You want the option to be the villain? Go play something else. The Elder Scrolls is about destiny.

Though I must admit, I would really love to see a game franchise come out where you ARE the villain. That'd be a nice change of pace.

You mean I wasn't being a bad guy when I slaughtered towns, stole from everyone and hoarded my loot in a twisted tower on the desolate mountain side?

I like my RPGs to let me play the role I want to play. If I want to be a fire breathing, time stopping, mass murdering bad guy on a black horse killing people with my big mace and thus being the bad guy, I should be able to. I could save the world if I wanted, but thats only because that damn dragon is messing with my world and no one messes with the world I want to take over. I would love to work on the bad side then betray Alduin and rule the world with a flaming iron fist.

The Warp In The West does not count as a band-aid.

I really felt sorry for Nerevar to have been betrayed by both Dagoth and the Tribunal, thus I felt that destroying all of them was rewarding. Siding with Dagoth Ur against the Tribunal would have been a nice touch (As always, in a mod).

I didn't think other people did this...

If you want to be a bad guy, go join the DB. However, the devs seem to be talking more about choice, so maybe. The sound producer was recording something about Esberns death. I don't remember the details, but yeah.

Now, who said the Dragons were the Evil ones. Apparently the guy thats going to eat the world is Akatosh and he is the patron god of the nine divines.

you see this is what i dont understand about the scrolls, it is wtiks so it will be? then why does everyone panic and flee because the end is nigh, they should know if it is written then they should know that the dragon will fail, and what if you die? in a dungeon? then i guess the elder scroll was a false prophecy?

EDIT: i mean just cause it is written, doesnt mean it will come to pass. if you just decided out of the blue, to turn against the people, right as the dragon is attacking and start slaughtering people the people will abandon you and you are just as bad as the dragon, and i doubt that although it is written it will not undue what you have done

Not all is as it seems.

That is what the multiple aspects and storytellings of the tamrielic gods teaches you. He is Akatosh, Tall Papa, Auri-El, and Alduin. Lokhan is Shezzzar, Shor, and Sep. All tell similar, yet very different stories of the same gods. None give the whole story on their own.

I swear, sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who has no problem completely skipping the main quest. In other news, I just reached the rank of Eliminator in the Dark Brotherhood, with 6 victims drinking malice and death from my hand.

I understand that taking the role of an antagonist in the Main Quest is a little difficult to work into the lore, but how about some more moral grey options than the utmost chivalry that is often accompanied by the quest line? Furthermore, I liked the OP's suggestion of joining Necromancer/Bandit groups. Why stop at the Dark Brotherhood?

Because in reality there is no such thing as a bad guy, it'sjust a matter of perspective. ENding the world wouldn't be "evil" it would simply be stupid because that includes you. In morrowind pretty much all of the great houses would be percieved as "evil" by the other houses, and rightly so. I'm just hoping for certain factions to be more ruthless than others

There's no point in playing the bad guy, they never win. You'll eventually get killed by some peasant hero who rose from nothing to save the World. And you know it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBExQZ6HlJg

I can usually never stick with an evil character. I just end up feeling terrible. You could do some pretty wicked things in Oblivion. You could kill nearly everyone, join a guild of assassins and murder people for sums of gold, steal from people, etc.

I guess it would be fun to have a bit more evil things to do but I think most people want to be the hero so the developers focus on that.

I completely agree with the OP.

Lots of games with a considerable lore, sequels, novelizations, graphic novels, etc., have canon endings that are significantly different from whichever path the PC chooses in a particular playthrough.

I hope Skyrim will give players an opportunity to make difficult choices and experience different endings. The canon ending can be whatever the devs want it to be.

Above all, I'm hoping that the choice of which of the two main factions engaged in the civil war to support is a very difficult decision (i.e., neither side is particularly "good," and whichever side you choose you lose significant opportunity for artifacts and additional quests from the other side.)

Ooookay?
They can't just allow a bunch of alternate paths and then go "This is canon" by TESVI?
Part of roleplaying is to allow the player choices, linearity doesn't make an RPG game better or even good, it makes it bad.
So just allow a bunch of ways to complete quests, evil, good, neutral, whatever.
Then after the game has been out a year or so write an in depth lore document explaining what choices were canon in order to define the lore.
That works right?

Well, if you want to rule the world with you fully evil character, go to play another game. You don't have to be able to do that. It's Bethesda's game. If I want to be able, for example, to ride a unicorn in Dragon Age, should the developers do it possible? I don't think so...

Anyway, the point is that in TES franchise exist some continuity... after playing Morrowind, when I play Oblivion, I can think that the Nerevarine was actually my character, and that's a very nice thing. Of course, they can use another Dragon Break, but... it's not convenient to abuse of such element. Even more when a dragon is trying to devour the world... what possible endings do you suggest? It would be strange (and implausible) to finish the world and at the same time save it...

I'm still not sure why people seem think that being the villain would necessarily mean destroying the world. Obviously, you won't be able to side with Alduin, his world destruction is basically a solo affair. But there's no reason why you can't be a villain with an evil plan that isn't "Help Alduin destroy the world." And, if so, you'll end up fighting Alduin because the world is where you keep all your stuff.

I honestly hope it isn't as B&W as that, and each 'side' of the conflict has a compelling reason for its actions. Joining up with Alduin, the world-eater, would I'm sure seem pretty evil, but from a universalist standpoint, not-so-much...

Fallout also has defined lore, though, and that doesn't stop it from giving players options. It's just that sometimes, later games need to declare one possible option as canon and have the setting progress as though the player did that.

And as Arilias has said, becomming a villain doesn't mean you have to destroy the world. There are lots of other ways you can establish that you're not a hero besides trying to destroy the world, like say, trying to take over the world, or killing people for profit, or drunk driving. And just because you're not a nice person doesn't mean you have to side with Alduin, since presumably, the world getting destroyed would still be bad for your evil character, so even if you're not exactly a hero, you still have a reason to oppose Alduin, or at least not want to help him.

I certainly don't expect to be given the choice of siding with Alduin. But I'd like to have more options for evil characters in Skyrim, because in Oblivion, only the Dark Brotherhood really fits, since Bethesda went with a Robin Hood type approach to the Thieves Guild. If nothing else, I'd like some quests to have less noble solutions, that shouldn't be too hard to do, at least. Maybe let us join a few less reputable factions too, and not just the Dark Brotherhood. To use Oblivion as am example, why couldn't I join the Blackwood Company instead of the Fighters Guild?



Um, no, trying to destroy the world is evil, you'll need a pretty strong justification to make it otherwise, you're killing every single living creature in the world, that's genocide on a scale never before seen in real world history, if you don't consider that evil, then I DEFINATELY don't ever want to meet you in real life.

If your fedup with your race why not ? Who wouldn t like to see the world change, Napoleon, Lenin, Mao Tse tung, Cathare heretic, Jesus Christ, Budda, the psyco Che guevara, and so much on, how many millions throughout history have fallen for it ?

If someone is pissed at the world the way it is and someone tell him "Eat nirn" is just a methafor for a more peacefull and just world, why he wouldn t fall for it if he s life till now is crap (Slave).
In STALKER, you can side the "evil" side and the world does not end.
Why couldn t we side the bad side, maybe some others hero would come to try to save the world.]

What if you side the "bad" side, your character become a powerfull bad guy bodyguard and you are given the option to put up with him in your next heroic uncorruptible incarnation ?

And going in rampage mode is quite childish and dull, you already know you can kick everyone ass anyway..Since ai ain t smart enought to put up with an army against you.

But the intersting is not just go to the end and say: I want to have your baby to the great guy.

Evil has rank and purpose and its usually less idiotic than what games care for. How much corrupts MTHFKERS rules in our planet openly or hidden ? How many politician you can point and say : this guy is honest and truth to his duty and people ?

It would be awesome that the "dark side" , assuming the dragon are threated stupidly straighforward as any mediocre RPG, try to corrupt us, that we would offer our services to them as an "evil lover " or "dragon lover" or as a MERC !!!
Kitiara Anyone ? Dragonlane ? Is the thin golden skinned,l white haired mage truly evil ? And what is the nature of his corruption ?
What if the Dragons promise you that if you help them in a worthwhile way (you are able to reach a very high rank) they would teach you how to become a Dragon ?!!!! What if, if YOU REALLY BECOME A DRAGON!!!!
With so much dragons lovers in this comunity it would be a great Siren call.
Anyway it may be very well that continuing this world is an ODE to corruption and evilness, who can see behing the veil ?

So yes !! why can t i be evil, or better, join what seem the evil faction in this game, at least for some time ? And what if it end being the good side ?

Why can t it be true for the sake of the change ? Isnt TODD braggling about big changes, impressive settings and the will to do something big and new in his interview ?
Here s a chance for him to proove he not boasting as ever, and to proove TES has not become a tiny shriveled (as todd balls)world following mainstrean catter all, dumb RPG.
Or could i say followed the dark path and totally corrupted itself for the sake of easy money ?

You guys realize that Alduin is going to literally eat the world don't you. Consume it utterly, right. All you need to do to help is to stay home doing nothing. ( I don't think the devs have actually coded this into the game, but this is the idea. )

I imagine things will be more like Oblivion, though. If you don't start the main quest then the only thing that happens in the game is the emperor dying. (but you will need to stay away from certain places like Kvatch)

And isnt that lame and tiny, same crap again ? OMFG the world will end and nothing happens ?
The dragon burns here and there and thats it....
As a slave, even if recently freed, why would i meedle in this mess, and how i a slave would know its the end of the world ? If i am a thief, and there s caos ? Great this will give me plenty of oppportunitis to get rich and screw those false lores anyway this is for stupid zealots.

Anyway If alduin will eat the world, how would the dragon survive ?
If they can survive and you re a freaking looser(slave/prisoner for life)/whatever) in this world and a dragon come and say:
Serve us and if you proove one of the worthyest we well teach you how to be like one of us (a dragon) and you will survive to life free and powerfull in the next world ? Aint there lore of ones becoming dragons ?

"WTF have i to loose ? hell YES would think the slave !!!" Screw this world!!
Evil what ? Evil are the ones that keep me as a slave ! Death to them!!!!
I want to join you Dragon, command me to GLORY!!!!

you can play an evil character, its called ROLEPLAYING... just kill people.

bethesda cant include a way to end the world for us because the main quests and everything become part of the lore... the only reason daggerfall had multiple endings was to cause the "warp in the west" which was likely part of the prophecy for alduin...

actually, each of the main games' main quests was a step towards the end of the world, so technically, EVERYONE helped destroy the world... take pleasure in knowing that you are an evil, evil man who was deluded into thinking you were helping people.

Everything we know about Alduin, and religion in general in the TES universe, suggests that the only reason he's destroying the world is because it's the world's time to end. Alduin is anologous to the Hindu god Shiva - like Shiva, he's a manifestation of the supreme god, in his aspect as destroyer of the world, who will be succeeded by a new manifestation of the supreme god in his aspect as creator of the next world. He's not a villain so much as he is a natural force. It has no malice, it simply is. The goal of the game is to defeat Alduin, thus preventing the entirely natural end of the world. This is an entirely plausible goal for anyone who's not suicidal.

Alduin also wouldn't be interested in recruiting mortal servants to help bring about the end of the world. It's his job. How are mortals going to help?