Yep, because I don't see any reactionaries in here. Nope, no sireee. Not a one in sight on the entire forum or internet. All clear on the front and squared away. :angel:

I'm pretty sure that's the whole point of the phrase - pretend the customer is always right even when he's wrong, otherwise he'll stop being a customer.

Sometimes that's a good thing

Trust me, I was stuck in customer service for a while.

ok, I just finished reading through the thread and the articles on this (there are a lot of them <_<) and I have only one thing to ask

why shouldn't EA/Bioware be able to block someone from playing the game if they behave like idiots on the official forums? They are providing a service and they are well within their rights to deny someone that service.

I like Mr.Crabs' saying better:
"The money is always right!"

You don't do stupid PR crap like this and come out the other side with more customers or money. It just reinforces my creed to attempt to purchase as few EA games as possible.


Because those are two separate services. I don't lose my ability to ride city trains if I violate enough traffic laws in my car that my license is revoked.

And as far as I'm concerned, most software is a product, not a service. And this comes from a programmer. Of course, EA, having linked almost all of their games to their online services, CAN effectively deny you playing their games, because the only way to play those games is to log in using that service, much like Steam. Its a very craft way to get away from that disconnect between software being a tangible product that can not be denied use and a software platform being a service that can be denied use.

Steam bans your account completely if you issue a charge-back with your credit card, I assume if you purchase a game with an illegally obtained credit card they do something similar, but I'm not sure. IIRC when a credit card company is dealing with fraud they issue charge-backs to all the fraudulent purchases, therefore if you buy a game with a stolen credit card and it is detected your account will be banned.

Sufficiently extensive incompetence/stupidity is indistinguishable from malice.


The nature of the transaction with EA/Bioware is thus: person gives EA/Bioware money in exchange for the ability to play the game. EA/Bioware then take away the ability to play the game but want to keep the money. I don't think so. Around here we tend to call that either theft or fraud, and most sensible people have no interest in doing business with thieves and fraudsters.

If someone purchases WoW, behaves like an idiot in-game and gets banned 1 hour after he bought the game, does he deserve a refund?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZ3AOmZ2fps

Subjectivity + Power = .......

Ah, but you are comparing 2 different things. If I get Banned at McDonalds, does this mean I can't go to Burger King then? How about you get banned from the Bethesda forums, but now you can't play Skyrim, even though you pre ordered it?

Misbeahing on WoW is a reason to be banned on WoW. But to be Banned on WoW because you misbehaved on a forum, which you did or did not do without a though investigation is an entirely different matter.

That doesn't make any sense at all.

If he violates the rules on the Bioware/EA forums using the same account he uses in-game, why shouldn't the forum ban also affect the game?

In the connection of account names or persons? The account names being the same causing this problem was an oversight plus a human error(who should apologize) as they admitted and they are fixing it. Otherwise it shouldn't affect the game.

Yes. Move out the timescale a bit further and we can talk about some gray areas (where does what the upfront cost bought taper off and get replaced by what the monthly fees are buying). On such a short timescale, though, there really isn't much to debate.

This is a real pain in the ass if your like my good friend, who doesnt have theinternet at home. He had to wait for the library to open and then drive over to it, wait in line, then finally get to register. It is quite BS. I remember once upon a time games were for fun.

Fortunately there are still plenty of games that are good fun and don't require you to jump through a bunch of hoops just to be able to use them. It's just necessary to be a little more discerning in one's purchasing habits.

They have a duty to provide the game to everyone in an MMO. Needs of the many before the few, more so if he's a [censored] that does something bad enough to get banned in one hour.

The problem is that you're using an example of a multiplayer game (where someone's bad behavior CAN effect others), but we're talking about getting banned from a game like Dragon Age, a totally single player experience, based off of the way someone acted on a forum. One does should not affect the other. So perhaps the guy was a dike on a forum, but should a person lose the right to play a totally single player game because of it? No. They shouldn't, and even EA agrees, considering it was an oversight in the first place.

You do what Rift is doing with it's security mess right now: You apologize, ensure people that everything is being done to make accounts more secure in the future, ensure that those who are hacked are #1 priority, and offer tips on computer security, even when the fault isn't necessarily theirs (nobody knows where the problem is right now). You don't lash back out a the customers complaining on the forums or threatening to quit. That's poor PR.

You have to be tactful and respectful even if people aren't being tactful or respectful to you. That's what, the #1 rule in customer service?

Completely agreed :nod:.


That may be what it's getting at, but its still wrong. What you do is *politely and tactfully* tell them that they are wrong and why. Examples for the right way to do things: "Actually, it would work better if...", "I'm sorry, but there's a four cup limit at this event, you'll have to ring a friend over to the bar itself", "We are very sorry for anyone affected this bug. We are doing our best to find its source and resolve the issue. Out apologies for the earlier response, the person responsible was misinformed at the time, but has now been corrected, and we will endeavour to ensure all employees are up to date with accurate information."...

If you're giving them advice on, say, what computer hardware to buy, you can then let them do things their way if they won't listen to you (and hope they've learned something by the time they come whining back to you). If you're telling them you're not allowed to serve them a drink now (or whatever) because of various laws, you then point to the piece of paper on the wall and say, "Look, if you don't believe me, read the liquor licence".

E.G. anyone who pull out the "I'm a lawyer!" card when you're doing stuff based on, and clearly following, relevant laws :rolleyes:.


EDIT: When your company has a infamous history of screwing players around, and one of your people has given people reason to believe you're doing yet again, you shouldn't be taking a jab at them in your apology. Its fine to point out that your guys work hard to keep things in hand, but you can do that without scolding anyone. A frigging corporation should have a thicker hide than that, and people who are paid money to handle public relations should know better than to include, in an apology, stuff that could piss people off again.

Maybe the phrase should be changed to the customer is always deserving to be treated with the utmost courtesy. That's always been more accurate. This Fernando guy needs to learn that.

A big WOW and even Lucifer wouldn't do something like this.

Yes, that's why I don't take issue with people getting banned from MMOs- the rights of the other people playing the game must be balanced against the rights of the person who gets banned. However, what I do take issue with is that idea that a company can terminate a purchased service without returning the money that was tendered in exchange for that service. If an MMO decides to ban a person I believe they should have to return the most recent month fee, prorated for the time remaining in the month. And if the ban is issued shortly after the software was purchased, rendering the software unfit for purpose before it could start being argued that a reasonable time had passed that the initial charge had covered, then I believe that the cost of the software should be refunded too. Companies should be able to terminate various service agreements with customers, but when they do so they should also have to refund the money that was paid for the service (prorated for time of service already rendered).

It should also be noted that contrary to an MMO example where the rights of other players must be balanced against the rights of the person banned, there is no such balance that must be struck in the case of access to a single-player game. In the case of a single-player game there is thus no reasonably cause to even ban a person in the first place, aside from what I can only describe as petty vindictiveness (which I think is what also accounts for the people who try to defend these kinds of actions).

I agree 100%. *bites tongue to keep from making snide remarks about people agreeing with EA's policies concerning this*

I'm agreeing with people in the thread, but everyone blew this way out of proportion. They got back to him quick and unbanned him from his games and apologized for the inconvenience. Mistakes happen, I'm not going to get a waitress fired if she makes ONE tiny little mistake. I'm not going to fire an entire team of construction workers if they forget one little thing (though they do have to fix it). Hahahaha this is like the web equivalent of 9/11. As for my post I thought he was trying to use MMO's as an example, so just ignore it. Your preaching about understanding, but it isn't going both ways. This was literally a mix up, and it was fixed. I'm not defending EA anymore then anyone else. I'm just trying to calm people down before they make even more mistakes. But if everyone wants to freak out for every little mistake then feel free. Next time you see someone in real life make one [censored] mistake, and if you truly believe in being this harsh get them fired. Or give them a complete blast, totally [censored] ruin their day to the best of your ability. Let's see how advanced the world becomes.

Edit
No doubt I have spelling errors in this very post. There's your first shot. May as well take it.

What kills me, is that all these companies, EA, 2K, Bethesda etc etc, spend all this money on people who don't buy thier games, and treat people who do buy thier games like they were the criminal.

If they are so worried about people who don't buy thier game instead of carring of people who do buy thier game, why do they even bother? Maybe it's time Bethesda, 2K EA etc etc, stop making games.

I for one am sick and tired of priced increasing because of "piracy". I believe it's time, to eithr svck it up, or stop and get out of the buissness. Yes I know what I said makes no sense or or is stupid, but
I am sick and tired of running through hoops when I pay money for a game to play it. If I am able to pay money for a product I shouldn't be felt like I am burden to you.

Again, make purchasing a game worth while. Put in paper manuals. Give us those nice maps we use to get along time ago. Funny how companies say it's too expensive to make paper maps or cloth
maps or what ever trinkets extras we use to get in the game, but will spend 1000's or even 100 000s of dollars for DRM which just angers your paying customers.

If companies are so worried about pirated non sales, Make the Game Worth the Purchase while the pirated version is less fun. You don't upset the pirates, all you do is upset your paying customers.