someone in another thread mentioned that at this time in F03 launch there were several times more mods released than their are for new vegas now. some of this might be that something are already incorporated like HTS and weapon mod kits. i think however that the crappy launch did some major damage to the games modding community. people that gave up playing it arent tempted to reinstall it simply cause there are other games to play right now. its kind of sad cause i like this game alot better but they just screwed up the launch big time.

I think having steam annoyed people more then the launch. Forced patching? no ability to select which patch? Those are deal breakers. A few game breaking bugs that are mostly fixed now, not so much an issue.

edit: Lets not forget the exclusive dlc content. Which is kind of a slap in the face.

well for me, I don't even own NV. and am not going to. I feel I had my share with fallout already, but modded for it just today. that and steam... no steam for me. well unless tes5 uses it. then I will cave. I'd put up with a lot for tes5...

currently I am modding for cryengine and moved back to oblivion. < change makes it less boring.

Well I know for a fact that Antistar is working on WMK for New Vegas, and I believe I saw Kai Hohiro post a WIP recently. XFO for New Vegas Is out as well. Conspicuously MIA is MMM, though I had heard that Mart is supposedly going to do something with it after he is done with FO3.

There do seem to be some other mods out there that are missing that were present in FO3, however now that I think about it, some of those just may not quite fit in the Nevada Wasteland, and may need to be reworked or rethought before being released; FWE comes to mind here.

I am hoping to eventually see some of these mods get released sometime, but I really don't think the New Vegas modding community will be what it has been for FO3 or even Oblivion. I'm fairly certain that Skyrim will not suffer this fate though.

As of right now, the FONV:Nexus has 3455 files.

I don't see how the NV launch was disastrous.

The DLC for Fallout 3, now that was disastrous, they were always broken as hell.

I'd suspect a lot of modders are still working on FO3 rather than moving over. It's really not that old a game.

Christmas, and the current Steam sale will move a lot of copies as well, so there might be a burst after Christmas.

I don't see it as a flop at all.

Furthermore I see forcing steam on people, in an age where almost anyone with a computer has at least the OPTION of DSL or broadband (or even sattelite...yech...been there) as a great step toward giving thieves the middle finger.

It also means the latest patches are always available, and regardless of the old 'patch 2 step' we had in other gamesas games, I feel that in a community where 'bugfix' modders are thick as ticks on a hound dog, being 'forced' to use the latest patch is not a game breaker.

Flat out, the FUN I've had playing new vegas so far has FAR AND AWAY TRUMPED any 'inconvenience' they have put me through.

Ehm... Elanthil, hate to point this out, but thieves had it day one, and likely had it quicker than if someone had bought it with steam itself, due to steams servers being bogged down during the last 3 months of the year. They also aren't restricted from patches when the steam servers are delayed, and don't have to deal with the lag and incompatibilities brought on by the Steam DRM. They will also be able to run their game in the case that steam ever shuts down permanently.

Not endorsing piracy, just realism. The fact of the matter is, as long as the data is in the hands of the players at ANY point in time, they will have the ability to pirate a game. There are no ifs, about that. Steam is ridiculously easy to pirate games for, even for games using Steamworks, EVERY DRM IN HISTORY bar 1, has been broken within a month of release. Until we do all our gaming in the cloud, we will be seeing piracy. Even then, WoW, is pirated and has pirate servers up. Aion has been pirated, and has pirate servers up. Pre-CE SWg is being made, via what amounts to piracy and hacking. E&B is being brought back, through piracy. About the only MMO that isn't/won't be pirated is EVE, and that's because of the size and power of the server needed. Hell all of these games, AND theoretical cloud gaming suffer from the fact that accounts can be hacked and stolen.

Again not endorsing piracy, it's just that people need to be realistic, putting steamworks on this game, DIDN'T dissuade pirates. In fact, putting steamworks on it, caused more issues than Steamworks HELPED.

*Steps down from his soap box*

The sale numbers where pretty impressing so it is hardly to call a flop. Never had any problems with the DLCs in FO3 (maybe I was just lucky and I am pretty conservative when it comes to using mods other then my own).

But Steam only brought unnecessary complications for me as modder.

NV starts slower then FO3. Another program in the background and to be forced to use the launcher makes every start to test my mod a new waiting game. Especially when steam thinks my game is unavailable for no reason or their servers are slow as hell which I recognize pretty often. (Btw. Don't say anything about offline mode I know this but steam tries to connect anyway if there is a internet connection).
Steam gave NVSE and FOMM (two essential Tools for modding for me) a hard time to get compatible. So i had to wait pretty long before I could get some serious work done. To use NVSE the unneeded (for a single player game) 'community' feature has to be on. Which leads to new troubles.

4GB patch is not possible for me because of Steams DRM (which had no effect at all at the evil sites) because I need NVSE for modding.

Steams unneeded 'autorepair' of ini files gave me a lot of support work of the body replacer I ported to NV.

So in the end. Yes! Steam plays a big part why there are fewer modders for NV.

I could go over my reasons for what I'm saying about the 'average' 'thief'...which you werent referring to (you are talking about the pros), but it would become a conversation on a forbidden subject, so lets leave it at that

Steam is just another obstacle..a variable..a different perspective of looking at things. I'm sure I'll learn to mod around it, and so will others.

Honestly its easier for me to have steam running than Xfire. Steam doesnt blow up computers like Xfire does, for one thing, and being able to download a newly purchased digital item in the background then play it when F:NV gets tiring is very appealing.

It was disastrous? A few bugs didn't bother me (I never even encountered most of them).

Well not for you, but this has become bothersome with modders having to use steam. Anyway the bugs are overexaggratted i encountered very few aswell.

Fallout 3 modding community never grew as big as Oblivion and Morrowind ones did, and between Steam, exclusive DLC and bugs it easy to see why NV modding community will propably be even smaller.

Are we being trolled, here?

The thing is, the launch of Fallout 3 was actually more disastrous. In Fallout 3, in my first vanilla playthrough, I had a number of game breaking bugs and even more quest breaking ones.

The ones that stick in my memory is the issue where if you tried to get anywhere near the South-Eastern edge of the map (where you needed to go to complete the game), the whole game would lock up. They took weeks to fix that. And another example was the horrible NPC pathing, which is so much better in NV. I remember doing the quest where I had to escort the ex-slaves to the Lincoln memorial, and that quest totally bugged out, resulting in the NPCs endlessly walking back and forth down the same street instead of going to their destination.

And that was with vanilla. By comparison, my New Vegas vanilla experiences have been beautiful. I've experienced bugs, yes, but nowhere near the incredible ball-dropping that happened in Fallout 3. Not even remotely close. If the disastrous launch of New Vegas would've killed modding, then it would've been killing the undead zombie left over by the horrendous launch of Fallout 3.

Yet Fallout 3 was a modding success, and so too is New Vegas. In fact, from what I've seen, it looks like people are more excited about modding NV than they were about FO3 way back when. There's a real positive buzz around this game.

I think that you're forgetting the fact that there was no GECK for Fallout 3 on it's launch day :\

Two month after release FO3 moding was much better than FONV now?
Even without the GECK?

Maybe you are trolling here...

Anyway, a lot of talented modders are still working on FO3, not FONV.
Some will probably not start modding FONV.
But then I guess FONV will see some new talents eventually (esp. considering the sales).
And lastly, for FO3, too, many of the most amazing mods took a while (certainly longer than 2 months).

Let's have a look in half a year and compare again.

People who started modding FO3 are now better modders and will be making larger, more detailed mods that take longer to release- there won't be a flood of early mods because people are taking their time.
Calling NV's launch disastrous seems sort of fox-newsy- it went perfectly fine, the only reason to call it a disaster is if you want people to think it was one.

By this time for FO3, the GECK was only out for a week. It was almost two months after the game came out that the GECK became available. So, I think your premise is false.

I love New Vegas. All in all, it launched way batter than Fallout 3 when it came out. Sure there's Steam and overcoming that hurdle but... in a few years. There might be great sparkle in the modding community like it did for Oblivion, Morrowind, and Fallout 3. Only time will tell. There are already some worth-noting mods for New Vegas Nexus, just gotta find 'em.

~Sonny

:laugh:
This

I'm actually surprised by how many great mods there are already for FNV. I was using a heavily modded FO3, and I can safely say that already I have a set of mods for FNV that pretty much covers all the bases that my FO3 install did.

The key mods that are still works in progress are the increased spawns mod (TheCastle is working an a mod for this, and its shaping up extremely well so far) and an economy overhaul. Otherwise, there are a whole bunch of high quality mods out there that add ammo / weapons, quests and locations, better crafting and cooking, harder difficulty, more perks/traits etc.

FO3 two months after release was nowhere near this good. In fact, i can safely say that I am very unlikely to start playing FO3 again, as I simply like FNV with my current set up far more than I did FO3. And it can only get better from here on out.

Crappy launch? Shirley you can't be serious.

I am serious... and don't call me Shirley.

TalkieToaster has it right, people are taking their time.

The basic argument is incorrect anyway, at this point in the Fo3 launch there were no more mods around than there are now - in fact there are some mods that made it out Much Faster than they did with Fallout 3 (such as DarN's UI).

There is no rush for Fallout lovers, we still have (hopefully) many more DLCs from Vegas to come. Once those are done and considering Bethesda is making TES V next, it will be quite some years before the Next fallout game.

Why rush? Quality over quantity.