So what do we think of Dagoth Ur as a character and in lore? Is there some "good" to what he desires to do? Does his acts seem at all justified?



Does he truly believe his actions are noble and just, or is he just power hungry?

He shares a lot of Mankar Camoran's qualities, but seems more logical.


This is basically just a character anolysis.

Reference source :v:

http://oblivion.wikia.com/wiki/Dagoth_Ur

I personally feel that Dagoth Ur had noble intentions, but he had to do bad things to try and fulfill those intentions.

Do you personally agree with some of those noble intentions?

Like if you were to live in Morrowind, could you see yourself possibly supporting them?

Such as the reintroduction of a clan/tribal system and elimination of all non-dunmer from Morrowind?

If I was a Dunmer, yes. I can see why a lot of the Dunmer there don't like everyone else being there.

6,000th post. Yay!

You forgot the option that perhaps, he doesn't fit into a specific psychological profile in our world, but indeed may be simply quite mad. Altering himself with arcane tools to achieve a diety like being might have come with some serious damages that even his noble Dunmer sensibilities were not really ready to handle. Like Nerevar, I feel he may have had some noble qualities, but was lacking in the ability to choose those he can trust. Nerevar chose poor persons to trust. Ur, couldn't trust himself, and by his action, now no longer trusts anyone, even those he supposedly wants to help. Freeing the Dunmer from occupation and assimilation...noble. Changing them into abberations that like the Ascended Sleeper? Not so much.

Also, really looking at Dunmer culture, not just from the lore of the books but by speaking to the NPC's as well, you really see that not all Dunmer were homogeneous with regard to their past and culture. The Mabrigash felt like the women suffragists of our time. The Ashlander camps vary from camp to camp, calling each other savage. The Dunmer in the street, some miss the old ways and others think that change was good. Kind of like the difference between the "Rome" that people all of a sudden over romanticize now, mostly due to focusing on the positives and of course the current barrage of altered history movies and television series, and that of the actual, documented history which shows that calling the time after it the "Dark Ages", is almost a "Pot/Kettle/Black" issue.

Perhaps, but he seemed very vivid and had a plot that contained some logical progression. He believed himself to be a god and could be described as being deluded, or having delusions of grandeur, but he definitely wasn't in the deluded state a psychotic person would be in. He even had some reasoning behind that statement. Quite mad indeed, yet I feel my last option attributed the option of madness. Though of course I could of elaborated on it less.

Maybe it altered his mind, but to the state of madness I could describe him having. He is definitely an obsessive character, cooped up in Red Mountain planning his revenge for centuries.

I'll shorten the poll answers if you guys want.

He had noble intentions, he just went insane and went about doing good for the Dunmer race the wrong way.

He wanted to do good and his intentions were good. But he sort of went insane later... All the sleepers and zombs (I know they are not zombs but I think you all understand who I am talking about)... It was going wrong.

He's a pretty classy villain. Not any more deceitful that Vivec and the Tribunal. But, he's certainly past the "misguided" stage and heading toward "uncompromisingly deranged."

At least the Tribunal aren't trying to turn you into mutant zombie slaves against your will.

Although Voryn himself admits to being vain, at the core I believe he had noble intentions. Unfortunately being bound to the Heart altered his perceptions which caused him to not see what corpus and the blight was truly doing to the people that he wanted to free from Imperial occupation. In his mind he really did see that power as a blessing and felt that blessing should be shared.

Yes, he was aware that many were dying from corprus but as he said, there can't be war without bloodshed. He even claims to feel compassion for those who have died.

I'm certainly not saying that he was doing the right thing, but this is NOT your typical video-game villain.

I'd have joined his army. He's just as 'good' as any other bastard that dreams of going around conquering the world, ala Tiber Septim. We don't see him as a bad guy do we, why should Dagoth Ur be.

Yes. Was it the fact that he became a god and for such a long duration that he didn't realise the implications of what his mission had? As Vivec said 'there is no more knowing, only feeling' and that it is hard/he cannot remember being mortal. Could this be the same for Dagoth Ur in that he cannot understand who wouldn't want to be touched with the divine blight and doesn't understand the suffering etc.

Unless you were some relative of his you would just become a deranged corprus beast... Tiber Septim never did that to the people. He brought order, peace and prosperity to everyone.

And Imperialization, which brought about a destruction of important tribal culture and diluted national identity.

Ur had a point. I don't agree with his methods, but his intent wasn't bad.

Clearly Dagoth Ur thought he was doing something good. His intention was to benefit his friends and harm his enemies, and he surely thought that was a good thing. But that by itself isn't very interesting.

I think the issue of Dunmeri xenophobia is important here. Don't forget that the Nerevarine was an outlander. Part of the reason was that Uriel was incredibly shrewd, but another part was that their former isolationist ideology had long since failed to do the Dunmer any good.

Also, Ur's understanding of enlightnement could only result in a loss of freedom for most of his followers.

I take it that part of the anti-imperial leanings of some of these post is due to that ethical atrocities associatied with imperialism in the real world. To some extent that's a valid reproach of the empire in Tamriel. However, the unification of the various races of Tamriel is, from a mythical standpoint, incredibly important. It's kept the man-mer schism in check for quite some time now, for example.

Well, everyone except his enemies, to whom he brought death and subjugation. He was a bit of a meanie with the whole conquering the Redguards thing and feeding prisoners to dragons.

Only the weak or the obstinate became corprus beasts, all others entered the path to enlightenment and empowerment. Sure, you might grow some tentacles from your face, but once everybody has tentacles I imagine it would have become an attractive feature.

Septim was a ruthless conqueror who'd kill even those closest to him if it served the mythic goal. If I remember correctly Dagoth Ur never betrayed or back-stabbed anybody, indeed, he's about the only powerful character in TES who hasn't...

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't his "noble" mission to drive the foreigners out of Morrowind (well, save for the slaves)?

In reality, he can be sympathized with, but I don't really agree with him. My answer, if it was there, is "No, he's too BSI, not because he's power hungry."

He pretty much backstabbed Nerevar if I am right.

"The weak or the obstinate"? How do you know you are not one of those weak and obstinate? Or that your closest friend is one of these weak and obstinate? Or the person who you loves?

And seriously, there were like 15 tentacle-guys in the game. And hundreds of corprus beasts! Thats a big majority there being "weak and obstinate"! You seem to believe that there is only a few thousand guys who deserve to live a real life! The rest are to be slaves to your whims! That is just plain wrong! The weak and obstinate wont even have a chance of improving themselves! They are stuck there as slaves forever!

Tiber Septim was perhaps a ruthless conqueror but what eventually came from his actions was something good. Just because one person never lies or never betrays you doesnt mean he isnt evil.
Also, what proof do you have that Tiber Septim′s battlemage (because I guess that is who you are reffering to) wasnt plotting against Tiber? Or that he was crazy? Perhaps Tiber just used him because he was a powerful wizard?

Think of that.

The link that you gave us showed that ur was following azura's orders and the tribunal were the bad guys.

Vis-versa.

Uh, because I'm freakin' awesome, that's how. Furthermore, since I'm not friends with weak people nor do would my significant other be, I have no worries.

Obstinate in this sense means those who could have power if they wanted it but are too caught up in preserving the status quo... Dagoth Ur brings freedom, but what else can you do with those who insist on being slaves apart from make them your slaves.

Zurin isn't the only one he assassinated. And who says the Empire is good? Those who are ruling it no doubt.

EDIT: Blah, you edited it!

Ha, you must be pretty quick. I only made one edit and it was almost right after I posted.

Ur was clearly doing evil. I think he would agree. That's what makes him so righteous.

I also have absolutely nothing better to do right now...

On topic, I just have problems saying the guy has noble intentions, when it involves removing anyone but natural born Morrowind dunmer. From there, it's turn them into ash beings or crazed tumor monsters.

Now, while I do approve that sending a plague upon people is a good thing, I have issues with HIS blight. Not a fan of ash. It gets everywhere.