I sure don't and I don't think it's ok to say that new people who are coming to play Skyrim are having it made stupid for them. They're going to be intelligent people who are capable of handling anything the devs can throw at them...and we don't know what that is yet since no one has played it yet. The journalists who have played it...I never saw an article by them saying the game was for stupid people now. It's changing and I'm open to what they're doing with it. That's all.

:tes:

I like how you're complaining about it being simplified without even playing it. So you automatically know that the dungeons are short and shallow instead of miles deep? Or that the combat isn't solid and the enemies difficult? sorry, didn't realize the demo was even out

i haven't seen info on markers being permanent ,can quest marker be disabled ?
if not wouldn't that make clairvoyance worthless !

If you could 'rest' for a week or so that would be better. Still, any amount of rest is better than just magically being healed while you stand. Also gameplay does trump realism, when the gameplay changes actually IMPROVE gameplay. A slow unexplained heal does not help gameplay, the only possibility is to make gameplay super easy and less meaningful.



You are misconstruing the issue. Any time the quest giver said "meet this guy in Balmora" you could go and then ask people in Balmora about the person and they'd tell you where they were. In Oblivion it was pointless to tell you the name of the place because they didn't give you directions to get there and there was a huge glowing triangle on top of the place anyway.



How are detect X spells more dumbed down? They did not only show you quest specific items and they didn't draw a line on the ground to where they were. The spells were more akin to a map marker that showed you every entity that matches the objectives general description (thus more complicated).

I like how you're not even reading the poll or OP. Never did I say dungeons would be short and shallow nor did I say that enemies would be fragile. Read before you comment

1st health regen was in past games (waiting), Skyrims "health regen" won't be a Call of wipe blood out of eye to stay alive, the regen will be so slow that it won't affect you in a dungeon or short trip to another town... so calm the [censored] down!

no, i don't feel the game is dumbing down, it more making the game less punishing to those how pick the wrong classes (happy the classes are gone)... bla bla bla... and thats why I think Skyrim won't be Fable 3

Health regen is in EVERY RPG. It's called potions. I'm talking about automatic health regen: health regen that is automatic and requires no input from the player. To me it is a mechanic for people who can't be helped to heal themselves so the game heals them like a baby so they don't get hurt too much. Regardless, I never said that was my major issue. If it is slow enough it won't be a huge problem for gameplay, just a problem for immersion/roleplaying.

Having played TES games since Arena in 1994, and the rest of them as they were released, I have enjoyed each game, watching the changes and technical improvements.

Although TES is a series, I view each game as its own entity, and regard them as such.

I believe the devs truly are improving their games with each iteration.

Some fear, or dislike change, or perhaps a some feel a favored feature was not repeated in a newer game.

I sympathize with your perceived loss.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I hope those opinions are made wisely, rather than emotionally.

However, I regard the term "dumbed-down" with disdain.

I prefer "refinement."

Perhaps I am rare, but, I welcome the changes that have been made for Skyrim.

I believe Skyrim will have much more for me to do than any previous game.

Reflecting on the older games, and noting the overall new presentation, for myself, Skyrim looks to be the best TES game to date.

I anxiously await for 11-11-11. My new drinking horn and supply of mead will be on-hand.

Can I go out with you?

I did read the OP, you asked whether Skyrim was being dumbed down and then just forced your opinion. Ok, so far all we really know about Skyrim is about character development, and nothing of the world. So the game is all about the character? The game is just one big character customizer and skill placer with no adventure? If the game was just a dress up game, sure, then what we know would make it dumbed down. But ES is more about adventure and exploration. Since we know nothing from the in-game world, I don't think you're being very fair.

And to the "find x spell" comment, I think minimaps are more dumbed down compared to a compass, why need to open up a map when you can just see everything from a bird's eye view? that's alright, but mystical healing out of nowhere isn't? I think we can all see where your bias is.

You might not have read all of the OP because you seem to misinterpret the thread. I like a bunch of the additions/changes, even some that are on the poll. I put options on the poll that SOME might find to be oversimplification, not ones that I think are oversimplification. This is a community directed topic, not a personal topic. I do not look on Skyrim with anguish or lament for what could have been, I am merely pointing out and allowing others to point out issues with the game that hinder some people's enjoyment to some degree. I don't necessarily want such changes to be removed per se, but at least allow enough options for different fans to enjoy.

Oh, you know what, never mind anything I said, I thought you were just one of the "hardcoe quickscope clutch switch" players trying to nitpick Skyrim, disregard my arguments

The "Publisher's Code":

"Complexity leads to niche sales, nice but not fulfilling.
Simplicity creates a mass appeal, with many more copies selling."

Except if you read the OP you'd realize that I didn't SAY anything about the in-game world except the likely fact that just like Oblivion NPCs will not give enough directions for you to not use the quest marker. I didn't say ANYTHING else about the world. I assume it's going to get beautiful, cultured, and interesting. You're arguing with some imaginary person.

I didn't say that a minimap was good or that it didn't hurt immersion more or less than healing. You're really pulling this stuff from down south aren't you? You have a minimap for quest markers too so your argument really holds no water and I really have no clue why you threw it out.

That's fine. I had hoped to head off such negative responses by fully explaining everything in the OP. Like I said, I fully expect to buy the game and get hundreds of hours of enjoyment out of it. This thread is for constructive criticism of some issues that a good portion of the fanbase feels detracts from the game. Not to say that they RUIN the game like the person I quoted in OP and subsequently said that I did not agree with fully. I'm VERY excited about most of the changes in Skyrim (perks, culture, style, UI, more towns/quests, animations, graphics, combat, etc. etc.) and am cautiously optimistic about such changes as removing attributes in lieu of the 3 pronged meters and removing greaves in favor of a more in depth armor customization/crafting system. I fully agree with magnetism, loss of classes, and the skills that were removed. I do not find spellmaking to be a huge loss. My only real issues are the quest marker and being inundated with 'essential' characters (especially ones that aren't essential). Auto-heal is more of a minor gripe about immersion/roleplaying as long as it's slow.

Anyway, feel free to continue discussion.

Skyrim appears to be "dumbed down" compared to its predecessors. Yes, it has many wonderful qualities, including perks, (which are, indeed, entertaining), and a list of immersion augmenting things, (radiant story, living, breathing towns...et cetera), but it has many negatives such as the loss of attributes, (no defining statistics generally means my character is an amorphous gray blob; is he smart? Strong? How do we tell anymore?), this automagical health regeneration also bugs me, at least with rest I could imagine I was bandaging my wounds or casting a healing spell. The compass, the markers, (a moot point seeing as they are, indeed, optional), the simplified armor, (so that everything matches better...sigh), and the loss of skills and spellmaking...it all aggravates me...it appears that everything is being done in order to cater to a crowd of "people" with the combined intelligence of a boulder. Of course, it may just be the anger and sorrow blinding me, but I see this game as becoming simplified to the point it practically plays itself. :banghead:

This is stupid. The guy in the quote in the OP is gonna buy Skyrim. He just wants attention.

Can you also tell me what Tuesday's winning lotto numbers are? Unless of course your future-telling skill is a sham...

Yeah, the only real problem I have with ingame is the auto heal, but I looked at the E3 and Quake demos, the auto heal is only outside of combat. Hopefully they made some changes, and the healing takes longer over a like a real time hour.

Also, word of advice, the quote you used just makes it seem like your post is meant to be hostile, regardless of whether it was intended to be. At least, that's what I went off by and was mistaken.

C'mon, who sits around on a Skyrim forum, unless they are gonna get the game? what are they going to do? play morrowind until their parents kick them out of the basemant?

The moment it hits 11/11/11, no complaining will come to a screeching halt, because everyone will be to busy shoving swords into everything that breathes.

Boredom breeds stupidity on here. All these people sitting around doing nothing are gonna just pick apart the (minimal ) information we have until their fingers bleed.

I doubt that auto-heal will make a huge gameplay change. At the moment it'll just be a small roleplaying/immersion issue.

I recognize the quote may be misconstrued. I posted it because in the thread it was in many people quoted it agreeing so I felt that that comment was felt by a portion of the community. I went out of my way to say that I did not fully agree with it directly after quoting it. Thanx for the advice though

Interesting poll, and interesting results so far...

My personnal opinion: I do think it will be "dumbed down" (streamlined, modernized, whatever the hardcoe fans want to call it) quite a lot. And although I was quite excited with Skyrim a few months ago and 100% sure to buy it asap, I now think I'll wait at least a few months before looking into it closely: To let the hype go down and check some users reviews, and to figure out what the modders will be able to do with this game. For now, it seems to me like Skyrim will be some sort of action-game, with RPG elements over it, in an open-world environment. Many f the things from Morrowind and/or Oblivion that were not directly combat-oriented have been removed (Mysticism, levitation, extensive (text-based) conversations, that kind of things), so are several things important for character-customisation (attributes, weapon skills, armor types, armor pieces, detailed/combined spells...); on the other hand, most of the things that have been advertised so far are about fighting, or changes to gameplay that sound like a hack-and-slash. I hope I'm wrong, but right now it sounds like we'll have a fighting game with a few spells as side-weapons in "epic" linear quests - in an open world.

About the poll - I'm surprised that "weapon magnetism" doesn't seem to annoy much people, even less than the loss of classes for example. I don't care for either personnally (Just hope the "magnetism" will be subtle, possibly skill-dependant?), but I would have thought people would react negatively to such a concept, like with the health-regeneration idea.

I never really had a problem with the exploration in oblivion even though the big red quest marker was on through most of the game.I just saw an intresting looking place and when't there. :shrug:

I was kinda confused by how many people cited loss of classes as an issue but that might have to do with me lumping that in with birth signs. In retrospect I should have separated them because I think the loss of classes is GREAT but the loss of birth signs svcks

"Gonna get the game" is one thing. WHEN is the other. It wouldn't be the first TES game I grabbed from the bargain bin. It also wouldn't be the first TES game I was glad to have waited for until it appeared there.