I have to admit that I disliked Oblivion for many...many reasons. There's no sense getting into all of that now, but I just have to say that I never thought in a million years that Bethesda would take my (and many others) complaints about Oblivion's direction seriously. Shivering Isles and Fallout 3 improved on it in a lot of ways, but I still had my doubts.

But so far I've seen more positive information from Bethesda than I have negative, which leads me to believe that they really did incorporate a lot of the criticisms that Oblivion took from the Morrowind fanatics (I happily admit that I dislike Daggerfall, but not with the passion I hated Oblivion with). So indulge me in listing all the ways that Skyrim will improve on Oblivion's shortcomings from my perspective:

1) Perks have the potential to make character progression the deepest of any Elder Scrolls since Daggerfall, even with only 18 skills

2) Carriage system (immersive travel option) combined with Fast Travel, best of both worlds, we've been asking for that one for years, since the earliest TES:V ideas and suggestion thread. Very happy to see that in today's IGN interview.

3) Handcrafted world/dungeon content. This is a big one. My biggest complaint for Oblivion fell in this category. I hated the randomized world. I was shocked to learn Oblivion had only one dungeon designer for the whole game. I'm so glad Skyrim will have 8, and I feel like exploration will be as interesting (even more so) than in Morrowind. This goes hand in hand with the feeling of culture in the world.

4) Rebalanced level/loot system. This one goes without saying. Fallout 3 really did do it better

5) From what I've been able to gather, the quest compass is either gone or will play a much reduced role in Skyrim. This is another huge one.

6) Verisimilitude. Oblivion didn't have it. Skyrim appears to. Things like logging, farming, mining playing a role in an active game-world economy. Morrowind had many egg-mines and farms but not a genuinely functioning economy. Skyrim will appear to build on that. Oblivion only had a handful of farms, no functioning mines or forts, and no trade routes...strange for the capital province.

7) Adhering to the lore. 7,000 steps. No radical departures like with Cyrodiil's jungle.

8) Politics and intrigue. Oblivion didn't have it. Skyrim appears to


I still have some concerns. Namely what will happen with the PC interface, how factions will be handled, and minor things like levitate, and how the new in-game books will be handled...but overall I'm very pleased with what I see. I just want to take a second and thank Bethesda for sticking true to its fans. Skyrim is definitely on my "to buy" list...especially after other, more recent disappointments...

I agree with this 100%. Although I can't say I hated Oblivion, I can say that I was disappointed with aspects of it.

I loved oblivion and its one of my favorite games ever made , but to each his own. Skyrim will be amazing

Don't complain so much, you could actually modify your game.
Us console players, were stuck with Vanilla OB. YET I still loved it. I really do not see why you hated it, but I digress. I am also very excited that they are listening to the fans and making changes.

:stare:

Well, I think Oblivion improved upon nearly everything that Morrowind did. It wasn't the perfect game, but neither was Morrowind. And Skyrim won't be either, but I expect Skyrim to improve upon Oblivion too.

It's just asking for trouble to go into a topic as an "Oblivion Hater." It's frustrating just for me to hear that.

Wait, there was an IGN interview today? o.o
Link?

Hm. I don't agree with you. I have no problem calling myself an "Oblivion Hater", and you can feel free to view my posting history and see all the time and effort I put into offering suggestions for TES:V before it was Skyrim and ways to improve on Fallout 3 using critiques from Oblivion (though I doubt the forum history will go back that far). I'm not sure why you would begrudge me the right to refer to myself as such? Irrelevant anyway, I still find Skyrim's confirmed features to be very promising from my more Morrowind inclined perspective.



http://pc.ign.com/articles/115/1158651p1.html

Guys, he's not complaining. He's praising Skyrim. Oblivion did do these things wrong. It was a great game, but those things the OP mentioned were probably the biggest problems with Oblivion and Bethesda is going back and fixing them.

It's just a frustrating viewpoint when I loved Oblivion so much. It's like if I called myself a Morrowind Hater and praised Oblivion. Yes, I'm entitled to my opinion, and you certainly are as well, but it's just a very challenging thing to claim you hate a game that so many people love. Especially since I always feel like Oblivion gets such a bad rap that it doesn't deserve.

We can both agree though that Skyrim is looking to be an improvement nonetheless.

Perhaps, but phrases like "Oblivion Hater" are going to be divisive and contentious before people have even read a word of what you have to say. Though you made some good points, I'm not sure it was really the most conducive introduction.

Althought I don't hate Oblivion with such passion as you, I agree with you.

It makes TESIV look like a project the dev's made in their spare time. And drunk. Considering how ambitious TESV is (and TESII was), it seems really odd to me that the same developer team can produce something like TESIV but then also have the capabilities to make something like TESV will seem to be. It was like they were holding back on TESIV, which just makes me feel slighted that they didn't give their all when making the game. It just shows that TESIV could have been much more complex (and better) than what was released.

So, yes, I'm glad the devs are making TESV so great. But this also makes me suspicious and distrustful, since they skimped on content and innovation in their last game for no stated reason. It you can make something awesome, why did you release something so limited like TESIV? It just makes me wary, is all.

The problem with Oblivion is that it felt too much like Bethesda tried to cater too much to the casual gamer. The compass and fast travel made it feel like it wasn't an open world game anymore. It was too simplistic.

All the dungeons looked alike. Even discovering the dungeons was nonexistent because the compass would show where it was once you got within a mile of it.

:nod: Agree.

Hype is a dangerous device.

Title of this thread turned me off, sorry. It's a shame too, since you make some good points for improvements in Skyrim.

I agree. Which is why I still have some reservations. The carriage system got me excited though. Seriously, that's more a nod to the old fanbase than anything else I've seen so far. It felt like Todd Howard was implicitly saying "Yes, we listened to you...you crazy people" :celebration:

Or they just thought it was a good fit for the game...

I see little difference between the upgrade from Morrowind to Oblivion and the one now from Oblivion to Skyrim. It seems to be the exact same type of thing: a response to the fans. A lot of people, myself included, had a lot of problems finding their way around Vvardenfell and getting lost and having to suffer through the terrible directions given by NPCs. Oblivion sought to fix that with a compass and map markers, and did, but lost a bit of the charm and exploration feel of Morrowind in the process. They recognize that and they're seeking to fix that as well.

All I'm saying is, give Oblivion a break. It was very ambitious as well and it is a phenomenal game, whether you think it matches Morrowind's brilliance or not, and give Skyrim a break in advance. Put aside nostalgia and a desire for a repeat of Morrowind if those things will taint your view of Skyrim and try to appreciate it for what it is: something new; part of a series but a stand-alone game in its own right.

It seems that some people would be better suited as Nintendo faithful since they like to be blinded by nostalgia.

I don't hate Oblivion, far from it in fact. I played it for hours on end. Problem was I didn't feel svcked in like I did with Morrowind. I do acknowledge that Oblivion improved on a lot of things.

That being said with Skyrim, I'm not looking for a repeat of Morrowind. I'm ecstatic about Skyrim and the wait is unbearable. It, so far, looks like a perfect game.

i loved oblivion to death played it on both consoles and the pc
started over 20 characters on the xbox 360 and finshed same
the xbox counts saves and i have almost 6000

looking forward to skyrim

Or...both? :foodndrink:



Not sure why I'm going to respond to this since you're just spamming, but I have a strong opinion of what it takes to make a good Elder Scrolls game great. I see that in Skyrim in ways I never saw in Oblivion. I've been playing Elder Scrolls games since Daggerfall. Having an opinion of quality is not nostalgia, it's taste.

What a thread title...

You know what I'm thinking.

My apologies. I should have directed that comment more specifically at other forum members that say Morrowind is the Holy Grail of the series, but offer little more than that. You at least have some posts with substance, so I can respect that.

Still...your title turns me off and unfortunately I cannot take everything at face value even though it was well thought out. Sorry.

It may be a leftover from my experiencing the "casual/hardcoe" wars on the WoW forums, but....



...you say that like it's automatically a bad thing.


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re: Oblivion

As far as I was aware, the only really true problem Oblivion had was the stupid level scaling. Everything else is just minor stuff & preferences.