[Ebou Suso]

http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1516841-discussion-for-workshop-paid-mods-thread-7/

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http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1516784-skyrim-workshop-now-supports-paid-mods/

Copy of FAQ:

[Emmi Coolahan]

http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1516784-skyrim-workshop-now-supports-paid-mods/

Just in case if anyone is interest with these nuances.

[Ludivine Dupuy]

Can we please add a poll so we can actually vote and the community can have a voice in numbers.

[George PUluse]

I think the community already knows who the minority and majority are but hey, it's not a bad idea.

[~Amy~]

Ktbu:

"People who make mods for mass download is not something that I consider work. i consider it a hobby that they enjoy doing for free."

I would consider it work. There are a lot of hobbies that people use as their source of income. Many things that involve creativity start out as a hobby and become someone's job, source of income, how they put food on the table and pay the bills, etc etc. Ie, work.

I think the bigger crime is the 75-25 split. It should be closer to 50-50 imo.

[ZANEY82]

There's something to be said for seeing statistics. I hope it's unbiased, well thought out and simple.

[Dean Brown]

As so requested and so deserved. Feel free to vote to your heart's content on any or all subjects.

[REVLUTIN]

Now I doubt anything like this will happen for skyrim, but what about mod making tools?

Most mods use NifSkope and the Niftool blender plugins in order to make models for skyrim. They actually provide these tools for a number of communities, but the elder scrolls are one of the biggest uses. These tools are created by a small group of dedicated programmers, without which much of the modding we see would be impossible.

What happens in future games with Paid mods though? These modders making their awesome swords and armour are relying on the goodwill of niftools and other mod tools to get things down. Will people start creating paid for modding tools? I doubt Niftools will ever go that route, but with the buggy quality of modding tools that bethesda normally provides (none of which ever includes model exporting tools) what happens? We rely on the goodwill of many people that make the tools we need to mod ES games, how long till someone looks to make money there if they see people making money using their tools?

Paid for modding tools WILL stop new modders from jumping in, they will go to modding communities where they don't need to pay to make things.

[CSar L]

It's actually Valve gets 25-30%, content providers if credited get 1-5%, Bethesda always gets 45% and the modder makes 25%

[Elizabeth Lysons]

You should probably remake that poll.

Either a yes vote, a no vote, or a neutral vote. Also, one vote only, no multiple votes. Remove the irrelevant FO4 vote as it has nothing to do with the topic.

[Crystal Clarke]

The thing is, the FO4 option isn't outlandish. This could be a system made for it which honestly scares the hell out of me.

[Kayla Oatney]

I agree. It needs to be single choice and the question should be reworded. Thank you for putting it up though!

[jodie]

This system is made for it, along with any other game that wishes to add such a system (Witcher 3?). Skyrim is just a testing ground for dark times to come

[Stu Clarke]

There is a third category that befits some referred to in this discussion: "Poorfessional" Yep, ban me for saying it as it also applies to.. well, you know, ... me.

...

Voted neutral. Hard work should be rewarded. But don't care too much for the Steam implementation as is. Wants improvement. A lot.

That's rather generous to Beth. What, are they going to give us the game royalty free or something? Is the Creation Kit worth that much?

[Laura Ellaby]

Guys what does "FO4 conifmed" mean...?

[Lory Da Costa]

Fallout 4

[Thomas LEON]

Ya'll make a mug peachy; tis true. As much as I enjoy this drama and debate I might as well pitch my two cents as well.

I'm with Evil Bastrd on the money split one hundred percent. The main reason a game like this, and the others they've produced or contracted, have only lived this long due to communities thinking its worth wasting time on in the first place. Throwing those people who actually make sales possible three to five years later, in the form of them taking fifty percent and Beth twenty percent would be a nice gesture. Though this is business and not on the local scale where everything is done with a handshake so this is unlikely.

The rest I'm neutral on. Donations are no different than tips in my ball-park. I'll tip a good street musician for brightening my day and a good modification to the game I play to make it more enjoyable. Gotta give me a sales pitch to buy the violin though.

I like multiple options in informal settings as it caters to all folks. What makes everyone peachy makes me peachy. : )

Though the FO4 thing is there for a reason since we got shut down over in our side of the room. We've done predicted the worst possible outcomes already nearing thread 400 or so I believe. : 3

[Nienna garcia]

Was browsing reddit and saw this wall of text

[–] hurricangst
This is going to seem really off-topic, but this paid mod stuff is hitting a serious nerve with my past fanfiction experiences. A couple ofauthors decide to publish their fanficsand get huge. Amazon and publishers et al decide they want a piece ofthis surprisingly massive pie.
So Amazon creates "Amazon Worlds", which was meant to be platform for authors to sell their fanfics. They take a cut, the right-holders take a cut, andthe author takes a (tiny) cut. They're counting on this to get huge, to get a lot more publishers and rights-holders on board (they begin with only a few series), and dominate the niche.
Ultimately, if successful, right-holders would C&D free fan-archives, so as to prevent the creation offanfiction unless it's done via an avenue in which they can profit from it--Amazon Worlds.
The big [censored]-up was the devil in the details. Amazon Worlds is a huge flop. For one, Amazon wants to moderate the content andquality. That means no porm, no bad grammar, no outrageous Alternate Universes, nothing too 'weird'. What they fail to realize is that all those things they see as flawsor liabilities are what make fanfictionso popular in the first place. Look at Fifty Shades ofGrey. It hits every single one ofthose variables. It's porm, it's terrible quality, [censored] grammar, it's an Alternate Universe ofTwilight, andmost ofit is
weird. They keep believing it got popular despite of those flaws, when in reality, it got popular because of them.
Secondly, Amazon blatantly favors itself andthe right-holders. By changing the character names in one of your AUs andselling it yourself, you'd get [censored]tons more money, and you'd actually own all the rights to it.
Unfortunately, the damage is done. With the mass commercialization offanfic(Thanks, EL James!), the community is no longer a friendly collaborative effort of like-minded fans. It's all about marketing andgain and, ironically, ownership. It's greed. It's no longer a fun hobby. It's just yet another tool to spawn tired, over-hyped franchises.
Even if an author never wanted to change the names in their fanficand publish it as original, which is already a huge ethical dilemma, they basically have to in order to protect the work from being commercialized by someone else. It's [censored].
I just notice that fan spaces are being mined more and more, because god forbid we have a subculture offree collaborative creation that fills no one's pockets. They always dress these things up as, "Now the fan-creator gets compensated!" but it's [censored], through and through. They're obviously just preventative efforts to mitigate the success ofa fan-creator while also benefiting from their social leverage and play-creations.


Really people, money screwed up f**king fanfic, and you thought fanfic is the worst?

[Riky Carrasco]

I agree 100% with giving modders money via donations or mod commissions, it could even help with mod projects that require another specialist so maybe even contract work. There are ways to make money off of modding, sure it won't make you a lifestyle but it'll be some spending money, but a paywall? That's just a big fat no as you have to trust that the mod won't ruin your game or end up not being to what you want it to be or what conflicts it has with other mods. If the paid mod thing became bigger and bigger it would be harder to detect conflicts and share assets as evidence with the Sims modding community which took a big fall into toxicity and people quick to hitting report buttons because a mod did something similar to their mod.

This is the death of a community, a community that should be built on trust, knowledge and expansion. Not how much money can I make for posting a half-assed mod that could end up not getting finished.

[matt]

It's funny, a few days ago I was feeling very sad because I thought the community I held so dear was dying. Clearly, this is not the case. The community I know and love is all over the internet fighting, banding together, huddling a little maybe. It's beautiful. Sure, the community is changing. My part in it may be over, that's up to Bethesda. Still saddens me greatly that these changes have happened, and I'll never be the same, but the fight gives me heart. I am glad I was here to witness this.

(And, since there's a poll now, and incase someone hasn't read all bajillion threads, I support modders. I do not support modding being turned into a money pie for entities that did not do the modding.)

[Ashley Clifft]

Yeah I suspected as much. But what does "conifmed" mean?

[naana]

I will say this, when http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Muggy is the voice of reason, something went very, very wrong.

[Ysabelle]

And he knows it! Why? Because he was programmed to know that!

[Flash]

Confirmed? Just a random quess

[Robert DeLarosa]

You can blandish as much as you want. You can protect the affected modders as much as you want. You can still think this whole thing has no negative effect on the community...but all of you are then completely wrong, and the truth will fall on you in the forseeable future. What bothers me most, is how a lot of recently 'payroaled' modders, which on top of it are also pillars of this community, have waved the flag of integrity all so high year after year, and now completely abandoned any sincerity whatsoever. I'm not even surprised, as I probably had a repartee with any of them and knew that their moral standards are all but high. On the other side, I do understand their notion of being payed for 'work', even though they completely fail to see the very definition of work and the conceptual difference between business and hobby. Beth and Valve also did everything right.They've created a win/win situation for themselfs and the modders. Being compensated for effort is a good thing after all. But there's so many factors to why the whole concept of charging money is wrong, that you simply can't bystand and act like the do-gooders want you to. It's the same situation as every other hot-headed serious discussion about copyright, concept of art, free share, state of ownership or any other related theme. The pillars of this community had and have power simply due to their presence, long affiliation aka post count, and superior attitude, and they were and are not ashamed of utilizing it. Anyone who was in doubt before what I said in the past about the elitist nature of parts of this community, specially here on this forums, should have now be torned down their blinkers.

Also, the whole Chesko situation is not worth anything. He brought that situation on himself, and the main reason why users/modders are now bashing him is amplified by pulling everything that's paywalled, showing a lack of backspine. If I as a advlt person make a decision, I stand by it, no matter how much others insist it's wrong. I followed his statement and arguments, and they're valid and well thought (as everything he ever posted), but I always imagined the pillars would never fall for something like this. Agreeing to keep quiet what was going on in the background was the biggest [censored]-move I'm afraid. Nothing good ever came from intransparent decisions/ideas/concepts on top of millions of affected users, and in this situation modders.This got even more explosive force, because Beth has picked the most prominent of modders and not considering so many others. Does success equal the quality and effort of work? No. If so humanity would have never characterized words like unfair and unjust.

However, seeing how the 'leaders' of this community turned modding into a business I don't feel like anylonger acting like a preacher. I'm totally giving into this by adding myself to the business strategy because I feel this community doesn't deserve any better. I, as a single modder, am entirely sure I invested so much more effort on any of my projects then those having a team behind their back, that I fail to see why I should wave high the flag of integrity now. I want your money, and I want it now! My daughter will have her benefit of this situation. Three days ago was the day that modding died. This becomes specially true because Beth was one of the last big companies that openly supported modding without gaining any financial profit from it, and I've never even remotely thought they'd let themselfs down to something like this. And I'm not talking about how people should be compensated for their efforts, but how they together implemented this terrible idea, which will have a 100% destructive effect on this modding community and the relationship between modders, users and developers/publishers per se for the whole gaming industrie. Never I believed Beth would agree to Zenimax decision, to dive into payroaled modifications.

The numbers of already purchased Mods speak a clear and loud language...the community wants this (or at least the fail to see why it's wrong, and probably are to underaged to even figure). It will grow in size like a cancer and everyone will adapt to it. We will all produce quality Mods for conceptual business and don't give a d about the consequences. It will divide the chaff from wheat and turn the Beth modding community into a even stronger elitist unit. From the point of view of the supporters of this business idea everything sounds valid, and who am I to question their notions? Behold...the future will reveal everything that I propose...modding in the form we know it will be buried.

Let Modding how we knew it die! Adapt to the new situation! It won't disappear anyways!