70, and a X2 4400 @3.3 and my Q6600 is 2 years old without problems and my x2 4400 is 5 years old without issues, sounds to me like you just don't know how to properly OC.

Not really. You know how memory and CPU's are graded? By the % of failure on the line, followed by stress testing of the batch. Unless there's a batch of chips at a lower speed which are in higher demand, in which case they'll core lock and remarket a higher speed to lower. Intel did this a lot in the late 90's with the celerons. I easily got one of mine upto 1000mhz, with air cooling, those chips were locked and undeclocked to fill a market, and I had an earlier version that I upped from 333 to 666.

Anyway, whether or not you you believe overclocking for a long period means things will be stable long term, goes against the laws of physics. Higher speeds mean more electron degradation across pathways, higher chances of interconnects in the die failing, and a higher chance of internal 'tinning'. The more stress you put on a component out of spec, the higher chance it will fail.

I've had OC'd machines in the past work fine one day, and start giving me random crashes the next. It just boils down to component failure, and speeding up how fast something can fail.

Every AMD system I have had has been a royal pile of crap. Either the boards die, or the CPU's.... If they work they require special freaking processor drivers, or tweaks, or way more effort then any Intel system I have owned to make them work properly.

On Die memory controller + High Performance memory almost always means early failure.

Run memtest86 on your system, that Corsair Domi. memory tends to svck badly. Remove all but one stick and see if your problem goes away.

edit: removed intel devoted fan AMD bashing. ;o)

The oc on your 1066 memory is (more then likely) overheating the Northbridge on your motherboard. I had a similar problem with a 9950z,asus crosshair II mobo and 1066 memory and found it best that with 4 gigs of ram installed to run them at 800. I was able to get my 9950z up to 3.1 on a stock cooler. From what I understand, 1066 memory is very stressful on the AM2/AM2+ motherboards.

gg

You do realize the "northbridge" has no memory controller on modern AMD systems... That's all handled by the CPU. The problem isn't even the speed, it's the voltage, most of the time the memory he is running requires 2.1+v to even run stable. The Processor is designed for 1.8v memory.

The game didn't damage your CPU, you did. Running something out of spec has it's consequences.

or the Hyper Tranport link right? which connects the cpu to the mobo. Yes I understand that amds don't have a actual northbridge (somewhat), none the less, my experience with asus mobos (I've owned 3) and 1066 memory suggests the that the mobo is already pushing it's limits with the memory running @ 1066.

and to the OP ....

60 degress on the core is too hot, as the cpu will shut down at 61. The 9950 sweet spot is 55 on the core under load.

Don't wanna mess up the party. But in fact, booth Bethesda developed Fallout games have or had a tendency to cause BSODs. It's not necessarily related to overclocking. The system I'm using right now is the same I've freshly bought when FO3 saw it's release. Athlon 64 bit XP2 6000+ with 3.5 GIGs Ram and a Nvidia 9600 GT. At first I wasn't able to play FO3 back in 2009 when I've buyed it, because it continously crashed and caused about 3-4 BSODs. I finally abandoned FO3, cause I was afraid all the BSODs damage my system. I returned to playing FO3 just about 8 weeks ago and didn't had a single crash or BSOD since then. I figured out the BSODs where related to either my Line6 toneport, a corrupt IRQ setting, or a corrupted audio codec file. FO3 was fully patched and I got all DLCs, but I wasn't able to play it once without crashing.

Before you start with the ordinary "really devoted fan" talking about defending FO3, I'd like to mention that I've run more then 100 games on my PC without a single problem. Mass Effect, Dead Space, COD4 1+2, ARMA 2, Crysis, Dragon Age and Left4Dead 1+2 just to mention some...and they're all newest software which use high-very high specs. Funny thing is, I also run New Vegas smooth as silk. I get the bug when I try to leave the game, which is present since the days of Oblivion and sometimes have some stuttering, which smoothed out since I've used the Mouse acceleration fix. I also hjave problems with black and yellow "Suns" showing up sometimes, but never experienced a crash.

The only bad experience with New Vegas was a BSOD at my first playthrough, but now I'm ingame about 50 hours+ and didn't experienced it again (knocks on wood). I think it's again related to my sound device and I doubt that patches will fix this problem, because Line6 toneport is hardware you normally use for making music.

I think that the problem with relying on speedfan software to control the fans is if you have something that lock up the cpu or for example crashes in a loop or something and takes up 100% of the cycles, like some copy protections for example during the disc check, will cause the cpu to become hot and speedfan doesn't up the fanspeed due to the protection blocking anything else from running while its doing its check, so it could very well happen with something else.

Thanks to the guys who responded with constructive advice.

Problem seems to be my memory speed. System is now stable running at 800Mhz instead of 1066Mhz - I ran the mem86 test and prime95 for well over an hour with no issues.

I even played FNV for an hour last night. Guess it probably was my system rather than the other way round.

I don't use speedfan to control my fans, only to monitor my temps. All my fans, including for the CPU are controlled manually.