Recently, I've been really getting into Daggerfall. B) The thing that really impresses me about it is the randomly-generated content -- the quests, map, npcs, etc. I've been wondering -- would a more recent RPG with Daggerfall-style randomly-generated content be possible? I mean, I know that TES V will probably go the Morrowind and Oblivion route by hand-crafting a beautiful and immersive world with unbelievable attention to detail and top-notch photorealistic graphics -- which, of course, isn't bad, but I'd really like to see a Daggerfall-style open-world RPG in full 3D. Can't you smell the awesomeness just thinking about it?

Would a game like this be possible to create? Do you think that any developer would be willing to take the financial risk of trying such a project? Would it be a good idea to use for TES V? Discuss!

Why would you want randomly generated content? That lacks..artistic touch, if you get my drift. Not to mention it would lack character that the devs give quest/npcs/regions/maps etc.
And no, there's no way that TES:V would ever do randomly generated content, because they know that the fans want them to hand craft everything and make it just right. You just can't get that feeling from randomly generated content.

I think this is a great idea. Some major quest related places should be hand placed though. If they made Daggerfall more than 10 years ago, the random generation tool they use today would undoubtly be better.

If you're just talking about landscape, then I agree with the guys above me and say no to that. However randomly generated quests like Daggerfall's would be great. Unfortunately voice acting has all but nailed that coffin....

Unless you receive written orders for random quests? Something along the lines of "Here's your next assignment" *receive envelope containing details about person to kill/treasure to retrieve/ingredients to gather etc.*

I think randomly generated content as an addition to a primarily hand-crafted game would be great. The odd randomized dungeon with randomized quests would give the game a bit of a release valve without risking any real threat of feeling generic overall.

However I'll admit while I enjoy Daggerfall I find the pre-generated randomized content to quickly becoming boring. Every now and then something clicks just right and it's really cool but most of the time one dungeon/town feels too much like the rest of the dungeons/towns. Modern graphics aren't going to change that so it's not something I'm interested in seeing revisited.

Possible? Sure. Random generation has come a long way since Daggerfall. The shape of the land in Oblivion was generated by a computer; humans put trees and rocks and towns and such on top of that, but it would hardly be a stretch of the imagination to think a computer could do that too.

To some extent it would be good but then again doing some generic quest that basically is the same [censored] different smell would kinda loose the whole purpose to an RPG game whereby every action has somewhat of an impact. What impact would generic random questing have? In the end its like going and listening to the night mother every week, it Just gets boring and you always move onto something else.

Try Mount and Blade, if you haven't.

Then imagine a game with an engine like Mount and Blade's, set somewhere in Tamriel, with dungeons and factions and a main quest.

I think they could make a modern game very similar to Daggerfall with Mount and Blade's engine. And add to it real-time border wars and castle sieges if they wanted to.

Normally I think it's an awesome idea, it increases re-playability by not always having the same exact quests all in a row. However, it seems like random generation had maybe already been used in some of the caves or ruins in Oblivion, and they seemed rather bland. I think problems like that can be solved by introducing more variables, but it needs careful thought.

NOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Arena and Daggerfall are fun, but mind-numbingly repetitive and boring.

So, if they make a game like it, just don't play it.

You don't have to buy every game Bethesda makes. They can cater to more than one taste of game if they please.

Don't see why you have to constantly imply that your taste of video games is the standard that all Bethesda games should exclusively follow.

This thread isn't even saying TES V should be like this. It's just suggesting that Bethesda should consider making an RPG like this, if plausible.

I also don't see how you can call a game fun and boring at the same time. I'm starting to see a pattern of constant passive aggressive insults towards all games that are not Oblivion and their fans, refusal to admit any of its faults, and at the same time, constant preaching that all the Elder Scrolls games are equally good. I'm confused.

It's a fun game with boringly reptitive content. Also, yes, I do have to buy every Bethesda game. If the next game I want from them is delayed by another 2-3 years, than I have to see what the product that did that's responsible is. Daggerfall's content gets boringly repetitive. What's not to understand about it? I like Morrowind and Oblivion's content, I hate Daggerfall's. It mostly seems the same.

Don't start with that last part. I never said they were all equally good. I said Morrowind and Oblivion are my two favorite games of all time but that I only find the first two fun, not great.

I'm actually interested in your response as well, because it's true.

Seti, you and Hams have gotta stop arguing. Take it to PMs if your going to be that immature, because this thread doesn't deserve to be closed because of a petty argument. Anyways, I think some random generated content would be okay, like maybe some random quests and such edit:grammar mistakes

Randomly generated towns and dungeons? I don't like it. I wouldn't mind if it's a place we'll never see again, like an Oblivion gate for example. bliviongate:

And this. Especially guild quests.

EDIT: Preferably at higher ranks or the highest one where the only benefit we get is acknowledgment from others

I agree about the guild quests. I would like to see all the hand-crafted locations/quests of the last two games, but with randomly-generated quests thrown in. Guilds/larger factions should have an unlimited supply of work, in my opinion. I would like to see all randomly-generated quests up to a certain rank. At that rank, I would like to have a higher-up in the guild contact you about bigger problems, which would be the hand-crafted, story-driven questline of the guild. After that point, and after the completion of the questline, unlimited randomly-generated quests would still be available. The only faction I think Bethesda got the right idea with in the last two games was the Arena despite the lack of a story, but more variety in something such as that, perhaps even with the occasional humanoid challenging you for your title, would be nice.

Hi, the forums resident crazy tech dude here

Plausible? Yes
Today? No

Procedurally [randomly] generated stuff is getting more and more attention as a way for game developers/Hollywood effect wizards to do more stuff without hiring more people/spending more money. So it's definitely being developed. That dream city [Limbo] in Inception was mostly "procedurally" generated. There have been tech demos, "hey look what we did!" types of things in recent years, and only somewhat useful tools just starting to be available.

So, is it possible, even plausible that say the Elderscrolls 6 could in some way use stuff like this? Certainly, in fact Oblivion and Fallout 3 used some of these tools to help build there massive terrains. But we aren't likely to see something that can produce stuff that's actually interesting to play and can be generated "on the fly" for a few years yet.

I would probably be okay with randomly generated terrain, flora, and side quests. However, I feel that towns, cities, NPCs, dungeons, and quest storylines all need to be crafted by hand.

And I seem to see the same thing happen with mw fans,anyway we will just get banned if we continue this.

You're thinking waaaaaay too far.

Random generated content as proposed could be something simple, with dungeons created ala Diablo (or Hellgate, more relevantly), using already existing tilesets to throw something together. Quest can function in the same way, like they already did in Daggerfall. You have the basic quest types, you just have to fill in the blanks. With a couple of types and a few dozen basic variations this can last you a looooong time if thrown in with the handcrafted stuff, especially after having finished the main guild questlines. Just you at a certain rank being able to do jobs without being pressured into a promotion (steal this, protect that), or getting high profile jobs after making it all the way to the top.

In the same way, development time could be cut down by quite a lot by mixing in random elements in between handcrafted ones. Rather than have almost every dungeon and every square inch of the map have a purpose for a quest or two, have a few areas that are there purely to look pretty, to prolong travel times (and thus gameplay), and a few random dungeons in between the handcrafted ones for random bandit hideouts, monster dens and all. This also enables the artists to do a single epic dungeon where they would otherwise be stuck on having to do 5 or 10 smaller dungeons - Same with quests and landscapes. Since the landscape at least is fixed, that can be touched up after it's generated. It's of course a little of a gamble that you won't get really stupid dungeons and quests, but with some proper QA you can make sure the algorithms work properly.

Briefly: Your first point applies to you as well. Nobody said anything about TES V except you. AND IT'S FUNNY BECAUSE YOU CONSTANTLY IMPLY THAT YOUR TASTE IN VIDEO GAMES IS THE STANDARD THAT ALL BETHESDA GAMES SHOULD EXCLUSIVELY FOLLOW.

I'd prefer random content built on top of hand placed content.

No, I constantly imply that they should develop two separate series, one with an action-RPG genre and one in the more traditional RPG genre. That way everyone has something to make them happy. As opposed to try and compromise with one hybrid game that leaves most of the older fans wanting.

In fact, that's what I'm constantly repeating. And due to the fact that I repeat it so much, I was wondering if the people who always seem to get hostile towards me actually read what I write or just see that I like Morrowind and assume I'm some sort of video game supremacist. This case doesn't confirm it, but it's some evidence.

P.S. Heil Morrowind!

JMDF2.

Meaning: yes for random content. At least, give me some huge dungeons, areas of land, and sidequests, which are never the same when I replay the game. Have hand placed item spots, but randomly switch the items/artifacts for each play, also leaving lots of empty places. I hated how TES3 only felt new on the first playthrough, and after that you always knew where which item is.

Since most of the dungeons in Oblivion were generic anyway. Random generation would help developers spend more time on the system rather than making dungeons.