On these forums there are a lot of fears that Skyrim will require Steam, and a lot of these fears are based on some very strange misconceptions. Although I agree that a single player game that wasn't made by Valve should never be a Steam exclusive, having Skyrim require Steam wouldn't be the end of the world.

First off, these fears are based off the fact that NV required Steam and it is therefore a sign that Skyrim will too. That is a wrong assumption to make, or at least it is an over reaction. Why because NV was made by Obsidian, not Bethesda. Putting NV solely on Steam was, I believe, THEIR move to make, not Bethesda's. The reason I think this is due to the fact that Bethesda said that they had as little involvement in NV as they possibly could, because it was interfering with the development of Skyrim. There is no official evidence to support this claim, but if you look at the behavior of both Obsidian and Bethesda, you'll see that putting NV on Steam was much more likely originally thought of by someone on Obsidian. Although Bethesda most certainly had to approve of the idea because they where producing the game, and putting the game just on Steam would influence sales in some way, for better or for worse. So this means that Bethesda thinks that Steam is a good and trustworthy company, but that doesn't mean in the slightest that Bethesda themselves are considering using Steam for their own games. Bethesda is a very independent company, they do just about everything themselves, and if they aren't doing it themselves there watching over it like a hawk. I think Obsidian used Steam because they are a relatively weak gaming company, and they couldn't have handled the job themselves so they got Steam. Bethesda doesn't need help like that, besides TES are their child, and I don't think they would entrust their child to another company, even if they think it's a good company that can get the job done.

All that being said I'm going to start going through the misconceptions I've seen on these forums.

Misconception #1: Skyrim WILL come out as a Steam only game. That is most likely not true, in fact I'd say the odds are quite slim. (see above for reasons.) That being said there is a chance, all be it a small one.

#2: You have to have an internet connection to play Steam games. Wrong. You only need an internet connection when using Steam to download Steam form www.steampowered.com. (A process that takes less then five minutes), download direct to drive games, active CD keys, update games, and play multilayer. Otherwise you can put it on offline mode and play just fine.

#3: It's impossible to put Steam into Offline mode, and if you do succeed eventually it will switch back to online mode while your playing. Wrong. Switching to Offline mode is very easy. If your already in online mode you simply click the button in the upper left hand conner that says Steam, and you then scroll down and click Offline mode. A common problem with Steam before was that if you started the computer without an internet connection it was very hard to get it to go into offline mode. That has been fixed, now whenever it can't connect to the internet it will ask you if you want to try again or go in offline mode. Once you are in offline mode it will not switch to online mode until you tell it too. That's a fact.

#4: Steam automatically updates your games, whether you like it or not, and theres nothing you can do about it. Wrong. Games start at the default "Always keep this game up to date." option, but you can change this at any time by right-clicking on the game in the library then clicking properties. A tab that says Updates should be visible. You click that to change the update stats. Once you tell a game to not update it will stay in that mode forever, unless you reinstall it or change it.

#5: You can't use mods with Steam. Wrong. Mods work perfectly with Steam. You just have to keep in mind that Steam saves it's game differently then normal. You just have to follow the path C:/programfiles/steam/steammaps/common/skyrim/data/. If you follow that you'll find the right spot to put your mods.

That's it for now. I may add more misconceptions later.

This topic is less about whether or not Skyrim will require Steam, and more about how Steam works, so you guys know what to expect if it does.

(sorry for any grammar errors, I wrote to much to go ever throughly)

Misconception #6. Steam works great for everyone and everyone on the entire planet has internet and therefore there is no reason to have a non-Steam version of games.

Just saying...

I don't have any of those misconceptions, I use Steam and like it for the things it does, and I utterly hated the fact that Fallout:New Vegas was stuck on it. And worry that Skyrim will as well.

So, not very useful. Sorry.


edit: and, yeah... you posted the same thread yesterday, and it was locked. Re-posting locked threads is generally considered a bad move.

Since this is more about Steam and not Skyrim, I am moving it to CD.

How much download/upload is required by using steam to play a game offline?

0, I'm almost positive. I went to a convention where they didn't have any internet connection and we played CS:S and L4D locally. I just had to set my Steam to offline mode before I left my house.

You first have to download Steam itself. The first time you ever play a game you need an internet connection to verify your game. You also need a connection if you want to patch it, or redownload it if you bought it off Steam, and of course you need it to play online multiplayer. Besides all that you don't need an internet connection at all.

I had a couple of hours last week where my internet was down for line repairs - I went to the Steam off line mode and happily played some Fallout NV.

Granted it is difficult if someone does not have internet - but there are ways round it as http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1176205-gfwl-or-steam/page__view__findpost__p__17427076 in another thread.

Nowadays, you need an internet connection for most games to activate them.
There is no difference to Steam.

Maybe there is something to add:
For some games you HAVE to be in online mode to play, but those games are designed to always be online, even if it's an offline game, e.g. Spore.

False.

Steam will, without exceptions, ask for a log-in at a certain date after going into offline mode. At that point, clicking "Offline Mode" will return an error saying "Steam could not connect to the server".

To recreate this, start Steam, select offline mode, unplug your modem and keep it unplugged for at least 7 days. I guarantee your legitimate copy of a single player game will at a point ask for a login to Steam. 110% guaranteed. I know this, I live with this [censored] travesty all the time, as my financial situation is insecure and I often can not pay my internet bills.

No, it was solely Bethesda's decision. Bethesda was the game publisher and decided how the game would be published. Obsidian was the developer and decided how to develop the game.

The same thing happened with the PC game Bethesda published before that too, Rogue Warrior, which was also a game that required Steam and had nothing to do with Obsidian.

And the same thing gonna happen with the PC version of Brink that Bethesda will publish soon, which will also require Steam.

Well then it looks like Skyrim will most likly require Steam after all. Even more reason for people with misconceptions of Steam to read this.

As far as #5, it's an inaccurate blanket statement to say "mods work perfectly" with Steam. It varies with the game, and how it handles mods. Some just need you to change the file path, but others may need an additional patch to be compatible with Steam, a patch that may or may not ever come into existence. The Oblivion Script Extender, for example, didn't work with Steam for a long time, if I remember correctly. I'm using a mod with a Steam game, and the only options are not use the incompatible "official" version, or use a 3rd-party compatibility patch that introduces new bugs. I don't have a ton of Steam games OR a ton of modded games, but it wouldn't surprise me if some just don't work.

If you can't get Steam to work for you at all there is something wrong with YOU, not Steam. Steam does have some flaws, just like every system, but it does work. With the exception of having your account stooling or forgetting your password, there is nothing that can get in the way of you using it.

There are some games that are difficult to mod with Steam, they tend to be older games form what I've seen. That won't effect Skyrim at all though, because having the option to mod is very important to Bethesda. If they release Skyrim as a Steam only game they will make sure mods work for it. They might even make a program for it.

I have a philosophical objection to requiring repeated internet access for a game that is completely offline, single player, and can be bought from an offline store and installed from a disk. It's absurd.

Also, I dislike not having control over patching (i.e, I like to have the individual patch files, so that I can install a game and patch it to the level that I need. Not some autopatcher that gives me the option of "no patches" or "all patches".)

It's overkill for DRM, too. Disk check is more than enough.

The only realistic reason that I've seen given for requiring Steam is that they want to guarantee that there's no used game market (since the game gets tied to your account).

Edit: and, as I've said, I use Steam and like it - for what it does well. But it's not the be-all, end-all answer to everything.

In that case it is almost a certainty that Skyrim will use Steam too.

at all =/= great

Try again.

Some people do not like it because it does not work for them. That is a fact.

OBSE took a couple of weeks at most, I believe? Hardly a long time.

Most steam games - the ones that don't use steamworks - absolutely *are* just as easy to mod. The vast majority are just the regular disc content, with the only verification being steamside. For example, I have my copy of Deus Ex with the executable replaced with Deus Exe, and steam doesn't give a damn. It would if I explicitly told it to check integrity, but that's intended behavior. The only times that changes is when steam is integrated directly into the executable - and even then, it only matters if you're messing with the executable, which the vast majority of mods will never do. OBSE is a special case, and one Steam were all too happy to help make work.

Last year I went to a summerhouse and stayed there for 10 days without an internet connection. During that time I played Plants vs Zombies every single day and I never had any trouble from Steam.

I've never had any trouble with offline mode, but I can't speak for everyone and there are always some people who run into weird errors. :shrug:

I wasn't trying to shoot down Steam or anything; just saying that it's inaccurate to say that modding works perfectly. Many games I've looked up mods for will have an alternate Steam version, and the simple fact that you'd need one is proof enough that it's not "perfect". Support isn't around forever for games OR mods, and it's reasonable to think that some games whose mods don't work with Steam will never get that alternate version made. I nitpick about specifics, is all.

Steam only bothers me when people can't install their game when they physically have it in their hands. That's a pretty big flaw.
For example, people on the east coast were unable to install NV at 12:00 am since it wasn't the release date yet on the west coast.

I totally agree that there no reason to have an all single player game on Steam. It doesn't make much sense. All I'm trying to do is show people that if Skyrim, or any other game for that matter, requires Steam it won't be the end of the world. What you said about the auto patch system makes sense. They should have an option to manually install a patch, so you know what your installing.

#4 may not be quite correct, Steam does force Initial patching (at least in New Vegas it seems)
Source: posts #11 on, in http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1173435-nevermind-the-game-it-wont-even-install/

#3 I've experienced the insistence on going online from steam before. I'm not sure what causes it. I don't have the issue anymore because I'm on broadband, but while I was on dial up, every now and then, steam games would suddenly not work in offline mode anymore so I'd have to log-in, at which point it would find updates and download them.

#4 Upon first install, Steam will autopatch whether you like it or not. If there's a certain version you want, too bad.

Misconception #7

Steam will provide a way to unlock all your games if they go under. Valve has no obligation to anyone to provide any assistance should Steam cease to function. They also have no obligation to host the installers for any games you don't happen to have installed at the time.