I have two Glass swords with the One-Handed tree fully perked (100 skill) for swords and dual wielding. Draugr Deathlords go down to a standing power attack or a sprinting one. Level 35. There's nothing to be curious about. Warriors faceroll this game and win. I'm not even in high end gear and nowhere near maximum potential.

there are mods that make destruction scale, and make skill points useful

Yeah I can't understand it then, even with shield bashing and an overpowered daedric mace Deathlords still take a ton of hits on Expert.

No. Power attack damage is proportional to the amount of stamina you have to expend. You're just doing a slower regular attack at 1 point of stam.

That's probably why. A dual wield power attack does a lot more damage than a one handed and even two handed one does.

@Dungeons&Drageons:- You're wrong. This isn't Oblivion. A power attack by default does double damage regardless of how much stamina was spent.

Like I said, even with maxed out 1H, tons of smithing boosts and 1H boosting apparel, my readout for my mace is 124+Frost damage. Do the other bonuses not factor in to what you see under the mace?

I just don't get it. Maybe it's because I've put no points in enchanting but it's not overpowered at all.



But by that logic don't use 2 swords and you won't be killing things fast.

Shield bashing does damage too, and fighting with nonstop power attacks is silly.

Expert level spells aren't bad but the master spells seriously svck, being stuck in place AND doing mediocre damage just doesn't cut it.

You puted 4 One handed buff on you gears ? That's more than +160% damage. You also need to use a smithing set and drink a smithing pot before upgrading your weapon.

What is silly about dropping enemies almost instantly?

A one handed power attack does 2.25x the damage on your read out with perks.

A power attack with a weapon in each hand fully perked does more than 8x the damage on your read out.

If you had one of your Maces in each hand and perked up dual wield a standing power attack would probably deal around 1000 damage.. and you can do it every 5 seconds.

I love mages. I really do. But so far, my main use for Destruction at level 24 is to stunlock an enemy and let my Dremora Lord slaughter it. Not that the lord needs help, but I'm trying to raise my destruction in hopes that I can find a good use for the Master spells. But the Destruction spells, on their own, simply don't compare at all to what my Imperial Legionnaire can do with his Ebony Sword. And his Enchanting and Alchemy svck. He's just got one +15% smithing item. And he has the advantage that it doesn't require a high 1-handed skill to get a better sword (he had a 1-handed skill of 43 when I made the Ebony Sword, and a Heavy Armor skill of 37 when I made the suit of Ebony armor and shield that go with it.)

If those skill levels were for Destruction/Alteration, he'd be limited to Firebolt and Fireball level attacks, and Stoneflesh unperked for defense. That's another weakness of the mages compared to the melees.

its pretty good, When I got some higher level spels and running out of mana so fast. I thought wow what a useless tree. But after getting some decent items to regenerate that mana, I can cast alot more spells now, I like it

Why on earth should you have to sacrifice health or stamina in order to make destruction useful? That's silly... It should allow you to be as powerful as you like, ya know since it's single player...

Just play on Adept and destruction is fine.

Destruction needs to scale with you or something.

The destruction school and the entire magicka system is one dimensional we have few options as mages. Spell creation would bring back our options and power. We would then have the freedom to make our mages as powerful as we allow them to be. Then we could mix effects that suit our characters roleplaying persona's.

It should be up to us how powerful or weak our characters are, however with the current magic system we are limited as spell users. With destruction taking the biggest hit.

Using the illusion fear buff perk and the flame destruction spell fear bonus perk, the two combined ~doubles fire destruction damage IIRC. Just a tip.

Destruction damage does need to scale with level though, couldn't agree more. All the master spells for destruction, illusion and conjuration all svck as well (can't speak for alteration or restoration) the charge is awful, the effect isn't stronger than dual casting expert spells, just pathetic.

Already did that, and like I said it's not overpowered. I can still sit there and repeatedly hit Draugr Deathlords at lvl 50 on Expert like a dozen times.

I agree with this, and it's what's been keeping me from playing Mages. I play Mystic Archers instead, since I can buff my bow damage to ridiculous levels even without the Enchanting+Alchemy loop trick. With it, I have a Legendary Daedric Bow that does 562 damage outside of sneak, thanks to armor enchantments and over-smithing, and that's before quaffing a Fortify Archery potion.

Leaving the 'exploit' portion aside, the bow would still do a lot more damage than a Thunderbolt, and I don't have to expend Stamina to do it. That's without the sneak-attack modifier; with it things only get worse, since even with the Quiet Casting perk Magic attacks don't qualify for that multiplier.

Remember, people complained that they couldn't be godlike in Oblivion and this is what you got. You reap what you sow.

Yes but "exploit" is just a level of power and its up to us to use it or not.

I roleplay how powerful my characters are not everybody is the same some are not as powerful as others, some are alot more powerful than others. These games are based on choice and with the restrictions placed on magic in general cannot give us mages or spellcasters any kind of diversity, in terms of spellcraft. We are also liminted in spell types and combinations with any chance at being unique because spell crafting is gone along with a huge chunk of spells that got axed from this game.

A mystic archer would be a fun build I might have to try that out. :biggrin:

The saving grace of destruction is impact stun lock and fast cast time (faster than bow's attack speed) of something like half a second.

Alchemy is there to help with scaling, but of course that also applies to melee and archers.

With bit of potion chugging destruction isn't all that horrible though. But boring as hell as you end up spamming expert level spells over and over.

why so confrontational about the whole thing? Every post sounds rude from you in this thread.

I'm on master. Personally i don't find Destruction that underpowered and I started as a Bosmer archer.

the lack of scaling in the new hyped spells (spray,cloack,glyph all become useless mid-high level), the horrible master spells (undebatable), lack of legendary/unique mage gear compared to all other archeytpes, and the extreme requirement of enchanting cost reduction (magicka/magicka-regen gear worthless) makes destro very very boring.

but hey if you like powerleveling enchanting to exploit in order to spam1 spell, more power to you. I just wish creation-kit wasn't so far off.

I wasn't one of the folks upset about that, and didn't know what they were complaining about. Now that I have this bow I do know, but still don't understand the complaints because it isn't something you'll have unless you go way beyond the normal limits of the system.

And... this is why I made a mod to level destruction spells.

i would'nt mind the master spells completely redesigned

Firestorm needs instant cast, 1-hand version (half damage), and less magicka cost.

Blizzard, same thing. Increase damage too. both = no friendly fire.