NPC pathfinding has always been rather crappy lets face it... Morrowind was ridiculously bad (one of the primary complaints received by that game) and oblivion wasn't much better although NPCs didn't get stuck as often. I'd really love some 3 dimensional pathfinding that included climbing and jumping but I think thats probably not going to happen. Instead I think an easy solution is to have NPCs flee when they realize they cannot find a path to you.

Enemies has the ability to jump after you. yes you might find a place they can not reach an npc will run away, or he get his friend the mage or archer. An animal might run away if hurt.

Zombies, mad dogs and other unintelligent and very aggressive enemies will just stand there grasping while you shoot them. Again it's makes sense. And you have a way to kill zombies.

Your right!

I mean, I play on the PC and I use the console sometimes. But they did't even make to AI react to when I no-clip into a wall and heal or when I use TGM and just spam my attacks. They don''t even prevent me from using the Kill command on every enemy I meet.

What? Don't do it?! The Devs made it so why should't I use it?

[/sarcasm]

The devs don't need to work on something like that, it's a single player game the only one who might get offended of the abuse of jumping up that rock and filling them with my arrows and magic is me. Then I just don't do it. ^_^

Here's a thought, the ability to climb. If you have the acrobatics to do it, then you are rewarded in being able to do so, but monsters can still climb up to get you.

well nobodies just going to let themselves get killed... this isnt as easy as the dont fast travel thing. cuz there are benefits to that. this has no benefits for not "cheating". i mean if i have to to win i will do it if thats wut it takes. but i wuld rather limit the ability to do that just for the sake of making it more difficult and more realistic. alot more realistic if i cant do that everywhere. sometimes its okay but other thimes its not. if i jump off a cliff onto a ledge that is othewise unreachable..okay..i give u that...but if i hop onto an big awkwardly shaped rock and now u cant hit me... thats cheating...i dont wanan do it. but if i have to....

I think that might remove a lot of the temtation if you only can hit your enemy with AoE dmg spells. And those who want the exploit would still be able to do it.

First of all, don't kid yourselves, this is an exploit in enemy AI, this isn't "Being Smart", taking the High ground so the target must come at you from a direction you want (And perhaps laying traps in that area) is being smart. Exploiting enemy pathfinding AI so that you may attack a target without said target even reacting (Fleeing, taking cover, ect) is an exploit/cheating and just plain lazy.

It's a pretty simple fix, any time a pathfinding impossibility is discovered, the enemy AI can then Flee to an obstruction or even further, I also believe it's already been stated that this type of exploit will be addressed in various ways.

Its idiotic AI, and shouldnt just be ignored.

I wish more attention was paid to AI, but accept that its a difficult area for devs.

You can't run backwards any more, so you have to offer your back to the enemy, and hope your burst of sprinting doesn't tire you out before you get there, so if you actually reach the rock, good luck to you.

What's with all the negativity in this thread? Why are people purposefully opposing that the enemy AI become good enough to tactically retreat? This way, an "exploit" turns into a potential gameplay mechanic that works on less intelligent foes (like animals), but also doesn't make you able to kill everything.

Ignore this, ignore that, and eventually, you're just ignoring the combat as a whole, or the game as a whole. OP is not even making an unreasonable request (have enemies retreat when they can't hurt you), like fully growing and flowing beards that are so well-loved by people on the forums. In fact, he is making a request that betters the gameplay and even immersion (why would an enemy not retreat if they are very likely to be killed by you?).

Now that's a word I have been looking for, camping in Elder scrolls...
Well no thank you I will be in range for my enemies and will fight them back always...I will not hide or jump to some crazy places so I can kill 20 enemies without being scratched...

i cant believe theres someone actually against fixing this. if you can provide a single legitimate answer why fixing it would not make the game better then ill delete this thread.




so stupid that i wont even bother answering it

people in this thread have provided a bunch of ways to fix this, and some are really simple and could be implemented without much effort

Some people preffer to have that option.

How about a big frightening dragon flies to your secluded little spot and eats you?
Problem solved

Some people are clueless too.

That's your opinion, but that didn't make this a less legitimate reason to not 'fixing' it.

A much bigger problem was the AI that was too stupid to realize that it's basically defeated in such a situation and should instead find cover and wait for you to come down, or run away while they have the chance.

of course, i think its something that wouldnt need a lot of work but would definitely be an improvement

Running around the rooftops in Anvil comes to mind.

Give everything a ranged attack or spell of some sort to default to if the player is unpathable. Kinda like Assassins Creed guards being able to throw rocks.

TBH I think NPCs should abuse terrain though, like climbing onto rocks and roofs.

I hope that you can still do this... it gives acrobatics a reason to exist and allows more diversity in playing style. I don't think there's anything cheap about it... if I specialize in acrobatics, why shouldn't I be able to jump up where others can't and rain death from above??

I just hope that enemies can jump too. There should be some creatures with maxed acrobatics too, and smart enough to vet to you.

we have to use the environment to our advantage. that's not a flaw, it's people being smart.

I don't like the idea that games should warp common sense and reality only to cater to the idea of 'balancing the weapons'. The truth is getting on top of a rock and shooting others with arrows might be smart, so why change that fact? Why warp the game mechanics to disallow ingenuity? You shouldn't, that's the answer.

There is nothing that ought to be done except let the player learn how to fight intelligently or use the environment intelligently. No need to punish any game element for being exceptional.

EDIT Also calling this a problem is a perception of the mind. I see it as a value to be employed in the game.

Its more about removing the fact that it breaks the immersion a lot. Seeing an enemy stand there taking a beating or worse running towards a rock without moving trying to reach you.

it is a flaw, because its an advantage only because of the crappy AI. There should be ways of exploiting the environment, like drawing a bunch of enemies to a narrow corridor so thay cant surround you . . . this isnt exploiting the environment, this is exploiting a crappy AI



i have to lol at your post, you dont want to warp common sense and reality so you want to leave enemies dumb as a rock? you want them to bump their head into wall over and over again trying to reach you and constantly failing, because that feels real?

and please stop what that fighting intelligently thing, theres nothing intelligent about outsmarting a really crappy AI