Is Compensation Needed?

Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 8:00 pm

Voted No. Though some might think they are laughing on the way to the bank in how this company put out such a flawed game, the justice will come when they try to release any games from this point forward. I have no intentions in spending my money on anymore of their products. OTOH, if they manage to come out with a patch that fixes the issues to make the game playable, I might have a change of heart. It is taking a long fracking time though. Which is understandable looking at the bug list...wow over 160? Inexcusable.


160 is nothing really. I read an article about Fable. Lionhead identified 5000+ bugs in their own game. You have to remember that not all the bugs will be gamebreaking. For example 1 bug might be where collision detection is abit off, and allows you to walk through walls or something. A bug like that isnt a major game breaking issue, more just annoying
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Neliel Kudoh
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:14 pm

It would restore some of my trust in them if they show that they still care about their fans and think they deserve something for going through all this trouble for a problem they caused
Hell if they bite the cost of this dlc more fans might buy the others
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Rob Davidson
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:03 pm

160 is nothing really. I read an article about Fable. Lionhead identified 5000+ bugs in their own game. You have to remember that not all the bugs will be gamebreaking. For example 1 bug might be where collision detection is abit off, and allows you to walk through walls or something. A bug like that isnt a major game breaking issue, more just annoying



It really depends on how you're counting. Fable III's bugs are more likely like "when I do this exact thing, right here I don't have collision detection" wheres the bug list for this game is more like " companion collision detection" which is nonspecific and can literally affect the entire game.
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Makenna Nomad
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:00 am

I voted no. Thing is, the travesty that was this game an its development probably cannot be easily summed up by saying "well eff Obsidian/Bethesda." There were most likely a multitude of issues such as a rush to get it out of the door, taking on a more lofty goal with the idea that most of the work was done for you already (as in reusing the Fallout Gamebryo engine), and poor performance on part of the testing department. However, from the consumer perspective this seem grievous mistakes that had simple remedies to begin with. I agree the bugs of this game have reached an entirely new level...I have a feeling this will go down in history like Vampire: the Masquerade Bloodlines as a great RPG rapped up in a blanket of bugs. Games with this breadth are tough to keep running smoothly, and I was able to ignore bugs or was quite willing to work around them for both Oblivion and F3, because the immersion I felt was so strong, I didn't mind. With F:NV however, I don't need to tell you what you already know, and the breadth of this game is NOT an excuse, indeed nothing is. Restore faith in the consumer? Will that be their top priority? Well they have another 11 months to regain that trust, as that is when ESV is due to come out. Odds are Obsidian will take a the rap for this cancer and Bethesda will keep on rolling. This isn't about greed...I'm just saying for an industry that I monitor like its my job, names do matter and not seeing a Obsidian's name on a product will put the consumer at ease knowing "Well this can't be as bad, Bethesda did this by themselves." Expect Dead Money to be the first and last DLC for New Vegas you see, I know Bethesda is eager to sweep this under the rug. Will it be free? That is a good question...and I do not know the marketing mechanics of Xbox Live as it would depend on if they have already signed an agreement where DLC profits are split accordingly, but again I not very familiar with the topic. If they had the opportunity to make it free then yes, I believe they will. Expect that to be the only "compensation" we get for foolishly buying a blockbuster game at launch.
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Sweets Sweets
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 8:18 pm

First off, the poll is skewed towards response from frustrated individuals. You're not going to get an accurate picture of the "majority of Fallout fans" from the get-go. Second, I don't know why anyone should expect compensation - the product may not work perfectly, but it doesn't damage anything other than, at worst, the saved game data which depends upon F:NV itself. There's no wrong to right on that account.

The fact that Bethesda has addressed any issue with any of its games, F:NV included, is voluntary. Nobody makes them work at fixing the issues which we consumers find. After a few months of watching and vaguely participating in this conversation, I find myself wondering how much good this does for the frustrated consumers. It seems that many of you are simply stoking each others' fires and using Bethesda's reputation, employees, and products for the fuel. You are not entitled to compensation, period. Caveat effing emptor.
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Shianne Donato
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 5:14 am

First off, the poll is skewed towards response from frustrated individuals. You're not going to get an accurate picture of the "majority of Fallout fans" from the get-go. Second, I don't know why anyone should expect compensation - the product may not work perfectly, but it doesn't damage anything other than, at worst, the saved game data which depends upon F:NV itself. There's no wrong to right on that account.

The fact that Bethesda has addressed any issue with any of its games, F:NV included, is voluntary. Nobody makes them work at fixing the issues which we consumers find. After a few months of watching and vaguely participating in this conversation, I find myself wondering how much good this does for the frustrated consumers. It seems that many of you are simply stoking each others' fires and using Bethesda's reputation, employees, and products for the fuel. You are not entitled to compensation, period. Caveat effing emptor.


This. So much this.
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Sharra Llenos
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:19 am

Will that be their top priority? Well they have another 11 months to regain that trust, as that is when ESV is due to come out.
Expect Dead Money to be the first and last DLC for New Vegas you see,

1. That's pure speculation - apologies, I didn't realise they'd just announced Skyrim!
2. I very much doubt it!
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Monika Krzyzak
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:07 pm

The OP of this thread owes me compensation for not using the search bar.
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Vincent Joe
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:12 pm

It looks like you will receive compensation in a way. Not originally part of the game, now all of the safehouses include armor and weapons that are otherwise tough to get (for example, the NCR Salvaged Power Armor and the Ranger Armor that you can pretty much only get by killing an NCR person will be in the NCR safehouse, there'll also be new magazines, etc). They certainly didn't have to do that.

As for the poster that said that Dead Money will be their only DLC? I don't think so :) When they sell half a million alone for the Xbox (and they will, the vocal minority here may not buy them, I might not buy them all but I'll buy some of them for sure), they'll make another, and another... and maybe another. They're not done making money off this game by a long shot.
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Darlene DIllow
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:48 pm

As for the poster that said that Dead Money will be their only DLC? I don't think so :) When they sell half a million alone for the Xbox (and they will, the vocal minority here may not buy them, I might not buy them all but I'll buy some of them for sure), they'll make another, and another... and maybe another. They're not done making money off this game by a long shot.


1. That's pure speculation - apologies, I didn't realise they'd just announced Skyrim!
2. I very much doubt it!

From the perspective that the problems with F:NV are so profound and widespread amongst consumers and there has been a strong voice on these forums to boycott the upcoming DLC I think I have some ground; again I know that these forums are not representative of the majority, but many gamers now have some mastery of the internets as everyone on all platforms of this game has had some kind of "inconvenience" of varying degrees while playing this game. Once the figures for Dead Money sales show...they will stop right in their tracks and cut their losses. I know, the common sentiment it that I am basing this off of little, but think about it, this is a debacle on Obsidian's and Bethesda's part, the only reason you've heard Dead Money announced was because they were mostly done with it by the time F:NV had just been launched. It wouldn't make sense to kill a project like that when so much of it has been completed. Call me crazy, but the resources put into subsequent DLC may not be worth it....now if in the interim these major bugs were fixed for good, that's another story. But as one can see from the PS3 forums little has changed for the better and it would take months before this game is in suitable condition. To add DLC, you'd have to fix buggy game to make sure subsequent DLC was at least compatible and so it doesn't cause your Xbox to explode. What's more likely to happen? Spending months and working on fixing the game with a disgruntled fan base (trust me though the forum ranters are representative of a minority, the majority of players are dissatisfied, but they are mature enough not to act like bloody hooligan) in addition to producing DLC; or forgetting that crap and moving on. If you chose the former you are a significantly more optimistic person than me, or jaded at supposed greed whatever personality du jour that seems to run rampant through these forums. I sincerely hope I eat my words (and if I am I will make a thread titled "I R [censored]" to which all are welcome to flame me)...but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that this game was dead on arrival.
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Mariaa EM.
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:30 pm

All i wanna say is that, they don't really care about us..
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Danny Blight
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:08 pm

From the perspective that the problems with F:NV are so profound and widespread amongst consumers and there has been a strong voice on these forums to boycott the upcoming DLC I think I have some ground; again I know that these forums are not representative of the majority, but many gamers now have some mastery of the internets as everyone on all platforms of this game has had some kind of "inconvenience" of varying degrees while playing this game. Once the figures for Dead Money sales show...they will stop right in their tracks and cut their losses. I know, the common sentiment it that I am basing this off of little, but think about it, this is a debacle on Obsidian's and Bethesda's part, the only reason you've heard Dead Money announced was because they were mostly done with it by the time F:NV had just been launched. It wouldn't make sense to kill a project like that when so much of it has been completed. Call me crazy, but the resources put into subsequent DLC may not be worth it....now if in the interim these major bugs were fixed for good, that's another story. But as one can see from the PS3 forums little has changed for the better and it would take months before this game is in suitable condition. To add DLC, you'd have to fix buggy game to make sure subsequent DLC was at least compatible and so it doesn't cause your Xbox to explode. What's more likely to happen? Spending months and working on fixing the game with a disgruntled fan base (trust me though the forum ranters are representative of a minority, the majority of players are dissatisfied, but they are mature enough not to act like bloody hooligan) in addition to producing DLC; or forgetting that crap and moving on. If you chose the former you are a significantly more optimistic person than me, or jaded at supposed greed whatever personality du jour that seems to run rampant through these forums. I sincerely hope I eat my words (and if I am I will make a thread titled "I R [censored]" to which all are welcome to flame me)...but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that this game was dead on arrival.


All I can say is that time heals most wounds and makes people forget things, but from what I hear Fallout 3 was not an enjoyable experience on release day either, and they made... what, 5 DLCs for that? You might be right, but I think we truly are seeing a VERY small minority represented on these boards (I don't know how many people are registered and active on the Fallout boards but if 5 million copies were sold and there's even 5000 people on these boards, with only 400 people contributing to things like the polls or whatever (right now there's only 54 people on the boards according to their stats), the boycott of the DLC will be about as effective as people who claim they're boycotting gasoline. I think there's a lot of people who've come to expect some bugginess from the fallout series, for me, if there's absolutely no risk of the DLC issue, then my game runs basically as well as Fallout 3 did (a freeze once or twice a week if I'm playing every day). I can't be the only one of those either. I'm not getting into that argument again, but what I am saying is that I think the DLC will sell, and Bethesda/Obsidian must think so too or they would have just simply cut their losses and said "eh, never mind, we've decided there's no sense in releasing the DLC as the community has said they won't buy it". They're not going to release something that won't make money (or at least that they don't believe will make money).
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Prisca Lacour
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 1:40 am

All i wanna say is that, they don't really care about us..

thats completely not true..they care about you in some respect..your $$$$$
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Budgie
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:57 am

The bottom line here is that a lot of people have decided to fall to their sense of entitlement regarding this subject. It is refreshing to see a civil discussion commencing in this thread as pertaining to the subject matter at hand. In all honesty, the patch itself is the compensation. Maybe with a few little extras tossed in as previously noted. Game raging over glitches on an internet forum definitely can feel fulfilling to those that are responsible for doing such. However, I would tend to agree that those that are doing so are definitely part of the minority.

Many individuals seem to forget that a game of this magnitude is going to have its idiosyncrasies. There is no such thing as the perfect game that will appeal to everyone. If there were, no one would be on this forum, or any other for that matter, because they would all be too busy playing the game. People also tend to forget that there are far more games on the market today that are basically broken, unplayable tripe that have never been patched, and never will be.

Some that have posted their rage over losing a work week worth of time, and cried "Lawsuit", "Compensation", "Boycott" or any other cockamamie blithering, have given me a lot of laughter. That's really the only compensation I need. In this (overly) litigious society we live in, people seem to think that tossing out the word lawsuit automatically gives them clout. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Especially when they do so on the publisher's website forums.

It's a video game people. Something that is meant to waste time with for entertainment. At the end of the day, all you have is a dent in the couch, sore thumbs, and eye fatigue to show for that 1000/1000 Achievement list.
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sexy zara
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 1:56 am

All I can say is that time heals most wounds and makes people forget things, but from what I hear Fallout 3 was not an enjoyable experience on release day either, and they made... what, 5 DLCs for that? You might be right, but I think we truly are seeing a VERY small minority represented on these boards (I don't know how many people are registered and active on the Fallout boards but if 5 million copies were sold and there's even 5000 people on these boards, with only 400 people contributing to things like the polls or whatever (right now there's only 54 people on the boards according to their stats), the boycott of the DLC will be about as effective as people who claim they're boycotting gasoline. I think there's a lot of people who've come to expect some bugginess from the fallout series, for me, if there's absolutely no risk of the DLC issue, then my game runs basically as well as Fallout 3 did (a freeze once or twice a week if I'm playing every day). I can't be the only one of those either. I'm not getting into that argument again, but what I am saying is that I think the DLC will sell, and Bethesda/Obsidian must think so too or they would have just simply cut their losses and said "eh, never mind, we've decided there's no sense in releasing the DLC as the community has said they won't buy it". They're not going to release something that won't make money (or at least that they don't believe will make money).


You make a good point with the F3 parable. But F3 never was at the point F:NV is now....yeah there were problems (and there are still some) but it wasn't/isn't as widespread. However my perception is skewed by what I have seen, and what close friends have seen, as well as the pandemonium that is the Internets QQing since New Vegas' launch. I disagree that Bethesda would hold release for Dead Money at any point, it is, for all intents and purposes, done and they have already spent the time and resources into making it, regardless of whether it would be profitable at this point is moot, because they having nothing to lose by releasing it.

(My use of commas is questionable, apologies to the grammar Nazis)
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Catherine N
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:07 am

I voted yes that we should get some compensation for what the consumer has had to deal with this game. Freezing issues aside, after the latest patch I'm still running into some quest bugs, some old, some new. As for the compensation, just a free dlc with new radio songs or the songs from F3 would make me as happy as can be.
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Chavala
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:45 am

The bottom line here is that a lot of people have decided to fall to their sense of entitlement regarding this subject. It is refreshing to see a civil discussion commencing in this thread as pertaining to the subject matter at hand. In all honesty, the patch itself is the compensation. Maybe with a few little extras tossed in as previously noted. Game raging over glitches on an internet forum definitely can feel fulfilling to those that are responsible for doing such. However, I would tend to agree that those that are doing so are definitely part of the minority.

Many individuals seem to forget that a game of this magnitude is going to have its idiosyncrasies. There is no such thing as the perfect game that will appeal to everyone. If there were, no one would be on this forum, or any other for that matter, because they would all be too busy playing the game. People also tend to forget that there are far more games on the market today that are basically broken, unplayable tripe that have never been patched, and never will be.

Some that have posted their rage over losing a work week worth of time, and cried "Lawsuit", "Compensation", "Boycott" or any other cockamamie blithering, have given me a lot of laughter. That's really the only compensation I need. In this (overly) litigious society we live in, people seem to think that tossing out the word lawsuit automatically gives them clout. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Especially when they do so on the publisher's website forums.

It's a video game people. Something that is meant to waste time with for entertainment. At the end of the day, all you have is a dent in the couch, sore thumbs, and eye fatigue to show for that 1000/1000 Achievement list.


My good sir,
You can not be serious ... there is a definite difference between entitlement and making amends for a blatant screw up by a company. Your quote of the Patch is the compensation is crazy and would not make sense in any situation here ill give you a few examples. I just bought my kindle and it doesn't seem to display all the words of the books I download ... oh I am sorry for your inconvenience sir we will have a patch for that in about 2 months so you cant use your product as intended and advertised but our gift to you is that we will fix the product. Another example waiter my food seems to be only half cooked ..... I am sorry sir we can take that back and cook it up again for you in about 2 months come back then and receive our gift to you the cooked meal you payed for in the first place. One more how bout it ... Excuse me I bought a sofa and only got half a sofa .. I am sorry sir we only made half sofas and will in about 2 months have the other half available ... so while you only have half of what you payed for our gift to you is that we will get you that other half when we are done with the fixes. I am sure by now you get my point but you will never acknowledge it that this terminology of the fix is compensation is just absurd.
As far as there not being a game that appeals to EVERYONE well you are right you are absolutely right but that is certainly a no DUH what you fail to realize is that this is not about a games appeal its about a game simply being PLAYABLE. My friend hates fallout 3 and NV so he doesn't play it because it does not appeal to him ... in turn he loves black ops and I don't so I don't play it but the issue isn't our likes and dislikes its simply the fact that we could play the games we liked so I am not sure what you were getting at.
Talk of lawsuits is not permitted by the mods so I will not touch on that other then to say if you are talking legal action on the company forum then you are not really serious about it.
Your point about more games being out there that are broken and will never be fixed is a real good one but you must understand that few games with as much hype as this one promising so much and being a flat out good game can really be considered in this category. Many of the broken games I have played that will not be finished were simply BAD games not worth finishing but FONV is a great game that got handled real poorly.
Finally you can liken all this to just being a video game ... but no matter your hobby be it gardening, knitting, curling, or whatever its what someone likes to do regardless of the payoff or lack there of in your mind. Simple fact is .... don"t judge.

My feeling is they should at least apologize for this its been a complete disaster that would make me pretty happy ... or maybe a new in game gun lol.
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Mario Alcantar
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 5:25 am

I voted yes that we should get some compensation for what the consumer has had to deal with this game. Freezing issues aside, after the latest patch I'm still running into some quest bugs, some old, some new. As for the compensation, just a free dlc with new radio songs or the songs from F3 would make me as happy as can be.


DUDE that would be awesome!!! I loved the old songs I think the new ones cant compare at all so a DLC of the old songs would be DA BOMB!!!!!
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Ella Loapaga
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:19 pm

I am a Fallout junkie. after playing all of the Fallout games form one to three i was really impressed, but when new vegas was up for reliese i looked at all the reviews and blogs people had put down before i bought it not knowing about the bugs and lag defects i went and bought my own copy. i played it till i was level 23 and then it froze... after that quests stopped working and wouldnt let me complete them fully. i have never been so upset about a game before. i feel that if you are going to do something you do it right otherwise you make people very angery...!

this is why i bought an Xbox 360 i had a PS3 and wasnt happy with its quality or prices. all of my games work fine with out any glitches.

so yes i feel that gamesas have put alot of people out of pocket and piece of mind twards thier company. i feel that we should get some sort of compensation if its some sort of patch and free gift like a new weapon or something that will make it more interesting. like i said i have played all of the fallouts and never had a problem untill now. i dont want them to give me the money back because it wont make things right but i would however like to complete the game bug, lag, glitch and freeze free thank you

Bio-Radio Fallout junkie quakein in my hands makes me feel dirty but i will never stop!>!>!>
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Stephanie Nieves
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:40 pm

DUDE that would be awesome!!! I loved the old songs I think the new ones cant compare at all so a DLC of the old songs would be DA BOMB!!!!!


As mentioned, they've already compensated everyone. Free armors and weapons and magazines in all the faction safehouses that weren't originally there. That's what you'll get as compensation.
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Rebecca Dosch
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 8:43 pm

As mentioned, they've already compensated everyone. Free armors and weapons and magazines in all the faction safehouses that weren't originally there. That's what you'll get as compensation.



source?
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Wanda Maximoff
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:01 am

source?

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ausir/Official_patch_notes_released,_PC_and_360_patches_next_week

# All reputation safehouses have been updated with additional supplies (armor, weapons, ammunition, skill magazines)
# All-purpose science suit can now be found in the Followers safehouse
# Legion Vexillarius armor, Legion Centurion armor and Legion Praetorian armor, sniper rifle, displacer glove, and machete gladius can now be found in the Caesar's Legion safehouse
# NCR Ranger combat armor can now be found in the NCR Ranger safehouse
# Recon armor, T-51b power armor, and T-45d power armor, all in poor condition, as well as Tesla cannon, Gatling laser and some ammo can be found in the Brotherhood of Steel safehouse.
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Trevi
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:49 am

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ausir/Official_patch_notes_released,_PC_and_360_patches_next_week

# All reputation safehouses have been updated with additional supplies (armor, weapons, ammunition, skill magazines)
# All-purpose science suit can now be found in the Followers safehouse
# Legion Vexillarius armor, Legion Centurion armor and Legion Praetorian armor, sniper rifle, displacer glove, and machete gladius can now be found in the Caesar's Legion safehouse
# NCR Ranger combat armor can now be found in the NCR Ranger safehouse
# Recon armor, T-51b power armor, and T-45d power armor, all in poor condition, as well as Tesla cannon, Gatling laser and some ammo can be found in the Brotherhood of Steel safehouse.


I would guess that all these items were originally scheduled to be in the game but removed to push this abortion out before Xmas.
But then i'm just a bit cynical.
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.X chantelle .x Smith
 
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Post » Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:01 pm

As mentioned, they've already compensated everyone. Free armors and weapons and magazines in all the faction safehouses that weren't originally there. That's what you'll get as compensation.


dude I would pay for the old songs my opinion is the new ones are not as catchy johny guitar ... come on. I wasn't getting at it being for compensation I just prefer the old songs. silly man
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Greg Swan
 
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Post » Fri Jul 30, 2010 4:54 am

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ausir/Official_patch_notes_released,_PC_and_360_patches_next_week

# All reputation safehouses have been updated with additional supplies (armor, weapons, ammunition, skill magazines)
# All-purpose science suit can now be found in the Followers safehouse
# Legion Vexillarius armor, Legion Centurion armor and Legion Praetorian armor, sniper rifle, displacer glove, and machete gladius can now be found in the Caesar's Legion safehouse
# NCR Ranger combat armor can now be found in the NCR Ranger safehouse
# Recon armor, T-51b power armor, and T-45d power armor, all in poor condition, as well as Tesla cannon, Gatling laser and some ammo can be found in the Brotherhood of Steel safehouse.

is the game gonna freeze and crash when you use them?
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meg knight
 
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