cloth physics= very important

Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:18 pm

I'm fine if there isn't any, but hey, there should totally be some for Capes! A cape would look so weird without any Cloth Physics, i'm sorry but it just would look terrible.
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Mistress trades Melissa
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:05 am

Consoles are holding us back because many developers don't bother implementing fancy effects because they know they don't need to make any effort, because their product will sell anyway. That does not mean that they could not, it means that they do not.

I don't understand how you think that something that doesn't ever run can have performance impacts - it cannot. Does installing, but not running, something on your computer actively slow it down? It's the same concept.


So in that case,there is no need for PC users to say consoles are 6 years old and dated,thus shouldn't be a problem.....correct?
Meaning it's all down to developers. And that average,slower PC's should'nt need to upgrade?
I'm no computer wizard,far from infact...but i just don't get where your coming from.
Look back through all the topics about graphics,physics,whatever,that people want and then say they can't have because of aging consoles.
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Courtney Foren
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:16 am

So in that case,there is no need for PC users to say consoles are 6 years old and dated,thus shouldn't be a problem.....correct?
Meaning it's all down to developers. And that average,slower PC's should'nt need to upgrade?
I'm no computer wizard,far from infact...but i just don't get where your coming from.
Look back through all the topics about graphics,physics,whatever,that people want and then say they can't have because of aging consoles.


They can't because bethesda have stated no PC-specific features. That does not mean PC specific features are impossible.

It's not a difficult concept to understand, something that never does anything does not affect performance. A game does not run slower on "Low" because there are higher graphics settings available.
What *does* hold us back is when people don't implement any higher than "Low" because the dominant hardware is 6 years old and will happily buy the same game with minor changes every year. Advancement becomes unneccesary in such a system.

It's a capitalist's dream, but a gamer's nightmare - except so many don't even notice.
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Jason White
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:21 am

They can't because bethesda have stated no PC-specific features. That does not mean PC specific features are impossible.

It's not a difficult concept to understand, something that never does anything does not affect performance. A game does not run slower on "Low" because there are higher graphics settings available.
What *does* hold us back is when people don't implement any higher than "Low" because the dominant hardware is 6 years old and will happily buy the same game with minor changes every year. Advancement becomes unneccesary in such a system.

It's a capitalist's dream, but a gamer's nightmare - except so many don't even notice.

It's clear we don't see eye to eye on this matter.
So i suggest we leave it there.
I'm happy with skyrim so far regardless and i hope your happy with it too :)
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CORY
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:07 am

Consoles can't handle simple cloth physics? Did nobody here play RDR? The poncho and duster coat looked fine to me, even if it's not true cloth physics. The Creation engine should be able to implement that sort of thing no problem.
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Victor Oropeza
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:04 am

It's clear we don't see eye to eye on this matter.
So i suggest we leave it there.
I'm happy with skyrim so far regardless and i hope your happy with it too :)


It isn't a case of seeing eye to eye, whether unused features hinder performance is not a matter of opinion. However, I'm quite happy to stop this ridiculous argument, yes.

Consoles can't handle simple cloth physics? Did nobody here play RDR? The poncho and duster coat looked fine to me, even if it's not true cloth physics. The Creation engine should be able to implement that sort of thing no problem.


Well, the main issue is that the only places to run cloth physics are the GPU (Already pushed close to its limits) or the CPU (Pushed close to its limits with NPC scheduling and AI in populated areas - where cloth physics would be most effective), so wheras RDR could do it, Skyrim will be running a lot more stuff in populated areas, leaving little room for awesome physics. If bethesda want it done I'm sure they can figure something out, but just because one game has it does not mean every game can.
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BrEezy Baby
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 6:20 am

You again? :mellow:
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Josh Dagreat
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:24 am

dx11 tessellation more important; if modders can utilize DX11 effects...o-m-f-g things will be epic.
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Marina Leigh
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:05 am

Consoles can't handle simple cloth physics? Did nobody here play RDR? The poncho and duster coat looked fine to me, even if it's not true cloth physics. The Creation engine should be able to implement that sort of thing no problem.

I'm not saying consoles can't do that,i'm talking about all the other stuff,that better tech/PC's can do,thats my point.
Be it resolutions,graphics,physics,limitations with memory,everything.
There is a limit,and that limit is alot higher on better PC's.
You can't add all these things in console games and expect them to perform the same,if at all, with all the suggestions we've had.
Meaning...if all that was taylored to the high end PC market,it would shut out other people.
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[Bounty][Ben]
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 7:51 am

dx11 tessellation more important; if modders can utilize DX11 effects...o-m-f-g things will be epic.


If you think Tessellation is impressive, I'd like to know your opinion about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eymho1qRqK4...

But yes, it's be awesome at least for the engine to be enabled to do all DX11 features. I'm so eager to have a nice big battle worthy of that name...(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SPhzt2nS1I).
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Kate Schofield
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 5:52 am

It's a nice touch, but I'd rather them focus on things like framerate (which I'm most concerned about).
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Catherine Harte
 
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Post » Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:36 pm

dx11 tessellation more important; if modders can utilize DX11 effects...o-m-f-g things will be epic.


Simply turning on tessellation doesn't make low-poly models "awesome." The original model has to be created high-poly.
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Quick Draw III
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 7:31 am

gears of war 1 had cloth physics on the xbox 360, that means ps3, pc and the 360 can handle it
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Mariaa EM.
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:47 am

It's a capitalist's dream


And what type of government do you propose? Socialist? Communist?

Haters gonna hate, capitalism has proven itself to be "fair" in the sense that you get back what you put into it in effort. Everyone has equal opportunity to succeed or fail.
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Charlie Ramsden
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:53 am

The only place cloth physics are a "real improvement" for me is if it allows characters to sleep under the covers.

It's a stupid little obsession of mine (and if you know of an Oblivion mod that fixes this, message me!), but over-starched robes don't bother me. People sleeping above the covers do... maybe it's because I'm afraid they'll wake up and say "There is no Mirabelle Monet, there is only Zuul". I don't know...
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Czar Kahchi
 
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Post » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:36 pm

And what type of government do you propose? Socialist? Communist?

Haters gonna hate, capitalism has proven itself to be "fair" in the sense that you get back what you put into it in effort. Everyone has equal opportunity to succeed or fail.


Oh, I don't disagree that while capitalism ideologically svcks, practically it's the only method that works, and will probably ever work while we're not post-scarcity. However, no other medium gets away with not improving where technology allows, why should video games? Just accepting that because "It gets publishers more money and that's what they want" is not the position *anybody* should take, unless they have far more money than sense.
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Robyn Lena
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:27 am

Cloth physics is better then snow physics, what a hell we have dynamic snowfall but clothes and hairs still look like created from wood.
By the way new trees has branches and leafs thats tremble from wind, but clothes and hairs still glued to character, is thats looks strange or not?
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Emily Martell
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:32 am

Didn't read the thread (lazy), but cloth physics when done right can allow things like capes with relative ease compared to having to make animations and multiple versions. You just assign hardpoints, lift if up and behind the character, and let physics deal with the rest. As I'm hoping cold will be Skyrims radiation from FO3/FONV, wind (and wetness) will be a multiplier (wind chill) which should be observable on capes, banners, particles, trees, grass etc. Capes won't protect against cold, but will protect against the wind and wet multipliers. but some capes are built for protection, others for appearance, and some for magic.
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Javaun Thompson
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:23 am

I'm still pretty confident we will have kick ass physics in Skyrim. :goodjob:
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scorpion972
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:26 am

Wow. You're actually running out of stuff to whinge about, aren't you?


This, seriously I think you make a new rant every frakin' week.
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Jason Wolf
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 12:51 pm

And what type of government do you propose? Socialist? Communist?

Haters gonna hate, capitalism has proven itself to be "fair" in the sense that you get back what you put into it in effort. Everyone has equal opportunity to succeed or fail.


Capitalism? Fair? Contradictio in terminis. Anyway, it won't last forever... I would be surprised if it last this entire century.
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Beth Belcher
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:06 pm

Cloth physics are VERY important to a game like skyrim. Graphics enhance gameplay


They can do, but not in all cases. I'm not really sold on the idea that cloth physics will improve gameplay. Any specific and practical examples?

Fer example, a cape flapping realistically in the breeze doesnt improve gameplay, but if it can cover your face blinding you (or an opponent if thrown) then it serves a purpose.
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Alan Cutler
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:21 am

They can do, but not in all cases. I'm not really sold on the idea that cloth physics will improve gameplay. Any specific and practical examples?

Fer example, a cape flapping realistically in the breeze doesnt improve gameplay, but if it can cover your face blinding you (or an opponent if thrown) then it serves a purpose.


I just did... Visual indication of wind, if wind (and wetness) are multipliers of cold/hypothermia replacing FO3/FONV radiation. If that mechanic is in, the gameplay is improved by *having* capes to protect from these multipliers (not so much the visual aspect). However, making it physics based makes it easier to create, as you let physics deal with it rather than animation system. As a 3D modeler, sometimes we use physics as a modeling tool rather than the final render which shows nothing of the underlying physics that took place. This is probably how they do it already, but they have to do it for each armor type - one cape version for the smooth one, and one cape version for the spiky one, and a problem for addon user armor.

I really don't know, I'm not a TES modder, so I don't know the process. Just speculating.

So the gameplay aspect of having cloth physics, is the easiness and plausability of getting workable capes in the first place, as it draqes over anything rather than having to create unique sets for every combination. Plus it expands to hair, gowns, draqes, and banners etc.

Ok, cover your face... Sounds like fun and pain at the same time :P
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Courtney Foren
 
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Post » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:24 am

While it might be nice to have, I won't be bothered if they don't have it.
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Gavin Roberts
 
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Post » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:04 pm

A good cloth phyiscs system would add a lot to the game imo. Especially if they have Cloaks, Tabbards, capes, etc.

Can you imagine standing atop a snow covered mountain, the snow and wind bellowing as your cloak quickly rustles around the buzzing wind? That would look awesome.


It would be a step back imo for them NOT to have cloth physics, especially since even INDIE developers are using them these days.
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Mr. Allen
 
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