As a veteran player you would also know that there was level based magnitude for spells in Arena and Daggerfall. As the magic system has changed substatially from Oblivion to Skyrim it would be nice to have this feature back.

The funny thing is that you are right about some things. Actually, you are too right.

At level 52 on master difficulty, I wouldn't even waste the time it takes to cast a destruction spell because of the terrible cost/benefit of time vs effectiveness. Instead, what works best is waiting for my follower/pet to kill things and either CC or play a defensive game. Using destruction on anything at all is just a waste of time.

It's such a pointless school to have invested points in that it's not even funny. I'm not looking to do insane damage so that I can breeze through everything, but I would at least like the spells to scale with the enemies in the game so that Destruction spells are useful at all.

You obviously don't understand the problem. You take it as a personal attack on Bethesda and their ability to design the game. That is made aparent in the post before the one I quoted. For whatever reason, yo are unable to see that there may be a fault in the system.


I will describe another issue I have.

1. Destruction spells don't scale.
2. There are no upgraded versions of similar spells.

This means that I will never be able to use an effective stream or rune spell again. I found the idea of runes to be fun and enjoyable while I was level 20-35 or so. Then they just became straight useless. So, because of their current system, I will never feel the joy of using a stream or rune spell. This removes a lot of variety that would otherwise be there with scaling.

If you compare destro with enchants against other damage skills with enchants the chasm just widens as there is little that boosts spell damage and masses that boosts weapon damage.

I think he is saying your clueless because you have just ignored everyone’s arguments, repeated the same things over and over again and you think that your opinion must be right, and everyone else’s it wrong.

I mean I understand your points. Using all magic classes would make a stronger mage. But that does not resolve our magic damage. We basically summon powerful beings, get enemies to fight each other, but when we want to jump into the fight and deal some damage ourselves, its a complete joke. The creatures we summon do more damage than we do past lvl 40.

All I think many people want is the "Option" to increase magic power. You don't have to use it on your mage if you don't want to, thats fine. But many people in this topic wants the option.

There are enchantments to reduce mana costs, but I've never seen or heard of destruction damage enchantments. Do you have a source for this?

(there are potions, but that's not really the same as permanent damage buffs on equipment.)

[edited for spelling ]

There are no enchantments that boost magic damage, that is the main reason people are complaining about Destruction.
The only magic related enchants are -% spell cost, +% Magicka, and +% Magicka Regen.

You have pretty much invalidated your entire argument by not even knowing why we think Destruction is underpowered opposed to Melee/Archery.
Melee/Archery get huge damage boosts, Destruction does not outside the pathetic +50% from perks.

dont think it changed that much tbh... mechanics are all pretty much the same when it comes to spell coding...
I can agree that our single target spells could use a bit more damage, hell even overall dmg, but not by much, people saying that destruction damage is weak dont really know how to play a mage that doesnt rely on hand crafting spells to make 1-2 imba synergy nukes.


lvl 50 destruction focused (alteration+restoration backup) pure cloth mage here.
destruction rocks and the only "ignorant fools" are the ones who say destruction is weak simply because they dont know how to use it.

I'd just like to say well done to you, Daemon, Repefe, Skyrah and others for carrying on fighting this corner today - I got up to my neck in the discussion yesterday and started to really lose my sense of humour by the end of the day (luckily I then went home from work and played Skyrim for hours - as a principally melee character - which cheered me up). I completely agree with what you guys are saying, and it's incredibly frustrating to read so many strawman defences and stubborn fallacies.

Hopefully if enough of a fuss is kicked up, Bethesda will officially patch this instead of having to rely on mods.


My sarcasm-o-meter nearly burst

Are you serious? An adventure game should show you what do you right from the start? Shooters should make players godmode right from the start? If you say no, then you know why balance is important...

This is another reason he is clueless. Earlier he acted like there are enchants that increase damage. There is no such thing. He's just flapping his gums about something he has no clue about. He blindly defends the system when he doesn't understand the system.

Yeah, I don't believe they exist either but I hesitated to say so in my reply as perhaps he knows something we do not. Made me chuckle actually as what is being argued as a plus is actually another huge minus to destruction ....no +damage enchants to destro spells.

Edit: So Wagga (or anyone else for that matter) where do you find stuff with any sort of +magic damage to disenchant?

lower difficulty?

Then please tell me how I have to play at say level 40 so that I don't have to cast destruction spells for minutes while running in circles and ruining my stomach with restore magicka potions (or maybe just running in circles if my regeneration is good enough).

I don't need to lower the difficulty. As a mage, all I need to do is not waste my time or mana on anything using destruction spells since the spells are nearly useless. Which is exactly how I play.

The word coupled implies there are only two things; here you have used it four times.

lol thanks. It is frustrating though, we just want the option to increase our magic power yet a lot of people on the forums seem to not want us to have that option. It does not make sense O_O

Anyway you take over, I need to get on with some work lol. and good luck

Urgh. Maybe. It really depends on how ridiculous/misguided/misinformed the responses get. If I get wound up enough, I'm diving straight back in

You missed the point in my post, go reread it and give it a deep thought.
I'm at the point where I can sneak up and kill anything with 30x backstab damage, but it's simply much more fun to fire rune the place up, spam a few spells and clean up if it's necessary.
Also, killing bosses by kiting them with destro spells is much easier than facing them with a weapon.

Those are your two options really though I actually re-rolled bow I guess that means I am chucked out of the mages guild.

What do you do for damage colddog? Summons? or another damage tree mages with 2h ftw lol.

Your point is meaningless if you haven't been level 45+.

Which was my point.

i just hope bethesda makes some changes soon without mods im onli a console player...

I would apreciate a statement from beth on this issue. For now they only just closed the topics cause people started insulting each other (please don't in this thread).

Conjuration is really powerful. I guess your pet scales, heh. Having a solid melee follower is awesome too.

Also having the enemies beat on each other is a good tactic.

There are some cookie-cutter specs, and some which are a bit weaker. As I mentioned earlier, the difficulty slider is there for those weaker specs.

Again, my advice applies to all levels - LOWER THE [censored]IN DIFFICULTY if you cant handle it. That's what you do - if you feel the game is too easy, you turn it up, and the other way around. How hard is that to understand?
And if you really want to compare epeens - I have every skill except heavy armor and two handed maxed/nearly maxed, go figure out the level yourself.

chain spells, such as your wards with your walls and 2handed fireballs (mostly for the stagger and the fire debuff even tho the damage itself isnt bad at all, you can use the expert single target nuke too but no aoe so better to use that on leader rank mob stragglers)
running in circles I'm afraid is part of being a cloth mage, you can always drop alteration and take heavy armor (I'm leveling it now myself)

as for mana thats the key part most people dont get... spells are powerfull but limited by their high cost, spelling doesnt happen on the spells end, but on your ability to fling them, for this you need equipment, invest in -spell cost% gear and enchants, you can easily get about 50% reduction by level 30 if you invest in enchanting perks.
some people made the argument you are pegeon holed into enchanting, I'd have to agree, my early levels of destruction gameplay were appauling cuz of mana untill I got enchanting up.

edit: I just noticed that I rhymed in that first sentenced awesome.


ps: people arguing that you need conjuration to go with destruction dont really get destruction at all... as its the worst possible skill to use with destruction, most destruction spells and the tactics to use them actually require you to have no companions and no summons so that mobs are on you so you can train them into aoe positions, and so you dont blast your summons/companions with your stuff