So I've been working on a mod for nearly 2 years now and have been quite pleased to keep it only dependent on the Morrowind.esm

However after playing with some scripts that use functions added by Bloodmoon and Tribunal I started wondering why I have avoided using those functions.

For some unknown reason to me I used to prefer mods that were only dependent on Morrowind - but with the advent of MCP and now I have a worthy PC that eats MGE for breakfast it doesn't seem to bother me

I don't know if new players who purchase Morrowind from Steam get a GOTY edition I know its getting harder to get a hard copy of the game - so was interested in finding out if I was alone in being bothered by mods that were dependent on the expansions or if others felt that way and if so is it because they only have the Morrowind disc and not the expansions or for some other reason.

I've put the poll is this section as at least I know the majority of posters here are modders or collectors.

Steam is GOTY, yes.

I voted full support/usage of both expansion (for all questions)
I think it's pretty rare for people not to have GOTY now.

I agree with Pluto. GotY is pretty easy to come by, and well worth the cost. Besides, there are some really good mods that need those extra script functions.

My personal rule of thumb for this is "use what you have to, but only what you have to".

If you need Tribunal/Bloodmoon script functions or resources, then use them. Don't spend weeks trying to find an alternative, just use it. That only applies to things as mainstream and widely accepted as the expansions and some other major things. For tiny mods nobody has heard of before, do look for an alternative before making your mod dependent.

If you might need something from the dependency, or you could need it, or it would make your mod a little fancier, or make your work a little easier, then think twice about introducing an unnecessary dependency. If you find out you need it, then by all means, use it, but don't throw it in from the start just-in-case. This even goes for things like the expansions, but mostly on principle since they are so common.

goty, goty, goty, just do it! it'll be worth it, hardly anyone who isnt still playing morrowind after 8 years still wont have them right?

Yeah people that still play pretty much will have GOTY or can get it easily.

I can't see any reason not to have the GOTY edition. Never mind the extra quests and areas to explore, the fixed and added script functions make it a "must have" in my book. I never run my game without the expansions, ever.



KF

I second that view.

This. Morrowind GOTY is pretty much the standard now. If you really don't need it for the mod it's best to avoid it, but nobody should hold themselves back in their modding project just to avoid dependancy on the expansion packs which most of us already have anyway.

I had a similar question a while back.
The conclusion? Go with GOTY.
If someone doesn't have GOTY at this point, they shouldn't even be downloading mods.

I think you shouldn't really think about the miniscule minority that still use Morrowind only and like to stick with it. The GoTY Version is pretty cheap to get and no one can tell me he can't spend 5-10 $ for the complete Morrowind Experiance...maybe I sound like an [censored], but it's not worth limiting yourself just for a few people who won't buy the expansions.

Keep up your good work :goodjob:

I wouldn't worry about this.
Firstly, my hat would be off to anyone who managed to find a version of the game that wasn't GOTY to buy today.
Secondly, GOTY is so cheap, that I'd say it was worth picking up just to have spare media even if you bought Morrowind but not the expansions all those years ago.

If it has to rely on a mod, or expansion, then i just accept it as a fact it needs to be used, within reason. The GOTY and both official expansions should be considered easily accessible, and everyone should have it. If they don't, well as above, it's pretty easy to get.

In my philosophy, I try to make mods & programs to be as self contained as possible, and relying little as possible on anything else; It simplifies downloading, installation and use. I'd hate to release a program that makes you have to download .NET, cygwin1.dll, zlib1.dll, and a half a dozen other things to get it up and running (like some I've seen), or including those libraries in every upload/update and increasing the size of the download 10,000%, and bogging down the servers with redundant data.

Seeing as I have both expansions, mods which require one or both are no problem for me, and I have many mods which require Tribunal or Bloodmoon or both, and I'm quite fine with this. And by now, most other Morrowind players probably have the expansions too, and for those who don't have either expansion, I'd recommend remedying that as soon as possible, not only do many great mods require them, but they're also worth getting for the new content they add, I would say. Overall, I'd say that if you feel that your mod can benefit from using material from the expansions, whether it's graphical or audio assets or scripting functions, then you shouln't worry too much and just go ahead and use them.

The only kind of dependency in mods that would really bother me is when they require other mods or programs I don't have, like say, if a mod that adds NPCs which requires face and hair models from a separate mod. But if the mod wouldn't alter my game experience in a way I may not desire, I may just go ahead and download the required mod.

I didnt vote as in section two you didnt have a "I use the expansions because I have GOTY, they add loads more content, fix alot of bugs, have more scripting technquies and generally are mods themselves" type option.

At the end of the day, if a mod requires something from bloodmoon or tribunal, no matter how big or small, then theres not alot that can be done and not alot that people should be moaning about.

You'd be hard pressed outside of EBAY to buy just morrowind these days.

GOTY morrowind is pretty cheap and those moaning about mods needing such and such is a complete waste of typing. As a modder I use all avalible resources that I can. You dont like my mod cause it requires BM or TRIB - or both? Then dont download it. I shouldnt have to change my concept of a mod that I made, or the feel or content just because one or two people dont have an expansion.

A quest mod without quest names is an anachronism in 2010. So, at least one of Trib and BM is necessary. Oh, and there is the matter of mods that don't use both Trib and BM creating some mess with GMSTs (although this was MAYBE fixed by the MWCP - I don't know).

As a player who uses GOTY edition, MCP, MGE, MWSE, and hundreds of carefully selected mods, prerequisites don't concern me except for MWE.

As a modder who has worked mostly with scripting and had a limited exposure so far to dialog and other aspects of the CS, I have never thought for a moment that Tribunal/Bloodmoon weren't critical to my work. They provide some much needed scripting fixes as well as some of the more powerful functions. I just couldn't do it without them.

To reiterate what some others have said, Morrowind has been around for a very long time now and is still easily available -- especially through Steam -- so I wouldn't worry too much about requiring TR/BM. That said, if your wish is to remain compatible, you certainly can; it's just that I simply find the benefits too numerous to ignore.

A long time ago, before I had the expansions, it was incredibly disappointing to find a cool mod and discover it's dependencies prevented me from playing it. Not so long ago, I was on a dialup connection and wanted to use a small mod which I d/l and it turned out to require an absolutely enormous .esm from another mod. That was maddening, since with my connection, it would've taken a week to get the other mod.

That said, the community has changed. Those with just Morrowind and those on dial-up are a minority now. I knew I was in the minority when it was me who didn't have the expansions. I'm with peachy; if you need the functions and/or you don't want to have to worry about GMSTs every time you work on your mod, use the expansions. I would even go so far as to say if you need functions from MCP or MPP, use those too. I only ask that it is made perfectly clear in the summary on the release page as well as in the readme which expansions as well as any 3PP are required. In fact, I would prefer it if modders would state explicitly when there are screenshots of the showcase mod that include replacers and items from other mods, but that's just me.

Morrowind has a non-GOTY version??? :blink:

I always thought it came like that.

I think by this point in the game's lifecycle (Morrowind was released 8 years ago!), it's fair to assume people playing the game now have the expansions/GOTY edition. Sadly, despite owning them for all that time, I have yet to go to Tribunal or stay very long in the wintery wonderland. Each time I try to start a game "to play" I end up in the editor. I have beaten the MQ once (hooray for Beowulf, the kindly but dumb Nord warrior). :/

# No, I have MGE, MCP, MWSE and over a 100 mods running, nothing bothers me!

# I always have the expansions selected so it doesn't matter

# It bothers me if they are dependent but don't need to be

# Just relax Illy and get back to working on your mod

I selected the first of these four possibilities but they all could have been my vote. Especially the last one

I chose precisely that myself! ^_^
Just relax, and use what you need.

I'm sure it'll turn out great!
(...and I don't even have any idea what you're working on!)

Mods which require both officials expansions doesn't bother me. 8 years after the original release of The Elder Scrolls III, almost everyone own the GOTY edition of this game, which can be found at very low prices. ; )
Anyway, some years ago, I admit I was really disappointed to see that most of the mods requires one, or both, of these expansions, whereas I had only Morrowind. Also, I had the same problem with many Oblivion, requiring the official Shivering Isles expansion. Searching a compatible mod needed lots of time, frustration and disappointment...
Today, this isn't an issue for almost everyone...

The only thing is that I'm really annoyed by some mods which require an .esm master dependency from an other mod, or mods released in .esm format (preventing to merge many mods into a big simple .esp file, which I always do with all the mods I've installed, without major issues noticed...)... D:

The very second the expansions came out I bought them both. I've only been to Mournhold by accident and Bloodmoon once or twice for side quests. Still I never hesitated, regretted the purchase or second guessed it. Why? Content immediately began coming out that was mind blowingly awesome that required those expansions.

I never understood people who didn't run right out and get the expansions let alone complained about awesome mods that required them. I was marginally more understanding about people concerned with MWE and MWSE when they first came out but only marginally so. I have seen the light that is increased scripting function and I will never go back.

Still I do understand the horror of script driven FPS drops, so keep 'em clean and lean and it's all good :icecream:

Thanks for all the replies - I'll wait until much later before asking about dependencies on Better Bodies

Feeling reassured to go ahead and use the extra scripting functions I added the script Melian wrote for me which uses placeatme and floating variables for SetPos - however I wrote it into my mod without selecting either Tribunal or Bloodmoon (I think I mentioned I use a GOTY version with GMST Vaccine)

When testing I did not select Tribunal and Bloodmoon from the datafiles launcher.

The script worked perfectly - so I realised that because I mod using a GOTY version I don't need to select Tribunal or Bloodmoon for scripting the functions those expansions added - while that's as obvious as anything to some I had always imagined I needed the expansions selected in order to make use of their functionality - sigh - I'm obviously a bit slow at catching on. However I suspect there are a number of mods I have now that say they are dependent on Bloodmoon or Tribunal when in fact they are only dependent on the player using a GOTY version

So I guess when I'm finally ready for release I just need to say that the mod is dependent on a GOTY version or having the expansions selected.

Anyway I'm glad I made this poll as I learnt some more about modding - thanks again to those who voted and replied

edit: Just reread MWSFD on Tribunal and Bloodmoon - which says:


That should proabbly be amended in future editions if ever there are to say:



To me the only reason that is important is that I do a lot of dialogue and only wanted my dialogue dependent on Morrowind and not on Bloodmoon.