I don't think anyone seems to think that. Zelda for instance is one well-known adventure game with (somewhat) stimulating puzzles. Just because people want the puzzles that ARE in the game to be good and challenging doesn't mean we want the game to become a puzzle game.

I hope they are more challenging than Zelda puzzles. This is a game more geared toward advlts right? we should have tougher ones than Zelda (which is geared towards like ages 10 and up)

There should be a mix of course. Puzzles required for main quest should be accessible without too much troubles. Not everyone likes spending time resolving a puzzle.

It'd be fun to see dungeons with very hard puzzles for the uniqueness.

I like the idea of difficult puzzles, it can add a level of depth to a game. It shouldn't however, be something that can stop progression, unless you are missing something that gives clues to the answer.

I like an Indiana Jones feel to a game, sort of like what the Uncharted series adds to games (not the treasure hunting, faux archaeology crap). The idea of a journal where you have to piece information together can give that feeling of accomplishment.

If the key to a puzzles lies behind an apple which lies in a basket which is hidden under a table in another room.. that's the wrong kind of difficulty.

Any other than that, bring it on!

Same, except I ended up going with "rather smart." I love puzzles and would want them to make you really think about it, but they shouldn't be so hard that they take up a huge focus in the game, or even take too much time. With things like puzzles, it can be hard to strike a good balance, since there can be a big difference in puzzle-skills amongst the general audience. Maybe have an option to set the difficulty of puzzles?

I voted very tough, but I can understand you want to pick the very accomplished option. I really love puzzles in a game, it adds a really nice flavor to the gameplay. If anything, I think that they should have "feel accomplished" puzzles and a few "really tough" ones

Heh, I soooo belong to that group then!

Give me a moment to put it into graphical terms and it's just like a game I've played frequently called Sherlock.

As for whether or not there should be critical thinking, sure. Making people think every now and then is never a bad thing.

If you do it, don't post your answer on the thread. that might ruin it for someone.

I know the answer if you want to check if you are right without seeing the correct answer (if you want to try again). So PM me if you want to do that.

LOL, I did one or 2 of those every week starting in the 3rd grade. I suppose probably hundreds over the years. Those don't fit in TES, I don't think. That's a kid level genius puzzle, right there. Lucky for me, I am a genius, so they're easy.

If you'd like to see some good ones, check out the MENSA website.

As for how hard Skyrim's hardest puzzles should be....I think none should be harder than the hardest ones from AC2 and ACB (Assassins Creed).

I'm not even a genius... and yet I do find them easy peasy :shrug:

if they are too tough for you or you are someone who hates puzzles then just look up a guide on the internet is how I take my stance on it. I think it should be included and they should be challenging. People who don't feel that way should just use walkthroughs or guides.

Hence the LOL.....but.....cool story bro :goodjob:

All of us on this forum are obviously not the typical average gamer. We all want things to be specific to the lore, and to challenge us. But game companies don't just want to please their faithful, but also those who have never played one of their games before.
More people buying = more sales = more money

I'm sure they'll have some hard puzzles, but the majority of them will probably be fairly basic. Place this object here and door opens.

But personally, I would love to see hard puzzles for them all, but the realistically I know this wont happen.

The puzzles should definitely involve some level of critical thinking behind them. Having games enrich a persons life is integral to it's evolution as an art, but I'm sure it'll cater to the lowest common denominator, and still take tons of heat for "dees sooper hard puzels man i no ever by anoser betesthda game 4ever" on the forums.

Umm, mind-melting puzzle stuff only when there's a way to circumvent it, please. This is an RPG, not an adventure game. And while I really, really love the latter, I just don't want my RPGs to turn into them.

In an Adventure, the dialog options you take determine whether you achieve your goal, or whether you fail. In an RPG, the dialog options determine what kind of character you are, and how the game should react to that kind of character. While an Adventure usually only has one correct way of solving a "dialogue puzzle", cutscenes in RPGs should always "succeed" in one way or the other.
The same goes for puzzles. If you have a puzzle before you in an Adventure, then you have to solve it, because that's just how you play those games. But solving a puzzle as a fighter doesn't characterize you in any way in an RPG. It doesn't make your character more clever - that's what you Intelligence stat is for (well, not in Skyrim, but you get the point). Instead, the characterization would be that solving the puzzle increased your Intelligence attribute by one, because that's how you roleplayed your character. But if you don't want to roleplay him that way, then there has to be another option.

In conclusion, (difficult) puzzles are okay if they unlock secrets, if they're part of some kind of Puzzle Guild storyline (a guild where you're actually signing up because you know you'll get some interesting puzzles there - that's the good thing about TES and its guild system), or if there's another way to do it. But they should never ever be necessary to complete a story that doesn't focus on puzzle solving.

Just imagine if that package for Caius Cosades was actually all the info you're ever given about the Nerevarine prophecy, and the game tells you "well, you read the orders, now go do your duty".

I think they should make me think, but not very hard. This is not the kind of game where I want to get stuck just because I can't solve a [censored] puzzle.

I'm quite smart (Not all the time though,lol) so I wouldn't mind them taking some figuring out,though I don't want it to get in the way of the M.Q,I hated in Tomb Raider geting stuck on a puzzle because I wasn't viewing things in a certien way,or not in the right mindset,sometimes I plain don't want to think and just axe something...

And good luck doing puzzles after having a few drinks....

Unless it's a "you have to push that one rock that looks like any other rock in other dungeons except you can press it here" puzzle, I don't mind...

I agree that that "einstien puzzle" is pretty easy and rudimentary if you use a paper and pencil(like i said in my post, i solved it when i was a kid). I just remembered how it said only 2% of the pop could solve it (which is bogus).

But i think some kind of mystery type puzzle like that could fit into TES. It would require some thinking.

Those Tests on Mensa were basic IQ tests. I took the "Mensa Workout" and I got 28 out of 30 on it, and no paper or pencil needed. The "7 D of the W" type-Mensa-test i found on a mirror website i got 27 out of 32. And i didn't even have breakfast today. I was in Gifted (meaning advanced not "special") when i was in grade school though. That barely means anything IMO however, because i knew some dumb people in Gifted. apparently I had to of received above a 130 on some standardized IQ test, but my parents never told me or my brothers my exact score (who all 3 were ALSO in gifted), so i guess I'll never know if I'm a genius or not...

A genius has to be like 160-200 if people had to get above a 130 to be in gifted. I know I'm no genius as well as most of the other people that were in there.

My point is, I would like something like that Einstein-Test-puzzle (if put into a different context, like a murder mystery) more than lame IQ-type-"which shape comes next"-puzzles.

More like


Meh, don't count on those "standardized" IQ tests much. My official results fluctuate wildly between the 110s up to approaching 150s (from my days at high schools up to just last year). Seriously it's how much motivation and clear sense of purpose that you got in you which really counts for anything (which is exactly what I'm lacking, lol).




Back to the original topic at hand:

Agreed, but it would be even better to have a way to get around the puzzle for the more-brawn-than-brainpowah type of characters, like get out and make a trip to the nearest scholarly type of guild, and persuade/hire one of the members to help you solving the puzzle. The challenge here is instead is to escort this fellow safely to the spot and back home, while enemies from the depths of the dungeon regroups for an ambush! Not to mention the risk that this particular helper might actually plotting to back stabs you and went off with the reward on their own. That's just an example that I can think of at the moment.

And there should be at least one Dwemeri puzzle that involves some crazy-ass calculus riddle to whet the appetites of our math-obsessed friends!

I want a nice scale for the puzzle difficulty, if you solve and extremely tough puzzle you actually get something extremely good out of it, not 12 coin ergh!

There is. It's called the internet or playthroughs.

I chose other, because difficulty of puzzles, kind of vary depending on the person. We need some examples of puzzles and their appropriate difficulty.

Puzzles can be clever, but fairly easy, and they can be stupid, but extremely hard.

I really do not know if I would call some of those things challenges. Sometimes those puzzles were hard due to lack of graphics or just zero directions in where and what to do. That is not what I like or want......make it as challenging as braid and some of the Portal puzzles and I am good.

I don't want to be wondering around a dungeon for hours jamming on a button just to find that exact spot to place something or have directions so vague that you would most likely never guess or figure it out unless you look online.

Don't get me wrong King's Quest were awesome games but sometimes the puzzles were more vague and non-descript than challenging.