I'd like to see separate buttons for the left and right arms. What those buttons do would depend on what you have equipped - attacking with a sword, a torch, shield bash, punching. Maybe holding the button with no weapon equipped would perform a grab. This would allow for different combinations of attacks and a more immersive combat system.

I also think stealth kills are a necessity, and the difficulty of sneaking up on the target and performing a quick and silent kill should be equal to the difficulty of defeating them in open combat.

ANYTHING THAT ISN'T BUTTON MASHING

What do people think about the option of letting your enemy surrender?

Then, I would also like the option to surrender myself.

... Just to sneak up on him with a dagger a minute later.

Wow, just wow. This is not some fighting game or grind-based MMORPG. If that's what you like, then I'd say the Elder Scrolls are not for you.

What Id really like to see is different animations (and their quality) for each Element in magic.
example:
hands up-down = lightning
down-up = fire

Just to add:
different hand gestures,movements as well as standing style for each of the elements,for example fire would require more of offensive gesticulations and continuous movement,earth wold have reliance on rooted stance without much freedom in hand gesticulations...etc.

I want a full martial arts combat system for weapon-less characters like monks. Complete with kicks, punches, flips/rolls/evasions, and throws.

Lol!!! actually i always play stealth characters, but if i ever wanted in elder scrolls to choose a fighter then thats how i would like the game to be

RPG is not "dice rolling based upon your skills." Oblivion is an action RPG. Not a turnbased RPG. 'RPG' has nothing to do with stats. There is a great sense of accomplishment when you feel like you know how to use the sword better. Have you played Mount & Blade? If you play it long enough you might see what I mean. After my 20th playthrough of Oblivion it gets old svcking at first until you level up.

Anyways, a game that takes a lot of ideas from Mount & Blade is pure fun: directional blocking, a little kicking, locational damage, parrying, timed attacks, damage calculation partially based upon the speed at which a weapon hits the body (ex. The end of the sword at a full swing hurts more than being hit when too close while the sword has yet to swing in full). That makes combat (and not just leveling up) really enjoyable. Combat with detailed real-time mechanics is very enjoyable even if you didn't gain anything from the encounter (loot or skill). Fighting is fun, and isn't repetitive when it's super detailed. The opposite is an MMORPG where combat is boring and repetitive. Leveling up (and loot) is the only thing bringing you back for another MMORPG fight if you're fighting NPCs.

And maybe as a compromise, have an 'auto attack' with math calculated dice rolls for the turned base RPG fans.

Character skill is important, but not at the expense of detailed combat mechanics where the player actually levels up in skill too.

What do I expect from the combat system? Not much. Mainly, I'm thinking we'll be seeing a bit of an iteration over Oblivion's system, likely with many of the same flaws. As for what I want... well, I want a lot of things. More dynamic animations, more weight to the actual hits, less "downtime" for the player (downtime being when you're hit and can do literally nothing but wait a few seconds as a result), better management of fatigue so that it doesn't tend to run empty almost immediately after entering a fight, AI that can attack better while moving forward so that the player can't beat them by constantly backpedaling, AI that isn't dominated by bows whenever the player is on a ledge just a few feet higher than they are, and a general reworking of the system so it no longer feels like a mediocre rip-off of the combat system from Jedi Knight with a few extra odds and ends thrown in for good measure.

EDIT: And while I'm at it, health needs to be distributed more sensibly. Bandits regularly taking over a dozen hits to go down when Daedra take about three makes no sense at all.


Neither of those is really true. The game doesn't stop being an RPG just because it's possible for a good player to do extremely difficult things in it, and being "just that badass" is only easy when the combat system is poor (which has been the case in every single Bethesda game - walking backwards with an occasional sidestep has been a trump card to nearly every possible threat in every game in this series). If combat was designed so that enemies could actually keep pace with the player while attacking, and actually defeating an exceptionally powerful enemy at first level was obscenely hard, I see no reason why it shouldn't be something that an exceptionally skilled player shouldn't be able to do.

Stats are important in a game like this, but the moment you introduce an element of player skill and involve it in the gameplay you have to allow players who have a great deal of that skill to actually use it. Otherwise, the game simply feels like it's being unfair and crippling the player solely for the sake of making the game more important than the person playing it.

I'd imagine they will find the right balance between character skill vs player driven skill. Makes sense to me anyway. Oblivion is pretty action packed imo, and I bet Skyrim will be too. Basicly a RPG-Action hybrid game. Wich isnt bad by any means. Look at Mass Effect (RPG hybrid), I love that game

Mass Effect had a good plot. ^_^

Seriously though, if Skyrim is going to keep me interested longer than it takes to finish the plot, then all aspects of its gameplay need more depth including combat. My earlier suggestion wasn't meant to be taken as a specific improvement that I personally would like to see, but just a proof of concept that the system could be made more interesting if the developers put a little creativity into game design. Where's the guy that invented Yinsh? Or "And yet it moves"? They're all fairly simple ideas which lead to a great deal of diversity. I don't actually think the specific idea is going to be implemented, it's just a guideline. I would rather, however, that Bethesda put time into seamlessly implementing a simple game into the skill system than improving the sounds or animations of the existing combat system (which should happen anyways with the experience the animators have from past games).

Something like Condemned and Assassin's Creed where you have to time attacks and blocks just right.

I hate just swinging over and over again to kill someone. I should be rewarded for timing my moves.

Why would you want to take away options!? Personally, I hate when games force 3rd person.




I second that. Archery always felt so weak in Oblivion, especially with the lack of location-based damage. Having to shoot enemies over and over again was ridiculous and quite immersion-breaking.





I couldn't agree more. One of the biggest problems with Oblivion's combat was that "downtime" -- how parrying was almost nonexistent, and instead, the player and enemies alike would be "stunned" each and every time their attack was blocked. It made realistic, fast-paced melee combat impossible.




Exactly!

Actually, it really spoiled people when it comes to Assassins. The Hashashin, (or Nizari Ishmailis as they identified themselves as), which the original Assassin's Creed was based upon, performed assassinations in a much more subtle way: They would befriend a target over the course of months and even years (racking up brownie points) before suddenly turning upon their 'friend' and killing them. Pretty brutal. Oh, and did I mention that most assassination missions carried out by them were suicidal? Yep. They usually didn't try to get away. So yeah.... being a Nizari Ishmaili assassin would svck IRL....

I agree, in Oblivion none of my characters took security or speechcraft as skill because they were pointless. Contrary to Morrowind, were nearly all my characters had security, or alteration.

I think you character's skill should be way more important. For something like bows, if my character has a skill of 5 it should be extremely hard to hit the target, have shots that fall short, or go over or way wide. And for melee weapons, if my char. has low skill, make him swing poorly, miss frequently, have opponent easily dodge or block my attacks. And if I do land a blow it should be a weak blow. And on the flip side of that, as my character develops higher skill in, say, blunt, let him land punishing blows, disarm or dismember his opponent.

I expect the combat in Skyrim to be similar to Oblivion, but I'd like it, and all other skills, to be much more dependent on the skill level and not the player's skill. I wouldn't mind seeing some tweeks to the system, and the perks. A master swordsman should be able to disarm more frequently, relative to the opponent's skill. And maybe some combination perks, ie: expert/master blade skill AND expert/master sneak skill unlocks the ability to to a critical dagger strike, mortally wounding or instantly killing the enemy...

Fun to know but way off topic.


I expect this combat system will be pretty lame, Most rpg's have really boring combat, and back in the day when graphics were so terrible and technology so limited that all you could do was IMAGINE your dodge looked really cool and the final blow afterward was epic it was fine, but now I feel like if I can't MAKE my character Dodge, Parry, Block, or Counter (and I don't mean like assassin's creed that combat system would svck for an rpg) the game is somehow more unrealistic than say Icewind dale

Yeah but Oblivion wasn't a full RPG tbh. More of a hybrid Action-RPG. I'm expecting Skyrim will be hybrid too with more fluid and dynamic combat. I don't think it will be fast paced like Assassins Creed, but it will be an improvement.

If it was restricted to first person I think it would work very well. Take exactly the same concepts of Assassins Creed, with regards to counter-attack, dodge and attack, but restrict it to first person. One of the reasons you became all powerful and able to take on 15 people was because you could see behind you with ease.

If you do get attacked you're going to want the enemies in front which you should move your character to adhere to. However, if your enemies are behind you, then you can rely on sound (surround sound?) to indicate when you need to dodge or counter.

that way you can still dodge the behind you attacks, but you have less success at doing so. All the time the infront attacks remains a timing skill for the player to adapt to.

Concerning blade and blunt, I would like to see more varied moves depending on which keys you press (W, A, S, D) or a combination of those(Remember the jedi knight series?).
I′m also expecting they add cripple effects, that would be the cherry on top of the cake. :thumbsup:

im feeling like they might use vats, and that theyre gonna have some special moves like "fore" in New Vegas where you save some points and pull off some cinimatic move. i think it would be sweet too if they did something like in Dragon Age where if youre good in something critical hits happen more often, and when you kill something with a crit. hit theres a special move that gets done. in ES imagine you just block, then pull out the big stab which u soon notice went straight through the enemy. the mechanics can stay the same but if they added things along those lines i think that'd be dope.