Wow, a little picky are we?

What's up with the ridiculously high standards of gamers these days? It must have something to do with the youth in the world...

I guess the older you get, the less you notice these things. Probably those "flaws" that were just pointed out seem less significant with age and understanding.

And by the way, the NPC system is spot-on. It's probably the only part of this game that Bethesda didn't change a thing in relation to the previous Fallout games.

But boy oh boy do people hate that. First folks complain about how different the game is, yet they complain more about the one part of the game that is most similar to the originals.

Would you, as a group, make up your minds?

Picky & ridiculously high standards? I guess so. NPC system is only spot on in your opinion not as certifiable fact. I've been PC gaming since 93 & console gaming since mid eighties but hey what do I know about games. Also are you are implying that it's good to be less discriminating with age? Jeeezz. And here I thought I was providing criticism free from hate and I get hate thrown at me anyway. Ah well. Also I'm not with any "group" I only ever played the demo of Fallout 1. I couldn't tell you much about the lore/world of it or F2 other than what I've recently gleaned. I am judging bethesdas game strictly on it's own (as I did with Morrowind). Maybe this is hard to believe but it's 100% the truth.

The problem my friends, for me, is the character and choices.

Let me extrapolate here. Fallout 2 is a game that I've completed four or five times, each time with a diffrent character that has given me a diffrent experience. From smart and agile good to the same but evil to dumb character that solved everything with big booms and fists, that game gives you plenty of options in how to solve most quests. But the most important bit is not that there are literarily a dozen or so ways to go about the Vault City/Gecko questlines or that there are plenty of small quests to be found and completed if you scour the game in minituae. No, the important bit is that my first character maxed out speech, science and small arms and kept 80% or so in lockpick and unarmed. With that character I felt there were plenty of things I missed out on, I knew there was an elevator in the toxic caves I hadn't repaired, that the doctor in vault city wanted me to do something but that I lacked the Doctor skill required etc. etc. so in order to see everything I had to make another character, which in turn gave a totally diffrent playing experiences and suddenly I realized that this character was not smart enough to discuss the deeper points of the Gecko problem with the people in Vault City and because it lacked science and speech I missed out on plenty of background information. I created a third and tried to merge the two, but it just wasn't possible within the scope of the game without massive powerleveling. I had to make choices on what parts of the game I wanted to explore, because not taking certain skills or perks excluded you from parts of the game. It increased replayability. Not to mention that the diffrent ways of solving quests really did change the game ending, making it fun to see what happened to Broken Hills if I helped the racists guys instead of Marcus for example.

This. ^

It really is true. After I completed the sidequests and mainquest of Fallout 3 I felt like I had already seen everything the game had to offer (a lot of which I'm certainly glad I saw!) and couldn't come up with any decent reasons to play it again even though I was quite intent on doing a few things a bit differently. This is in stark contrast to Fallouts 1 and 2; both of which I've played over and over and over in so many different ways and still I feel like I want to approach it again and try out this way (or that). There isn't a whole lot that's unavailable to your character in Fallout 3 since you can become proficient at just about everything very early on and because of this you are not so challenged when it comes to making a tough decision on how to solve a quest. Hopefully this is something Bethesda can learn from and build upon in the future, as they've already proved they can handle the visuals perfectly.

Once again, what are you people smoking? Don't you notice these same parallels with F3?

I haven't even finished F3, yet I can already tell that the next time I play through the game it's going to be dramatically different than my first playthrough.

But for some reason very few forum goers can find a good reason to play through F3 again. I don't get it...

The bones you have picked with F3 are petty. And with age, pettiness is something that has no place.



And the NPC system being spot on is not merely my opinion, it actually is certifiable fact.

Yep... me too.

Maybe all the raving complainers should be forced to play Tank or Galaga for a solid year without being able to play anything else, and then see what they think...

LOL...

Well I have certain things which I need to have presented in a game such as this for me to suspend my disbelief and these things have not been presented properly so I cannot suspend my disbelief in the game and thus it becomes un-interesting to me. It's not enough to have graphics fill the gap of story, personality, interaction, dialog, etc. NO amount of insane graphics will make "exploration" more palatable to me because what point is exploring if there is nothing interesting/engrossing when you get there (aside from visuals)?

And you can't say the NPC system is spot on as what part are you talking about? I'm talking about the whole package (not relating to graphics) together and how it fails to connect with me.

I was alot more disappointed with fo1, fo2 and tactics...as everyone had said they were so amazing, ive managed to play them for about 2 hours each then thought "[censored] to this"..i dont feel the need to make threads about it

O.K., first, that was unintelligible rubbish. Allow me to reply with some unintelligible rubbish of my own, because this may not make a lot of sense...

Wrong, I can say the NPC system is spot on. You've only played one installment of the Fallout series. You're talking solely about the NPC's in Fallout 3 and you don't like them. You are not talking about the whole package.

You can't say anything more than that about the Fallout NPC system because you played a demo for Fallout 1, and then you played Fallout 3. Huge gap. But let me fill you in, because obviously you didn't get what I was trying to say:

The GUI, the dialog, the interaction. It does all sorts of justice to the previous games in the Fallout series. I'm talking about the whole package here (not relating to graphics).

You can say you don't like Fallout 3 because of the NPC system and that's fine and dandy. But you don't like the truest part of the game. I'm sorry to hear that Fallout 3 is uninteresting to you, really I am. That svcks, dude!

Yep... me too.

Maybe all the raving complainers should be forced to play Tank or Galaga for a solid year without being able to play anything else, and then see what they think...

LOL...

Once again, what are you people smoking? Don't you notice these same parallels with F3?

I haven't even finished F3, yet I can already tell that the next time I play through the game it's going to be dramatically different than my first playthrough.

But for some reason very few forum goers can find a good reason to play through F3 again. I don't get it...

Even if you play in a dramatically different way from your first try, you will not see many new things. There are few quests that are mutually exclusive, depending on your decision, but that is that. These differences are based on you saying "Yes" or No" in a specific situation, NOT on the character you have build. And there are extremely few such quests.

On other hand, so many things F1 and F2 dependent on your character build, not on you saying simply yes or no.

For the record. the only significant mutually exclusive quest is the blowing up of megaton. Some differences in the vampire quest, but that is all.

O.K., first, that was unintelligible rubbish. Allow me to reply with some unintelligible rubbish of my own, because this may not make a lot of sense...

Wrong, I can say the NPC system is spot on. You've only played one installment of the Fallout series. You're talking solely about the NPC's in Fallout 3 and why you don't like them. You are not talking about the whole package.

You can't say anything more than that about the Fallout NPC system because you played a demo for Fallout 1, and then you played Fallout 3. Huge gap. But let me fill you in, because obviously you didn't get what I was trying to say:

The GUI, the dialog, the interaction. It does all sorts of justice to the previous games in the Fallout series. I'm talking about the whole package here (not relating to graphics) and how it succeeds in connecting with people who are familiar with previous Fallout games.

You can say you don't like Fallout 3 because of the NPC system and that's fine and dandy, but you're saying that you don't like the truest part of the game. I'm sorry to hear that Fallout 3 is uninteresting to you, really I am. That svcks, dude!

But your reasons for disliking Fallout 3 are the same reasons for vets to love it.

If you had ever done any exploration in previous Fallout games, you would know why what you are saying is ridiculous. You had no real reason to explore other than random encounters. You just had poor graphics and "cruddy" NPC interaction.

Fallout 3 gives you much more than that.

i agree completely. i tried and tried again and again and again. i must have reinstalled fallout 2 at least 5 times, and i will probably give it a try again someday. its not like the old days where i could sit there and do the turnbased stuff like i did with final fantasy 7 (i cant even stand playing that one anymore and i LOVED that game when it came out). if someone ever makes a mod that eliminates the turnbased combat of the original fallout games they will be my new modding god.

as for fallout 3 its better than oblivion BY FAR, but not as good as morrowind. im actually not as concerned about the game itself as the engine. i played with hundreds and hundreds of mod between morrowind and oblivion and i already have close to 40 mods for fallout 3. my concern is how adaptable the engine is since some things are harder for a modder to do than other things. i like the limited money and limited resources of traders. and if you explore all the areas outside of the main quest you will find tons of thing todo and unlike oblivion alot of them arent cookie cutter ayleid ruins. Gary....Gaaaaary!

I suppose it depends on what you consider to be "new things" I'm still finding intersting things. For example, this is the first time I explored th Chryslis building.

Explore is one thing, new things based on the interaction with NPCs and character build is totally different.

For your example - regardless of how you build your character, or your choices int he game - bad or god karma, the building will always be there for you to explore. You could have gone in on your first try, regardless of how you build your character or how you interact with the NPCs

Now imagine is you can only go in this building only if you had science of 150+, and you can only max 3-4 skills above 100. it wold also require that you had bad karma, for example. In order to see what is inside, you had to have a very specific character build and play style for that character. now this was what F1 and F2 were all about.

Totally different to you, maybe, not to me though. I'd pefer that the quests be more infulenced by stats to improve replayability, so I agree with you to some degree, but there is plenty of stuff to go out and find as well.

The important thing is that you can see almost anything with one character. There is no need to build another. Do not do the final part of the MQ, simply loiter around with your FIRST character and you can see and do everything. No need to start over with a new character.

Unless you want to roleplay something different?

Why role play it differently? All locations are available to you in your first try, all quests are available to you in your first try, all dialog options will be the same in your second try. 90% of the NPC will react the same to you regardless of what you did in the world. You can raise or lower your karma on the go - doneta some caps or clear water and you are a saint, kill someone and you are the devil - loiter a bit then do it again - still on your FIRST character?

there is no need to restart the game with a new character to experience everything in the game. Generally everything is open to you on your first try. One may thing that you will need to build a new character to try new combat styles, but even this is not rue, simply because there are way to many skill points available. You can max your combat skills on your first try and do any combat style you want - simply change them depending on your disposition.

And that is the BIG problem - your first character would be able to do everything - why build another one? the only incentive - try the two sixes - small variations there, but simply not enough.