What are the Daedric Princes relation to CHIM? In the 36 Lessons of Vivec, Molag Bal taught Vivec CHIM, and in the Trial Azura becomes frightened when she realizes that Vivec has CHIM, which would mean that she has at least basic knowledge about it. Furthermore, the Commentaries on the Mysterium Xarxes mentions CHIM, presumably meaning that Mehrunes Dagon knows about it, as he wrote the Mysterium Xarxes which Mankar merely translated and interpreted. The Psijiic Endeavour, related to CHIM, was based on the teachings of Azura, Boethiah and Mephala. So, this means that plenty of Daedra know 'bout it. I assume Hermaeus Mora knows too, due to his omniscience, and Sheogorath does (Or did, depending on your interpretation of CoC's apotheosis) if you ascribe to the "player characters have CHIM" theory. So, what is the deal with Daedra and CHIM? They seem pretty related to it.

Chaos is not held by barriers, unlike stasis. To see beyond one's holdings is elementary to the children of the padomaic, my dear SL.

Some, if not all, et'ada knows it, but are not obsessed with it as Lorkhan was.

http://www.imperial-library.info/content/vehks-teaching


Lorkhan wanted to go back into first brush but still retain individuality, while it seems that most et'ada are content with what they have.

Rephrase your question and the answer becomes obvious: what does being a Prince have to do with Royalty?

Mind blown.

I'm with SL on this one, (mind-blown,) but I have a (slightly tangential) question: Following the On Boethiah's Summoning Day letters, and the point of the tribunal supplanting their anticipations before their time, does this mean that Vivec, through his actions,may have -prevented- Almalexia and Sotha Sil from achieving CHIM (and thereby becoming the Princes of the next Kalpa?) or that, in their effort to ensure their own existence, he was the only tribune to succeed?

he means that the Daedra (Aedra too) all know about CHIM because they are of CHIM, just like Princes obviously know about royalty, because they are of royalty. The one is the product of the other, in a way. I'm guessing that Azura was afraid of Vivec who knew CHIM because that put them on equal footing.

So what happens when two CHIM guys fight? Is it even possible?

There's a very popular Brad Pitt/Edward Norton movie about just that.

Probably...the Tribune did fight Mehrunes Dagon back in the day, and I'm guessing that he knew CHIM. I have no idea how a battle like that would play out though, but it'd probably look pretty sweet.

Knowing CHIM and having it are two different things. My knowledge of Dagon's relation to CHIM and his actual relation to CHIM are two different things.

If Dagon had CHIM, then he would realize that pure destruction is worthless, because of everything being the Godhead, who would just dream up something new or wake up. Or maybe that's just what he wants. Or maybe I have a major splitting headache. Who can tell?

That headache is Dagon achieving CHIM.

Dagon is the Godhead's suicidal impulses. Godhead should go to therapy when it wakes up.

Molag Bal is his inherent masochistic fetishes.

That could also be said of Boethiah, frankly. Sado-masochistic, specifically.

And Malacath is the Godhead's quiet fetish for excrement and humiliation, of which it is greatly ashamed.

Vivec is the Godhead's transgenderism.

Vivec is the ultimate-and-ultimately-kinky response of the Godhead to the stimulus "Go [NUMINIT] Yourself."

Akatosh is the Godhead's frustration at having to follow all these [censored] schedules, it just wants to go and do things, but no! This is at this time, that is at that time, everything revolves around the clock and it hates that.

Who is Magnus, Zenithar, Jyggalag, Dagoth Ur and Stendarr then?

Magnus the the Godhead mind[vehk]ing himself.

Mephala is the Godhead as a murderer. Kills possibilities and realities!

Herma Mora is the Godhead's wish to [vehk] and get [vehk'd] by a tentacle monster, thus Herma Mora looks like one. Damned fetishes.

Jyggalag is the part of the godhead that thinks: Boy, everything would just be all fine and dandy and orderly if I were to go on that murderous rampage.

And Peryite?

Perhaps, though there are certain limits. Chaos does not tend to zero-sum. It is reliably, even predictably DESTRUCTIVE, and so inherently self-limiting. Unlike stasis, which simply is, and in fact above a certain threshold, tends to be CONSTRUCTIVE, because of WHAT is, and thus may choose to be, and to become, which is contrary to certain popular assumptions about an idle mind, though stasis does not necessarily imply static in as much as it can also be state.

Certainly to see beyond one's holdings in the sense of self-identity is essential to ascend beyond mere occupation and unfocused impulse, being derived and experienced internally, external merely serves as circumstance, for the sake of appearances, or personal taste, perhaps, and a means to the end result of our intent to become something greater, by more than merely multiplying quantity but also, for improving QUALITY of being.

But in the sense of say the ABSENCE of holdings, even of essential, the musings of the greedy man can be more difficult to discern. Why should we be made subject, we may ask ourselves, to such a wanton waste of precious altruism, love, and creativity? Perhaps it is the inverse of the test? Vanity in attachment to entitlement as much as ownership?

Or, divines forbid, perhaps we have come to consider intellectual work alone without some immediate and quantifiable product to be akin to "laziness," in which case we need not blind ourselves with clarity to be lobotomized, for we have already cut out our own heart and soul, as it is absolutely possible for the absence of enough of what is in abundance externally to become exclusive to experience within of essential self-expression and thus, emergence.

Unless one learns to live hypothetically, but then who are we fooling? How can we ever be scientists, and if science is in our nature, how can we ever be sane?


Peryite represents the Godheads latent self-doubt, manifest in the soon-forgotten mortal plane, which was initially populated exclusively by lawyers.

That is an extremely intelligent reply that is rare among these forums.
I'll digest and review it later, but I'm glad to see someone not summarising complex ideas within metaphorical language.
Too common I see followers of Micheal Kirkbride prefer the use of inaudible paved words to create short poetic sentences.

But it is Sithis who instigates both creation and destruction.

How can Stasis be creative? Above a certain threshold of what? "Choice" and "becoming" are both found in the realm of Sithis.