Of course, it is not the setting, lore, races, style or anything that makes a game an Elder Scrolls game, it is the acrobatics skill.

Just speaking entirely for myself here, of course, but one thing which I always learn from these discussions is how much it svcks to have rigid and narrow tastes. Instead of taking things on their own terms, I'd just be filled with resentment over how it's not more like that small set of things I do like. Seems like an attitude that's often going to result in disappointment and frustration.

You're standing in front of your refrigerator, trying to decide what you want to eat. You have chicken and a steak. I come by, take both of them, and replace them with a granola bar, a cup of ramen and a banana.

When you complain, I say, "What are you talking about? You only had two things before - now you've got three!"

If that was the case, we'd still be playing top down or side scrolling. And what does make an ES game? Being set on Nirn, check. Gain skill by use, not choice at level up. Check. TES lore, retconned or not. Check. Go where you want non linearity. Check. Freedom of character progression, without restrictive classes. Check. A main plot you can ignore, with loads of content left. Check. It doesn't stop being an Elder Scrolls game because of less armour slots, or all races running the same speed ( however lamentable that may be ).

Granola bar, ramen and a banana are healthier for you :grad:

expect skyrim sounds/looks/and plays NOTHING like Wichter 2.

I can see why people are worried considering that Oblivion threw setting and lore out of the window.

If that was the case, TES series would still be a faction-less, skill-less, lore-less, 2.5D dungeon crawler without a seamless gameworld capable of being traversed by foot.

You mean Morrowind... the one game to lack the romanticized medieval, DnD-based setting of the rest of the series and the one game of the series to signify a complete shift in lore design in the series? Yes, Morrowind was that different. Oblivion did not through lore out the window. On the contrary, Morrowind did more of that. Morrowind completely changed a lot of lore... changed the way races were perceived (or even existed) in the series, changed the way the races looked, changed settings, moved cities on the official TES map, and changed the series so drastically that Daggerfall fans once picked on it with a hatred that makes that of Morrowind fans towards Oblivion look like a chat over tea?

Read before responding. I said in terms of armor costimasation. And yes, I think both have reached the same amount of armor and arms slots(other then rings maybe)
Oh and to the guys who say it is 'lore' and the 'open world' stuff.
Yes, those are all important. But when i think TES I also think costimasation, and most of all UNIQUENESS is that what sets it apart. There is not a game out there which is like TES, which is why streamlining it will hurt it far more then it normaly does.

People on the other side of the fence tend not to listen just as often. More pieces means more ugly armor clipping. "I don't care, customization!" Fewer pieces means slightly faster rendering of each individual character, thus reducing GPU usage on a five-year old console that needs all the help it can get. "I don't care, customization!" Spears would most certainly take longer than a week to implement because, like all the other weapons they've made, they would require multiple attack animations, block animations, hit reaction animations, multiple kill animations for each and every enemy, perks, balancing, crafting, enhancing, pricing, populating loot lists, equipping enemies, creating stock enchanted weapons, etc. "They're lazy!"

And of course we also come across the phenomenon of people not caring so much about visual customization being dismissed as idiots, because obviously only an idiot would want less customization even if it means what's already there looks better. Only an idiot could think the class system was bad. Only an idiot could not miss attributes. Only an idiot could think, "hey, that magic looks pretty damn fun, I would be satisfied without spellcrafting." Only an idiot would not give a flying [censored] about lots of little things so long as the lore and setting are interesting, the combat is fun and challenging, the magic is well-balanced, flashy, and fun to use, there's lots of dungeons to plunder, lots of quests to do, lots of weapons to screw around with, interesting enemies, interesting NPCs to interact with, good stealth, new lockpicking and speech mechanics, etc. and so forth.

Apparently I'm wrong about the major appeal of TES games being exploration above all else, of going into a world that is interesting and beautiful, that draws you in and keeps you coming back and leaves you wanting more. No, it's about pauldrons and greaves and equipping clothing you can't see underneath your armor, and then putting a robe over it all so you can't see any of your armor apart from your boots, pauldrons, and gauntlets, all of which clip through the robe. It's about slapping a label on your character. It's about having separate skills for each and every weapon type so that someone who's a master with an axe but who doesn't use maces much will smack himself in the dike when he tries to pick up a hammer, because it's more "realistic" that way. Only an idiot would think it's silly and tedious to jump all over the place so you can become better at jumping. The list goes on and on, a litany of reasons why I'm a drooling moron who's not a real fan because I don't like what you like and I like what you don't like.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: if being fine with almost every little disappointment that everyone's jumping all over makes me a casual gamer moron, then give me my helmet and put me on the short bus to Casualtown, because the next stop is Skyrim and damn it I want to go there.

My friend's uncle works for Bethesda, he says TES: 6 is a go-kart racing game.

Show of hands. Who has played Fallout 3? Who enjoyed it, even a bit? Plenty of fallout series fans don't like what BGS did with their game. Does that mean they have the right to tell you can't play it, and should **** off and play something else?

Obliv / Skyrim are console games.

MW was a PC game.

That's why there's a big difference in quality / depth.

I like the cut of your jib, G-Rex. I'll sit with you on that bus and dribble all the way with the rest of the slackjawed mental defectives.

You could of course say that Daggerfall is a pc game, and Morrowind was the first TES console game. That would be true as well.

If the old games were better, yes.
I was a little more on the other side of the fence but decided to try out some hardcoe RPG Oblivion in style of surival and such mods, and I can see now how added deph makes it better, not worse. So yea, if they can prove me that the old games were better, I will support them. I do not care about me being correct so I can say 'I was correct' but I just want the better end product and will support what I consider the better view.

I thought we were having a civil discussion in the other thread. Now you're just posting garbage. :confused:

Explain the difference between Daggerfall and Morrowind... and explain how in the world it seems that Oblivion actually has more in common with Arena and Daggerfall than Morrowind does. If "depth" is simply a measure of an extra slot (Yep. My puny console-playing brain can't handle it.) or a measure of skill numbers, sure... whatever... and still explain the Daggerfall to Morrowind jump.

I'm jumping in on that, herp derp.

Agreed completely. I love elder scrolls but this time round they really have seemed to pin down the immersion/exploration of the game. Which for me is above everything else.

You are serious? You shouldn't be allowed to play a game, because it is the opinion of previous fans of a series that the earlier ones are better?

That's not quite the same thing, because Bethesda took an isometric RPG with turn-based combat where player skill does not factor in at all, renowned for its writing and the multitude of ways to solve most any problem into a first-person sandbox action RPG that required you to shoot lots of mutants, with rather poor treatment of existing lore and of course a main quest with writing that is just awful. "But computrons cannot into presidency!" "You're right. I should blow myself up now."

Oh, goodie. They're finally making another IHRA Drag Racing, then?

Morrowind was the first TES on console.

Oblivion and Skyrim were developed for Xbox 360 and then ported to PC. You can tell because the inputs and UI are designed to be navigated with a controller.

Morrowind was developed for PC and then ported to Xbox. You can tell becTHE GAME DISC YOU ARE USING IS DIRTY OR SCRATCHED.