The complaining about cut content is getting rather out of hand. Just because there was something in a previous game doesn't mean it can be in the next game. It comes down to one simple fact. Cost and development time. The cost of the Elder Scrolls game has to be massive based on the amount of people working on it and the amount of time it takes to develop it.

Todd has stated every time a ES game is created, they start with a blank slate. So every time the create a new project the engine has to be overhauled (as to keep with the generation) and that alone takes a significant amount of time. (Don't say graphics don't matter) After that (and during that development) art style is developed as with the content that will actually be in the game. Everything that is put into Skyrim is remade from scratch. So every quest line, every piece of armor, every weapon, etc. has to be redone. To incorporate everything from the older games and also adding the new things isn't possible within a timely manner. In the business there is a finite amount of time a project can continue before the funds for development are gone. There is a point when they have to say hey we cant add anything else.

Personally there are things I will miss, But the fact is to have a NEW game, things will have to go.

The team had a vision to make a new game with certain features and story lines, Reimplementing old stuff is second to the current ambitions.

I still think Skyrim is going to be a fun game to play, but then again I view it as NEW game that is not Oblivion or Morrowind.

Losing builds=inexcusable.

Well said OP. Well said indeed.

This.
Plus your right every ES doesnt have to be the same as the one before it. Im waiting for TES 6: Trading card game

I agree

I agree with you OP. I am optimistic that skyrim will be my new favorite game. Replacing oblivion

Well said, couldnt agree more or said it better myself.
But will people listen? Sure wont.

Not to mention most of the stuff that was cut that we are complaining about aren't some setting/title specific mechanic. Spellmaking, Unarmed, Jumping and speed variables? Those are fundamental mechanics, not somthing title specific. Nobodies complaining because of the lack of Guar, or Oblivion gates, we want the cornerstone mechanics back. If not, then previous games in the series are superior in these regards.

I can agree with this, but if this is in relation to the athletics/speed/acrobatics, there is the problem of the fact we don't know how those essentially work in the game other than the skills and attributes themselves being removed from the list. Do perks have an influence on these? Is there a perk to increase our jumping height? Is there a perk for increasing running speed? We don't know yet.

Yes but i am not a developer i am a gamer so i only care about game's quality, i couldn't care less about money, time and coding skills.

Although I do agree with you, and I am a self-proclaimed optimist, I do think that people should be able to voice their opinions no matter what. People have all the right in the world to criticize, complain, and even whine when they don't agree with decisions. I think that as optimists, we must allow them to do what they want and not worry about it. We should not chastise them for doing this, nor should they chastise us for being optimists. I`m with you 100%, but they should still be able to have their voices heard and us, ours. My advice, just ignore it and enjoy the game the way you know you will. Why should you worry about how others enjoy the game, worry about how you enjoy the game because that's what's most important.

This is in relation to spell making (a cornerstone of the series) mostly, but unarmed, acrobatics, speed, including anything thats out (non title specific) that we dont know about yet etc. as well.

Love and live in Oblivion. Morrowind (like Fallout 3) is a nice place to visit. Can't wait for Skyrim.

And, I simply can't judge this game until I've played.

Simple as that. :biggrin:

Finally someone gets the idea! Well said OP! :foodndrink:

HTH was one of my favorite skills, right after alteration. Why? Because while all these fools were worried about magic, or armor, or their weapons, I could simply use my two fists and be just as skilled at fighting as them. That apeals to me. It's not even because it's punching, while that is a bonus. It's that against all odds, someone beat another guy whom had full daedric along with a daedric claymore with their fists. From the looks of it, the unarmed fighter would almost always be the underdog yet they can be just as deadly as someone standing head to toe with top level gear. It's that underdog style that I really like.

And now it's not even a skill? Well, forgive me if I'm a little pissed off.

We've been told we can kill with it. Well, that's not enough for me. I want to be able to kill a dragon with my fists after training a long time. I want to get better the more I practice martial arts. Is punching a dragon logical? Is a dragon logical? It annoys me that people draw this line for what is and what isn't acceptable when we're fighting with super natural beasts. Why is hth always held to realism, but it's okay for dragons to be flying around? Why is hth held to realism when we got things like ebony and daedric bows?

And I'm staying in the past because I wanted hth to be improved rather than being all but cut? lol.

Removed from previous games? Everything is still there. Removed from Skyrim? Nah, never there in the first place. Spellmaking is not a fundamental mechanic of Skyrim, never was. The new magic system is the fundamental mechanic. No arena? They didn't want to put it in. youight miss it, but there will surely be plenty of other stuff to do. Athletics and acrobatics? Yeah they were fun, if ridiculous ( and I know the lore means they weren't ridiculous, imo some of the lore is petty bloody daft ). But without them, that map is going to feel a hell of a lot bigger.

This game is made from scratch. If you expect it to contain certain elements of previous games, just because they were in previous games, prepare to be disappointed. Take it for what it is, without reference to other games, much more likely to be happy.

Don''t we have a right to expect these features? Should the features remain the same throughout the series, only added to, never subtracted from? No and no. You have a right not to buy the game, no one is forcing you. And if you only add, never subtract, you get rules creep, feature bloat, things that have to be added to make the new stuff work with the old stuff, which then need things added to make them work with something else, until you are left with a mess.

OP I can see where you're coming from, but I just can't agree with you. The more stuff they don't put in, the less sure I feel about getting the game. It seems to me like I'll be paying money to get less game than I did with the previous installment. And I felt the same way about Oblivion compared to Morrowind, albeit to a somewhat lesser extent. It just feels like I'll have less options for creating a character, and less character creation, although more avatar creation, and I'm not so sure I like the idea. The more I hear about Skyrim, the less enthusiastic I get.

How is that inexcusable it lets you develop youre player to be a more customized version of what you want. BUt thats my opinion and you have yours. And well said Riakon

Well you're the minority, so Bethesda doesn't care.

(Sorry if this comes across as rude, I don't for mean it to)

Yeah, people are totally not complaining about the lack of a group of quests found only one game... :whistling:

Er, what? Losing builds=inexcusable.


...There was an Arena in Morrowind. Therefore its not a title specific mechanic.

This is the most well thought out post I've seen regarding cut content, and why you don't need to complain. If you don't want the game don't
buy it... GENIUS!!

@Riakon

Never tell someone they don't have the right to complain. Someone who can't tolerate complaints is a person who fears change. Now, I agree with you, there is CONSTRUCTIVE criticism (which can be negative, but is conveyed maturely) That is what we want. But we don't want/need "This game svcks (and no reasoning behind it)."

You might think that the removal of something people enjoyed in a previous game is the natural order, but in actuality, one of the reasons why many follow up titles to the original fail is because they took out too many core concepts from the original that helped make the game what it was.

Look at Splinter Cell (and any other Ubisoft title for that matter) In SC:CT, considered by many to be the best of the series, the game was all about stealth and shadows. The game cornered the "Stealth Action" genre. Then with the 4th version, Double Agent, they moved completely away from that. The game failed MISERABLY. Even Conviction, the 5th iteration, that did not move back to Stealth and light/shadow, didn't do as well respectively.

You have to be careful if you take out things that people enjoy. Beth might be doing so though to attract more casual gamers at the sake of upsetting more hardcoe vets of the series.

An ES games only competition is previous ES games, if it doesnt measure up to them, its inferior.

Well, we'll see 11-11-11. To me, none of the ES games are inferior to another. It's not a series, but a collection of games, of which have different styles to them.