Look to psychology.. If the punishment is swift, not over the top (it may backfire if its too over the top), and relatively near to the act which you are trying to stop.. It can be effective..

Arcane:

Known or understood by very few, as you said.

=/= flawed. Skyrim's Nightingales are arcane, whereas the axe as a form of execution is archaic. The appropriate term here is the latter.

This. Operant conditioning is pretty well established (although reinforcement is much more effective than punishment).

Necessary.... and kinky

Physical pain is the most irrelevant thing on this planet. It's utterly pointless. Emotional suffering is unfortunate, but necessary in order to feel happy. Physical pain is NOT necessary in any way shape or form.

So no, I don't think children should be hit by their parents.

On the one hand, theoretically it might work.

On the other, it was banned for a reason. Give some people an inch and they'll take a mile, even with their own kids.

On the whole, I'd call it a bad idea.

Let's spank advlt prisoners! lol

*Facepalm* You know what? That was the word I meant. I was trying to remember what word I was looking for and arcane was what came to mind. But you're right. Thank's for saying what I couldn't get to come to mind.

No----the prisoners will just think it's a kinky or fraternity thing and the spanking will be rendered useless .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfpJk3VRypY.

Even worse http://youtu.be/iHRhidn6aQQ .

Who took the magic out of this thread and fixed arcane?

I say the old school beatings were effective but the problem with those methods today is that kids are too sensitive to handle such things.

Spanking is normal and appropriate in moderation. I was spanked when I was younger and today I feel the experience definitely had a net positive effect on my character overall. Aside from that I'd say, don't threaten to spank your kid unless you fully intend to follow through with it, never spank a kid just because you're feeling angry or frustrated with them, and for goodness sake, don't spank a kid without giving them a corrective talk afterwards and telling them how they ought to behave better. Otherwise your kid will just internalize the experience and you'll end up with a very resentful child in the future at best.

Oh, and the notion that you should stop spanking your kid when they turn some magical age like 13 is pretty of dumb, kids don't magically grow up and stop being little [censored] at that age and in many cases I'd say it's good for their attitude to whoop 'em straight once in a while. No kidding.

In school, there are kids that will harass other kids relentlessly, knowing there is no punishment severe enough that the school administration is allowed to issue to make them stop. The result is, kids have to take matters into their own hands and give them a good beating, hopefully while nobody is looking. In a sense, kids are having to fill that void that used to be spanking and corporal punishment. Bring it back!!

I challenge you to spend a full week with my 10 year old daughter. We'll see how quickly you change your tune Seriously though, insulting people by basically calling them bad parents because they resort to corporal punishment is full of fail.

Yeah, this. Kids hitting each other is bullying or messing around; a parent hitting (to an appropriate extent) a kid is discipline. There you'll find your moral standing.

It's a wonderful thought that all children could be taught (really... trained) how to behave appropriately in society by non-physical punishment. But, we live in the real world where not all people are created equal and there is no one sure way to mold a child into a non-crappy advlt. For those of you who claim that there is always a "better" option, I would challenge you to find it with a child like I was. I was able to figure things out pretty early on and bucked authority every single chance I got. My parents are both intelligent (to counter the argument earlier in the thread that parents who use spankings are too stupid to do something else), we had a great relationship (I felt extremely loved, my parents spent lots of time with us), I respected them as people (as much as a child can), and they tried every single kind of non-physical punishment known to man.... and none worked.

Time-outs: I'd play in the corner. I didn't need toys or people to entertain myself. Time-outs didn't bother me at all and thus was no type of punishment. Fail.

Taking away toys/stuff: See previous issue. Fail.

Good, long talking to: I'd store up the info I'd gleen from these nice little talks and find ways to throw it back at my parents at a later date. I was an unruly child. Fail.

Ignoring the behavior: I just escalated. Fail.

They also tried to ignore the bad behavior and instead tried to focus on rewarding my good behavior: I got bored with "extrinsic motivation". Fail.

They tried to mix the punishment/reward system: It just didn't bother me one way or another. It never felt like punishment. Fail.

So for those of you who are anti-spanking, what would you do? The only thing that worked to curb my behavior was being spanked. I was never touched in my face, never slapped, never hit in anger. I was spanked on the butt and after I finished screaming and crying (not from pain, mind you, but from the frustration that I couldn't do what I wanted to do), they would sit me down and make sure I was extremely clear as to why I was spanked. Children don't come with the knowledge of how to act in public, how to interact with people, or what behaviors are acceptable in a society - they must be taught/trained.

And put simply: When you fail to hold your child responsible for their actions or are unwilling to go however far you need to instill respect into your child, i and every other person who will ever have to meet your child one day, will be the ones who have to deal with it. Please don't make me to go jail for giving your advlt child the beating you should have given them as a child. Thank you.

Like I said before, it depends on the individual. Sometimes, spanking works... Sometimes it doesn't and something else will.

Obviously they didn't detain you properly or for long enough. There's a reason why even in prison, the punishment within the punishment is solitary confinement. When you are given NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING for long periods of times, it works on you on a far greater level than a spanking.

This is for the exact same reason that vometia mentioned earlier. Physical punishment is temporary AND the human brain is literally programmed to forget pain or at the least incorrectly remember its severity. No such limit exists on psychological punishments beyond repression.

How long would you have liked them to keep me in a corner? I remember sitting there for over an hour before. At some point, I think most people would consider it abuse.

Who said anything about keeping you in a corner? You can confine someone without literally confining someone, you know.

If you had a single possession besides literally the clothes for the day or were able to get food on your own without asking, then you weren't detained to the greatest level. There's no abuse there, but it's taking every single bit of the small amount of freedom a child has away. You feed them properly, you cloth them properly (clothes provided for the day, they no longer have a say in what clothes to wear for the day), so they aren't being treated bad, but every luxury of modern life and every freedom is taken away.

And not a finger lifted against the child.

BTW: the above still is a punishment, just one that requires more work on the punisher than simply smacking a kid and reminds the child of how much you are giving them every day out of love.

Some people won't be bothered by any period of nonabusive confinement of any kind. I know I've always been fully capable of purely mental self-entertainment, even from when I was a young child (in my case, I was able to generate a complete world in my mind in which to play). I didn't need any kind of environmental stimulation at all.

I was raised in the 80's so I didn't have any of the common stuff today. We were also not very well-off, so what you just said was pretty much my daily life... I never picked my clothes, I was never allowed to get my own food, I rarely had time to watch TV, and I spent most of my time outside. Keeping me inside and in my room without anything wasn't an issue (didn't have lots to take away) because I could still entertain myself. You seem to be under the impression that my mom had no patience - my mom was a freaking saint. I just happened to be a horribly um... "willful" child.

I honestly don't believe you. Sure, you can get on fine having fun doing nothing but using your imagination for some time, but humans literally crave stimulation.

Either you grew up in the boonies in the middle of nowhere or you seriously underestimate how much you took for granted. It's surprising how much you take for granted, but all you have to do is go back about 50 years in history to realize how much you take for granted. The amount of freedom a child in the US and most European countries is quite large even if you don't realize it.

I also believe you're underestimating how much other forms of punishment affected you due to the effect time has had on your memory. It may very well have not had the same short-term effect as hitting you, but they most likely did have an effect. The difference with certain punishments is that it has a very sharp decline followed by a sharp pickup (like physical punishments, because it's painful and obivous right after, but pain is quickly forgotten) whereas other punishments have a gradual continuous decline in behavior instead of a more razor-like effect.

Yeah, that still don't work. Me and my wife have confined our daughter to her room for an entire week, we removed EVERYTHING that she could use to have fun with, the only thing she was allowed to do was sit and do homework, or stare out the window. No tv, no games, no toys, no books, no anything. She wasn't allowed to come out and get drinks or snacks or anything. Didn't phase her one single iota. The moment the punishment was up, she was right back to being the annoying, mouthy brat that she has sadly become. Only the threat of spanking her gets her to do what we want, when we want. So there goes that theory at the window.

No it doesn't. Your threat just fits the scenario described above of short-term correction. That's reinforced by the fact that she regresses later even after spanking you you have to threaten or do it again. Physical pain is too fleeting in the brain.

The other method, however, does require a much greater commitment on your behalf. Literally the second she starts acting up again, she's thrown back into zero permissions mode for a set period of time. Spankings also become less effective over time (as the child grows up) whereas privilege removal never becomes less effective.

NOTE: I am not arguing against spanking your kids necessarily (that is, after all, the parent's prerogative), just giving an alternative of equal effectiveness (though one that does involve a lot more work on the behalf of the punisher).