I was wondering, what was Cyrodiil originally intended to be? I've heard that it's a rainforest, is that true? Is there anything else? Was cyrodiil just intended to be this big great rainforest?

http://www.imperial-library.info/pge/cyrodiil.shtml

Cyrodill was also supposed to be an open province, by that I mean there was no native race to it. Imperials didn't even exist until recently.

Can't say I mind, but you're right. It was originally a bunch of elves and proto-humans fighting and subjugating eachother until a Nordic General comes by and kicks some ass.

But yeah, it's supposed to be a tropical rainforest with lots of rain and mosquitoes.

I can live with a temperant climate. What I can't live with is Colovia and Nibenay (the climates were just a part of this split) being turned into a land of middle class enclaves of racial utopia.

Middle-class enclaves of racial utopia?

Leyawin: Argonians vs. Khajit vs. Cyrodils.
Cheydinhal: Dunmer vs. Orcs vs. Cyrodils
Bruma: Tensions between Colovian, Nibeney, and Nordic culture
Imperial City: Decadent nobility in Talos Plaza (including two vampires, a crazy Ayleid, possibly more), Strife between the lower classes and the upper classes (via the Guard and the Thieves Guild), etc.

Sure, communities were hardly homogeneous, but what can you expect after thousands of years of forced imperial integration?

As to the climate, I still insist that you can't have an entire continent (Atmora) freeze over without having some cooling in Tamriel, as well.

http://www.imperial-library.info/obscure_text/many-headed_talos.shtml

And all of it presented with the high-minded complexity and attention to detail as a Desperate Housewives plot. Racial strife=random dialogue rumors? As I recall, an Argonian once made a khajiit joke. That's tamer than the racism in my town's middle school.

Like I said, sometimes it seems like the Shady Acres housing subdivision of Tamriel.

Yeah, and "I came for the parties, and I stayed for the parties" is a truly detailed portrayal of the debaucheries of the Cult of Sanguine.

Oh right...why do Khajiit lick their butts? To get the taste of Khajiit cooking out of their mouths! HAHA, how racist! Dunmer hate Imperials. Whoops, Lord Indarys sits on the throne and Garrus Darelliun helps to get Ulrich Leland into custody. Bruma, Nords are drunken barbarians and Imperials are a pious and studious but anol lot. Whoopee! Strife between middle classes? Hey, let's play Robin Hood. No, let's get the one with the anthropomorphic fox!

Haha...talk about racial tensions!

Eh. Sorry excuse to cover a major retcon in my opinion. I would have prefered the Cyrodiil of the PGE to what we have now.

The racial tension in Leyawiin was so pitiful that it may as well be called a school playground fight. It would be a different matter if brawls actually broke out between the groups, but from what I've seen in those cities it amounts to laughable things like "Khajiit lick their butts!", "Argonians always swim in drinking water!", etc. Dar Jee's joke in particular was so awful for the same reason paw-prints pointed out.

As for Cyrodiil changing from jungle to rainforest, at least there's a retcon on it. I still would have preferred exotic multicultural jungle Cyrodiil. What we got instead was a bland medieval fantasy knockoff where the races mysteriously and inexplicably lose their cultures.

C'mon guys, everybody knows rainforest's and the associated distinct setting doesn't sell quite enough. Despite their diet of cola and coffee, developers need to eat too. :rolleyes:

They couldn't get more into it, or else we'd have non-respawning NPCs killing each other. Besides, its not like the cities in Morrowind had much more visible tension. Just a few of the same remarks from every of whatever race.

Morrowind had slavery, segregation, and more oppressive slurs than a bad joke. It's the difference between telling a rascist joke (which even a half-black person like me can tolerate and laugh at) and straight up calling a black man a n****r. That's the difference from Morrowind and Daggerfall to Oblivion.

I mean the cities, with the exception of Cheydinhall weren't even segregated. Most of Cyrodiil was a great deal less rascist than the United States and Europe today.

May I second that?

Honestly, anyone who would believe differently should be excommunicated.

On that retcon, I appreciate the attempt but that'd require that CHIM and all that crap wasn't BS and that's a bit far-fetched, even by retcon standards. Also, it was recorded as a rainforest after Talo in the cronology anyway, so it's a decent attempt but nothing else.

It was a few generic remarks and three racist thugs. And its not like there isn't race taunting in TES IV. Especially in battle.

I think what he means that there was more to it then just name calling and racist remarks. Morrowind had a real feel to it, the tension and all, unlike Oblivion where things seem real simplistic and almost childlike.

And slavery. And real segregation. It would have been better if people actually reacted to your race though. Their seemed to be quite a bit of rascism in Morrowind, just to other people, never you. The whole idea of the Cammona Tong and the Telvanni and the Sixth House. Unfortunately, the PC seems to immune to this rascism. In Oblivion, there was barely any rascism between NPCs even, "excluding some bad rascist jokes."

I never heard any race taunting in Oblivion's battle. I learned that mudcrabs were tougher than me and that I fight like a pregnant cow, which almost seem like compliments. Especially since mudcrabs seem to hold the rest of the population paralyzed with fear :hehe:

Heh, bring it on, I'll start my own religion, where we all ignore silly retcons like that.....with flap jacks....and hokers!

*Futurerama reference there*

Cyrodiil isn't Morrowind. It doesn't have nearly the degree of racial tension that Morrowind has. Cyrodiil is a much more diverse land and has a much longer record of racial tolerance. Still, no nation is perfectly tolerant.


It wasn't specific, but they'd say stuff like "You elves are all the same" or "You humans are all the same". I could probably go into more detail, but I'm too lazy to search through the CS at the moment.

Are you being obstinate for the sake of argument or are do you actually prefer Oblivion's handling of the issue?

As I said before, Cyrodiil is not Morrowind.

You Elves are all the same: all flab and no fury!~~human to elf

You are a traitor to your race!~~Mythic Dawn member to High Elf

You'll make a nice pair of boots, lizard!~~humanoid to Argonian

There's more, I just can't remember them right now.