That's assuming Hammerfell doesn't help and assuming an Independent Skyrim doesn't form an alliance with the Empire and Hammerfell.

There still wasn't a chance. You think the Empire was going to risk letting Rebels, who have been disturbing the peace for years, go just to have to fight them again later? ME and many others expected that.

The funny part about this, is that people actually think a sparse rebel army will be able to stand up to the Thalmor alone.

Maybe I missed a post but I don't see anyone suggesting that. I see mention of alliances.

And armies grow during warprep. They'd get more support fighting the Thalmor.

I dont think anyone believes the stormcloaks alone can defeat the thalmor. But i believe they can defend themself in their own homeland (skyrim). I believe they can drive out the thalmor at least

When the armies come to Skyrims doorstep, the rebels are screwed.

Lets not forget the Thalmor want an independent Skyrim.

From ColonelKillaBee. And The thalmor want an independent skyrim? source?

The “Skyrim cannot survive alone”-argument

This one is one of the simpler arguments to debunk, because any high school dropout can look at the map and see how silly this argument is. Here. http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/918987149705159097/C22C10AE7A645DE484D4521251914E3138836D83/&imgrefurl=http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id%3D91249786&h=1202&w=1861&sz=93&tbnid=nBGo07R-Omi71M:&tbnh=90&tbnw=139&zoom=1&usg=__7BIkCEpKVKwWqHJ0jtswf0XmBMU=&docid=Tpko8a8T0KYY3M&sa=X&ei=l3tIUd2vEIyy8AT6zYGwCQ&ved=0CDUQ9QEwAA&dur=1510

Lets look at the two ways a military force can invade a territory. The first possibility is by Land. If the Thalmor were to attempt this, they'd need to go through either Morrowind (not allies of the Thalmor, and never have been, plus Argonians occupy part of it and are fighting the Dark Elves) or Hammerfell (obviously hostile to the Dominion) or through Cyrodiil. Now many say that there's the solution. The Thalmor have a treaty with the Empire, and they are allowed through Cyrodiil and Skyrim. Two things. One, the Justiciars are allowed, and two, whole armies are clearly not. How do I know this? Tullius himself says at the Empire is currently guarding it's border to watch for an attack from the Dominion. Think about that for a sec. If the Thalmor were allowed to walts in whenever they wanted, why the hell is the Empire wasting their time guarding their borders? It makes no sense. Clearly the deal of the Thalmor in their territory extends solely to Justiciars for hunting down "heretics" not their whole army.

Now look at Skyrim's natural barriers. Mountains. The worst kind. You cannot sustain an flow of troops and supplies through a mountain range. Not easily anyway. Couple that with the intense weather, and you have a complete supply chain disaster. Now, the Thalmor, assuming they actually did get through Cyrodiil in whatever fashion still would have trouble getting through even if they used the Pale Pass, due to it's treacherous reputation. Here's an example of how it caused trouble for Tullius during the Stormcloak rebellion:

^{http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pale_Pass#cite_note-4} In http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Fourth_Era#4E_201, the Pale Pass was closed due to avalanches, preventing Imperial reinforcements from helping to secure Falkreath Hold under Imperial control during the http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Stormcloak_Rebellion.^{http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pale_Pass#cite_note-5http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Pale_Pass#cite_note-6}

In short, a land invasion is highly unlikely in the current situation. I didn't even talk about the obvious disadvantage of fighting in a cold climate that the Thalmor are not at all used to fighting in (their homeland is SUMMERSET ISLE for Talos's sake) against a people who are literally magically resistant to cold weather and magic.

Now lets look at what the Thalmor are actually good at. Naval invasion. The Thalmor are known to have the most advanced and powerful naval force in Tamriel. But even the most advanced naval ships cannot successfully invade without a safe port nearby to house reinforcements and supplies to sustain the attack. See how far away Summerset Isle is? It would be comically impractical to invade Skyrim from this far away, whether that be by land or sea. Even our real life history proves this fact to be true. The Thalmor can't set one on the coast of Skyrim to the North because one, they'd be under constant attack, and two, the Sea of Ghosts is as the name suggests extremely treacherous. They don't have any islands nearby to do this either. The only possibility they have is to anger the Dark Elves as well, and take one of those islands that are literally on the opposite side of Tamriel from Summerset Isle. Then they'd be fighting two nearby nations at the same time, and this time one of them is magically adept, and are as tough as the Nords are. So without a true safe port, this invasion tactic is even more unlikely to succeed.

This is why I personally laugh at those who say "without the Empire in Skyrim, the Stormcloaks are doomed." The Nords could literally sit back and gulp down some Black-Briar mead while the land does the fighting for them.

Ha, you beat me to it.

"A Stormcloak victory is to be avoided"

So the Thalmor want an Independent Skyrim by not having an Independent Skyrim occur.

Your headcannon does not disprove anything. You can't use hypotheticals to 100% determine the outcome of an event.

Everything you wrote is based on the assumption that the Thalmor will do a direct run to Skyrim when it is instead far more likely they'll conquer Morrowind, Cyrodil, and Hammerfell first. What then, hmm? They'd have direct routes into Skyrim, they'd be able to gather and army and funnel in supplies from the conquered provinces.

And even then, Skyrims landscape is also its downfall. All of the cities are incredibly far from one another, any resident army would be spread thin. The Thalmor could storm Riften and capture it long before a force could arrive to defend it.

Cultural differences are also important, the Altmer are far more advanced than the Stormcloaks, not to mention that the Stormcloak army is woefully lacking in the magic department.

That isn't headcanon. Me thinks you need to read that again.

And I don't think they can take any of those provinces without someone else getting involved. Especially not Hammerfell and Cyrodiil. Taking Morrowind is also very unlikely due to logistics. Hammerfell fended them off once already. Skyrim wouldn't let Cyrodiil go for that very reason. Alliances would be formed and the Thalmor would be doomed.

And their advanceness didnt help them in the great war. They also dont have great numbers as mer.

It is you using hypotheticals to discount something.

That doesn't work.

You said the Thalmor can't invade Skyrim by land because of their relations with Morrowind, well, what happens if they take Morrowind? What if the Sea of Ghosts doesn't stop them?

The land is the only advantage the Nords of Skyrim have, what happens if that advantage isn't enough?

Skyrim would likely help and prevent that because of that reason. And what if the Thalmor pop out a nuke? What if what if what if.

So your "What ifs" are definite solutions to the Thalmor threat, but mine are hypotheticals.

What if the Sea of ghosts stops them? Well what if it doesn't?

I'm sorry, but if Skyrims only defense to the Thalmor threat is assumptions that the land will stop them then you're going to need better reasons.

I'm arguing that it would be. You might as well say what if the thalmor all sprout wings and fly into Skyrim. It would make zero sense if it wasn't. Saying "what if" to everything isn't a good argument.

People can't fly.

"What if a radioactive spider bit them and allowed them to?"

What if the Thalmor wise up and leave Skyrim alone and just want to counquer the Empire, meaning that their goal of destroying humanity is only a ruse to keep people from realizing that they want control and not destruction?

The entire premise of your argument is the presumption that Skyrims landscape will stop the Thalmor armies. Surely you can see why this is faulty?

Trust me, we want to break free from this prison that is Mundus. Bring on destruction.

Difference is I'm not saying what if. I'm saying right now with the current situation being the way it is, and the Thalmor having no land near Skyrim, they CAN'T take it due to all the factors I listed. Saying what if isn't doing anything for you unless you can give me an example how they can overcome the obstacles. The only way they can possibly take Skyrim is if they take some place else, which is unlikely. Alliances against them would likely form now that they know what the Thalmor can do.

No, not really actually. Countries with less advantages than that have defeated armies due to land and logistics alone.

according to the words of the Altmer. Does not mean they are telling the truth...

That's great, the difference being of course that this isn't real life and you're dealing with a race that has mastery over magical forces.

Did the Landscape save the First Nations people of America from European settlers?

I won't bring up RL examples,but it saved others. Many others. Landscape makes a HUGE difference in war. And the Thalmor dont have any magic that can deal with logistics issues like that, not unless they can teleport whole armies. They have to take someplace else first, plain and simple.

Don't join either side.