I spend most of my time discussing Fallout on Reddit, but I thought I'd come here to see what you guys thought about a post someone made there.

I think the reason people are getting so butthurt over the graphics is because it's indicitive of the level of effort Bethesda is putting in to their games. I wonder if they're putting max effort in to their games, or if they're half-assing it knowing people will buy it anyway. People say graphics don't matter, it's about gameplay, but the poor visuals make me think that if they're half-assing it in that area that they might be half assing it in other areas as well.

Sure we haven't played the game yet so it might be great. I'm just giving an explenation as to why the visuals have people worried.

Anyway here's the post I was reffering to:

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/3rc6cu/fallout_4_pc_ultra_settings_screenshots_leaked/cwmw410

"If you compare this to N64 games or Fallout 3 (2008), it looks great.

But if you compare to today standards, it looks very dated. Here are some modern open world games with huge worlds and massive amounts of content:

Witcher 3

http://i.imgur.com/bNM1yfq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/KqK8kPV.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/sAbAtWZ.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/5oM0eYh.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/S7rZe5B.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/sONA2Iz.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/1Btcmvf.jpg

GTA V

http://i.imgur.com/c7Szoai.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/baaBdlI.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/FodeOpz.jpg

Hell even Dying Light arguably looks better, https://i.imgur.com/PEC3IOU.jpg and that's not even particularly noted for its graphics. (edit: credit to https://www.reddit.com/u/ipurangi_wahangu for the in-game screenshot)

If you are a really devoted fan of Falllout 4, before you knee jerk downvote this and start insulting me for daring to question the all perfect Bethesda, please realize I'm not saying Fallout 4 is a bad game or that this means its gameplay or story or depth of characters will be bad. I'm simply saying the graphics look dated, and don't meet standards for a AAA game release when its nearing 2016. The things we expect like high quality textures, ambient occlusion, high quality tessalation, soft shadows...etc are simply missing. Its still using an updated version of the Skyrim Creation Engine for Christs sake! Its downright lazy from Bethesda.

On the other hand we just saw CD Project Red drastically raising the bar with Witcher 3 for all open world games with quests, showing that you can have incredibly deep storytelling and rewarding gameplay in massive lore-rich worlds with amazing graphical fidelity. That old excuse that Bethesda fans used to give that you can't have both a huge complex world full of content and great visuals has been demonstrated thoroughly false. CDPR has put out its dike on the table and now everyone else has to compare theirs to it. Unfortunate for Bethesda, their http://i.imgur.com/2ESRIML.jpg isn't measuring up to that http://i.imgur.com/Oj76GBb.jpg

And lets not even get into the http://imgur.com/sf5Ebrd that we saw in those videos, or the terrible facial animations that look straight out of 2008. They way the characters moved in those videos and the way their cloth stayed stiff as a board looked http://gfycat.com/BlushingWarmEelelephant"

Btw people please stop comparing FO4 graphics to Skyrim and FO3, of course they look better. FO3 is almost 8 years old and Skyrim is 4 years old.

No matter what they do there will always be that crowd that feels they should have done more.

The thing about the IC in Oblivion is that it was divided in districts, each of them in their own cell which means the game doesn't have to load everything. This engine doesn't do highly crowded big areas very well.

PS: wasn't Vivec in Morrowind technically bigger?

First of all, you made a big mistake in mentioning TW3 because in these forums that is like a dirty word. As for Beth putting or not putting enough effort, I think they have. The thing that worries me more is their "direction".

I think the graphics look phenomenal.

Compared to Skyrim and Fallout 3? Leaps and bounds.

And dear god the Witcher 3 comparisons...It's not like Beth went "Look at this, we need to be this", no they did their own thing.

This.

We can never please everyone.. Someone will ALWAYS find fault.

If they stick to their vision, they are true to themselves..

THAT is what I care about.

-edit-

I bought The Witcher.. I did NOT like it.

Uhh, yeah, because Fallout 3 is almost 8 years old and Skyrim is 4 years old. Clearing that ankle high bar is no big feat.

The snuggie. That will be your answer (although it's not the best anology; it's simply the first one that came to mind).

From what I've seen, attention to detail has been superb. Now, by attention to detail, I mean actual design, not aesthetics - which is why I mentioned the snuggie. The snuggie is not a very attractive..."garment". It's incredibly simple in design. However, people love it because it does exactly what they need it to do.

Bethesda chose to focus on designing and placing - everything - but that doesn't necessarily mean that each individual texture is jaw dropping. It's the sum of all parts that they're after. That doesn't mean they skimped on effort. It just means that they've made a specific design choice.

Same thing goes for the repair system being gone and the dialogue wheel. Those things don't indicate a lack of trying of BGS's part. After all, we're getting a voiced protagonist for the first time in the series and the mod system on weapons is absolutely nuts. It does indicated though that a specific design choice was made and that some people may disagree with that.

This should end well. I think the graphics look fine. Though I have to admit I am more about solid game play then what the product actually looks like. To get a real opinion, I will have to sit down with then game an actually PLAY it. Just sayen.

If they put all the effort that their awful marketing clearly lacked into bug testing, I can forgive them for leaving us high and dry for the better part of 5 months. If they spent their time doing a conga line and singing, "we're gonna take their money, we're gonna take their money!", I will never forgive, and I will never forget.

Yeah and what's your point? When did Witcher 3 become this standard of quality?

Fallout 4 looks amazing, in my opinion.

How can you honestly judge the game on effort when it isn't even out yet? Naysayers pick anything and everything apart like it was a matter of life and death without having any first hand knowledge of the actual game. Come back November 18th and ask the same question.

They don't even have shadows in the console version.

I think anyone who spends time accusing Bethesda's developers of laziness, before they have actually played the game in question

deserves to have some sarcastic response shoved where the sun doesn't shine.

I liked TW3. Novigrad does indeed have a vibe.

Though many TW3 'fans' spent many weeks pre-launch of that game complaining how the grass and the brick walls didn't look HD enough.

Fallout 4 isn't out yet,

grumbling about how 'lazy' Bethesda developers are is premature at best and offensively ignorant at worst.

But hey, this is the internet,

under the cloak of anonymity it's ok to tell the world that something svcks without concern, I suppose.

Ok lets be civil, i really dont want and go and compare the game with the Witcher 3 bc, rigth now both games are 1000 miles away from each other, while normaly on Bethesda game u can enter in everysingle home u find on a city, on the Witcher that isnt true like i find out while i was moving trow novigrad. Both game have strong points. But at the same time both game lies. Novigrad or Velen feel huge but 1 they are made to look huge they are super hard to move trow and that make u feel lost, and they have alot of building that are just there to look nice.

On the other hand for what i got to see, Graphics of Fallout are superb when it come down to details, like u can see Codsworth eye move now, lighting is super nice, textures look nice too.

THIS ISNT TO BE ELITIST. Yeah i spect the game look 10 time better on PC, the Witcher 3 did it too. But i will admit the game maybe isnt as optimized on the graphics part on Console nothing that patchs wont fix. REMEMBER ppl complain about the shadows and maybe that is a bug, remember that all those ppl are playing the game 2 week early of release and we normally get day 1 patch.

I been on Reddit, i tent to not go there bc most of the ppl there complain about every single game.

Wow, Novigrad is really well done. I'm impressed! Not that I would want a settlement of that size in Fallout.

Go visit their offices. Watch them creating.

Then come talk to me about "lazy."

Seriously? People actually let Novigrad suspend their disbelief? Don't get me wrong it is a pretty city in terms of architecture and design but it in no way gives the proper illusion of a bustling city if you stop to smell the roses.

Witcher 3 is a great story driven game but from a design standpoint it is a GTA clone with maybe half of the gameplay features of a Bethesda title. Hats off to those developers but the case argument for graphics comparisons is foolish. Should Bethesda better themselves and try for better visuals? Absolutely. I'd argue they should not if it obviously breaks the bank, or the more likely scenario is that opting for the best visuals ever would cost us what makes Bethesda games great.

From the screenshots released today I can't see why people think this game doesn't look good graphically. IMO it blows away almost all competition.
And static worlds really shouldn't be compared to fallout. Than again, people are just complaining because they can, and it wouldn't be a Bethesda title if people weren't for the most stupid of reasons.

Good thread, but the big Polish sausage makes it epic

If you'd have told me last year that people would even bring up graphics comparisons in a Fallout game I'd have laughed. Fallout 3/NV and even Skyrim weren't ahead of their time or particularly remarkable. I don't know why people thought it would best TW3. I haven't played TW3 but is there as much to do? And aren't most object static? I'd figure it'd be easier to make a pretty game if you didn't have to make all the individual parts as separate movable pieces. Having watch the numerous leaked gameplay videos I have no complaints personally. It is clearly better than 3/Skyrim. They furthered their game and engine. I'd never expect or want Beth to pit Fallout in a graphics competition if it meant that they'd spend less time on the new features that 4 has.

Graphics are synonymous with effort now?

And of course F3 looks dated, compared to current games. That's because it [censored] is dated.
How can one say "F3 looks good compared to N64 games" and at the same time not comprehend how a game on 7th gen systems are going to look more dated than 8th Gen games? ???

"Wow, Novigrad is really well done. I'm impressed! Not that I would want a settlement of that size in Fallout."

Why not? If they had cities like that in the middle ages they could have cities like that in the post-apocolypse.

Why not? The streets are crawling with peasants, drunks, prosttutes, street entertainers, guards, knights, shady characters etc. You hear traders announcing their wares, the music from the taverns, it feels like the entire city is alive.

Game is not even out yet. How can anyone comment on the amount of effort that went into making a game. If it has solid gameplay and runs smooth I could care less if it is not graphically the most appealing game on the market. The graphics as they are now look fine to me.